I had an idea.

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Nightcrawler

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You know how some 9mm pistols also come in .40, and the magazines have the same dimensions and such because they fit into the same frame?

For instance, I looked at a Ruger 9mm 10 round mag, and a Ruger .40 10 round mag today. The feed lips and mag body were identical, dimensions-wise. The .40 follower was very slighly different.

I've heard that with some pistols, you can load 9mm rounds into a 10 round .40 pistols. I've heard that on some (like the Ruger .40 10-round magazine marked P17/10, for instance) this works, and on others, the follower is too different on the .40 mag.

Which gives me a thought. If anyone has a 9mm gun and wants to try this, I'd appreciate it (specifically, a Ruger P89, as that's the gun in question). Take the 10 round .40 magazine apart, and swap the follower with that of a 10 round 9mm magazine. Load it up with 9mm rounds and see how it works.

If either of these ideas work, it'll give you a more economic source of fifteen round magazines. If nothing else, it'll give you some reasonably reliable range mags (in STANDARD capacity, not castrated) so you can save your expensive factory prebans for carry.
If THAT doesn't work well, buy a USA brands or otherwise cheap aftermarket mag, and replace the follower with a Ruger factory or Mec-Gar one (from a 10 round post ban mag) and replace the spring with a Wolf +5% or +10% spring, and see how it works.

Just an idea. Anybody tried it? And it's certainly cheaper than dropping eighty bucks down on a preban factory mag, assuming you can even find one. Most magazine related problems (slide not locking back, or locking back too soon, double feeds, etc.) can be traced to a bad follower or a bad spring, I should think.
 
Hmmmmm....
This is riding the legal line pretty hard. Converting a mag to full capacity is a felony, and swapping out the followers like you describe probably qualifies.
 
Hadn't thought of that. Pretty borderline, I think. You're not REALLY modifying the mag body; it'll still only hold 10 .40 rounds.

Hmm. Still, not something I'd blab about if I had ATF agents sitting next to me, but then, I don't even own a 9mm pistol.

That said, don't try this if you think you'll be in violation of the law. It's not worth getting busted over.

Still, it's not illegal to load 9mm rounds into a 10 round .40 mag, is it? I'm still curious as to how that would work.

And what about the idea of swapping the followers and springs on a cheap preban? Observe the mag before you buy, if you can, to make sure the feed lips are okay. But I've heard that USA mags usually have good feed lips, but it's the followers and springs that give them trouble. No experience, just what I've heard.
 
I don't have the link handy but this has come up before (search on tfl) and some letters from the BATF were looked at (and linked to) and it basically said that no mag can be manufactured (or imported) that is a hi cap mag (more than 10 rounds). But what constitutes manufacturing was the question. The BATF's answer was basically as long as the mag still worked for it's original purpose, it was not changed enough to be remanufactured (and the original purpose round count was still 10 or less for post ban ones). So basically swapping out followers was ok, and jamming 11 rounds of 9mm into a post ban 10 round .40 mag was ok (but I still would not test that one in court), because you never manufactured it, and it is still a 10 round .40 mag.

Also you could weld together 2 preban 15 round mags to make 1 30 round if you wanted...
 
Yeah, this topic did get some coverage on TFL, but it gets done to DEATH on HKPro (no flame Nightcrawler, since this is neither).

The reason being, the USP9f and USP9c normally work 100% with USP40 10 round mags, and if they do give trouble, you just swap the followers for a quick fix.

The Walther P99 is this way too. You can get 14 rounds of 9mm in a 10 round 40S&W mag!!!

I've not done any of this personally, so it's just internet rumor, but there were guys on both TFL and HKPro who claimed to have called their local ATF branch and got a verbal "it's not illegal" response.

I wouldn't worry about testing this legal hypothesis at the range, or if that ever-popular phrase "TSHTF" and I needed all the rounds I could carry, :rolleyes: but for CCW and HD, I'm not going to quibble over a $25 savings in order to make 100% sure I don't run into unneccessary legal troubles over a couple of extra rounds! In other words, I only use pre-ban mags in my HD guns when they're not at the range.
 
Also the springfield XDs in 9mm do this. Pop in an XD40 mag and you get 14-15 rnds of 9mm.

