i dont no what it is double barrel oldie

[nitestocker]

hay i hope some one can help me i got this double barrel side by side one barrel is 10.7m the outhersays 16c inside a diamond there is a circle on the bottom of each barrel with the letters E L G with a crown on top of the circle on the barrel that has a 16 c there is a 17.0m as well there is some marks that lok like a fancy L this rifle / shot gun has exposed hammers and was ingraved thanks for any help would like to no the maker year and if its valuable if its not my nabor wants me to reblue it thanks again.

 

[SDC]

What you have described is a Belgian-made side by side 16 gauge shotgun; the "ELG" and "L"s are typical Belgian marks and the "16C" shows that this shotgun was built with choked barrels and chambered for 16 gauge shells. No, it's not considered valuable, and if you're considering shooting it, I'd have it checked out by a gunsmith first, to make sure of the chamber length and barrel material/strength.

 

[rcmodel]

if its not my nabor wants me to re-blue it thanks again

You can't hot-blue a double-gun, if that's what you are thinking of doing.
The hot-blue chemicals will dissolve the solder joints.

Rust blue will work, or cold blue if you are really hard up for some semblance of a blue job.

rcmodel

 

[rcmodel]

if the one barrel is a 16 what is the other its a lot smaller

It would seem you are looking at the muzzles.

Pretty sure both barrels would be 16 Ga., but one barrel is choked more then the other one.

Probably Full choke on one, and Modified or something on the other one. That makes one muzzle look smaller then the other one, if you have calibrated eyeball's!

The E over LG & Crown indicates the gun was proof-tested with Black-Powder only.

I would advise against shooting modern shotgun shells in it.

rcmodel

 

[Owen]

10.5 is .416, is it not? He may have a drilling. nitestocker, could you take a photo of the muzzles?

 

[Cosmoline]

I'm with Owen. That may be more than your usual cheapo Belgian SXS 16 ga.

 

[Jim Watson]

1. Crown-ELG means made in Belgium after 1893, black powder proof test.
2. 16 C in a diamond means 16 gauge made between 1898 and 1924, black powder proof.
3. A "fancy L" means the barrel was tested rough before the gun was finished, 1924 and after.
Combination of 2 and 3 might mean the gun was made in 1924 when the marking systems overlapped. Unless the "fancy L" is really a fancy EL which was used earlier.
4. 17 is the bore diameter of a 16 gauge in millimeters.

Now it gets interesting.
If the other barrel is WAY smaller... like 10.7mm and if it is really rifled; that makes it a Cape Gun, combination rifle and shotgun. Is the small barrel rifled? Does the gun have rifle type sights?

Now, it is only a black powder gun, the 16 gauge chamber is shorter than modern 2 3/4" and heaven only knows what rifle round might shoot through a barrel that the proof house gauged at 10.7mm. There are several different European 10 to 11 mm cartridges to consider. A gunsmith could do a chamber cast and figure out which it was. Ammunition would not be available, it would be an expert expensive handloading project.

GOOD pictures would help a lot. Phone pictures won't do, it needs a high megapixel camera with a closeup setting.

 

[gmhamilton3]

Several years ago I inherited a L.C. Smith DB in 12 gauge. My grandfather had bought the gun sometime after WWI and my father had used it growing up in the 30's. He said it shot well the last time he used it but that was in the 40's. I posted the serial number on a website and was told it was made in 1906. Took it to a gunsmith in Houston to see if it was safe to shoot and he said either hang it on your wall or sell it to a BBQ restuarant where they could hang it on their wall. Sounds like you have the same options.

 

[Mal H]

I have just deleted a bunch of posts in this thread. If yours is missing, then you know it wasn't very helpful concerning the question asked. Let's keep it civil, please!

 

[nitestocker]

the small barrel is rifled .the top of the barrels towards where you chamber the gun looks like it had a set of rear sights. but there missing there is a square notch about a half inch square there. on the rifle barrel there is a k an there is a r with a star above it there is a funny looking i with two things that look like a v right below. to take the barrels off there is a lever you turn it to the left. to break it down there is a bigger lever you pull to the right . but where you would normaley have a wood forarm there is these two levers. back behind the hammers there is a dog like a pointer on each side. in front of the hammers right below the barrels where it hindges is a pig on the left and a deer on the right even the screws have little designs in them this gun is in bad shape though and rusty but in its hay day it was a looker i will see if my dauther can down load picthures for me this weekend any more help is apreacheated

 

[SDC]

It's definitely a Cape Gun then (I missed the part about the smaller barrel in your original post), but it should still be marked on either the sideplates (where the hammers are) or on the barrel rib (between the barrels) as to the manufacturer. Since it's a Belgian gun, any markings are likely to be in French. Regardless, it wouldn't be safe to shoot at this point.

 

[Jim Watson]

I would not count on it being marked with the manufacturer's name. There are a lot of nameless Belgian guns out there. If it did have a name on it, it would just as likely be the dealer or distributor as the maker.
I have a nice old Verney Carron (French) shotgun with the maker's name on the underlump in about 1mm letters. There is a blank panel in the rib matting for a dealer to have put his name on the gun. But nobody bothered. Aparently the Europeans cared less about such things than we do.

 

[nitestocker]

on top of the rifle barrel it looks like the letters KREINSNN in fancy letters the other barrel is to warn for these eyes if some one noes anymore who made it? would i ruin it by blueing it for my nabor? im using g96 bluing cream a cold bluing . any value or should i just oil it and clean as must rust off it i can and leave it alone

 

[Cosmoline]

Don't mess with it until its identity can be confirmed. Pictures would be an enormous help. Does the steel of the barrels have stirations and lines through it?

People hear "Belgian" and they think cheap no-name knockoff. While that's a possibility, not all ELG Belgian made firearms, and certainly not all cape guns, are cheapo. I think this one is a little overpriced, but it gives you an idea. Does yours look like this?

http://www.soldusa.com/detail.asp?id=4819

 

[nitestocker]

that looks just like it thank you

 

[Jim Watson]

The gun it the picture is not what you describe. It has a wood forearm and a top snap opening lever.

to break it down there is a bigger lever you pull to the right . but where you would normaley have a wood forarm there is these two levers.

Those front end lever actions are a very old type that small makers kept turning out because they were cheap.

 

[nitestocker]

your right it does. this one dont have the wood it looks a lot like that one though