I think 80-90% of the people as HS2000talk were having 100% success with this. The rest had to tweak the mags a bit. It go so people were doing batch orders on .40 mags :p just in case they were changed in the future.

Anyway, according to a letter posted there from the ATF, there were zero problems with what they were doing.
 
Make mods to 40 mag is a no-no :scrutiny: But using it absolutely stock is ok. Really dependent on which gun you try this on. It has worked for me w/ a couple guns, but not 100% reliable w/ others. For this reason, I only use the 40 mags for range use & preserve my hi-caps for HD & competition.
 
It gets done with many of same family guns. Changing follower will improve reliability.

Questionable legal implication, especially if you have changed the follower for separate firearm.


Stay away from cheapo USA mags. Metal is soft. The punchout for the mag-catch is sloppy & weak. It will often cause recoil-induced mag-dumps durig firing, or may simply refuse to release at all.
 
Everything I've heard is that there is no law on "misusing" .40 mags by putting 9mm in them. Once you start goofing with the assembly, it gets dicey.

On a related note, Promag used to make a nice FML Glock mag (they also made bad all metal and all plastic ones). The mags didn't always work perfectly stock. But if you put $2 Glock factory springs in them they usually worked Glock Perfect. I also put Glock followers in mine. You can still get them for $30 or so.
 
Here's a question. How about the .40 preban mags? You see them around for pretty cheap; not much demand for them, as the Ruger .40s were never big sellers. They hold 11 rounds of .40. I wonder how many rounds of 9mm they'd hold, and how well they'd work if you swap the follower.
 
On the followers to my 9mm USP mags, the followers are marked 9/40, so you would not have to swap out any parts with a 10 round .40 mag, just load and go, without worry about the legalities.

That said, I have not tried this, yet.
 
How about the .40 preban mags? You see them around for pretty cheap; not much demand for them, as the Ruger .40s were never big sellers. They hold 11 rounds of .40. I wonder how many rounds of 9mm they'd hold....

In this one case, with the Rugers, you may have an idea. I can't imagine why a full sized, unblocked .40 wouldn't hold just as many rounds as a pre-ban 9mm. I say "go for it" :D

With most other pistols, the pre-ban 9mm mags are more available than the .40's, because there are lots more of them since the 9mm version of pistol XYZ was almost always in production longer. As a result, you'll also often find the .40 pre-ban mag is MORE expensive than it's 9mm brother.
 
I think that generally, a 10-round .40 S&W mag will hold 13 rounds of 9mm.
 
Errr....hmmmm....I had one once....aaa....I think?

There are no mods needed to get a 9mm round to work in 40 mags...for the most part. Dont do it if it needs it..then youre doing a NO NO! :evil: OEM mags usually holds 14 rnds and work perfectly.....But how would I know :rolleyes:
Shoot well
 
I bought two magazines for my friend's Ruger P89 as a gift. A factory .40 ten rounder and a Mec-Gar 10 rounder.

The .40 ten rounder holds 14 rounds of 9mm. The .40 follower is a bit bulkier than the 9mm one, and has this strange protrusion sticking down from it (presumably to plug the magaizne from 11 rounds to 10).

In any case, out of curiosity, I switched the followers, putting the 9mm one in the .40 mag. It would then fit perfectly 15 rounds of 9mm.

The .40 spring is a bit different than the 9mm spring, and the .40 feed lips are a bit longer, so we'll see how it actually works.

I swapped them back and put them away, until I give them to my friend. Just wanted to post a quick report.

I told my friend to pick up a couple .40 preban 11 round mags and drop 9mm followers in them for inexpensive, factory quality preban magazines. The Ruger .40 prebans usually run for $30.00.

THe law, as I understand it, says essentially this: Putting 9mm rounds in a .40 mag is not illegal. Modifying the .40 mag to make 9mm feed better isn't illegal, so long as it still works in the original gun. So if it'll still feed .40, you're fine.

In any case, unless you shoot at a Fed range with lots of ATF agents nosing around, it probably won't come up. Still, I cannot recommend doing anything you think is illegal, for obvious reasons.
 
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There is not a legal stipulation about caliber switching...as long as the mag was designed for the gun and hasnt been modified..your in a very large grey area....still not illegal.
If you tweak the lips to make them work...youve done bad voodoo....do not pass go...go directly to
Shoot well
 
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