I realized today… I just can’t shoot GP’s very well.

[UncleEd]

FO sights are great.

I can't shoot my J-frames worth a flying flip.

Can you put five into a man-sized target's chest/groin at 5 yards
or less or at least two into the head? If the answer is yes,
then you are good to go. Just be realistic about the snubby.

The pattern needn't be tight.

OK, I'll wait for those who foresee a situation where a horde
of baddies are coming at 25 yards or more. Well, you should
be heading the other direction.

 

[entropy]

No amount of trigger work will get a GP as smooth as a well worked S&W trigger. It's design based, not for lack of trying. I worked the trigger of my Redhawk, new Wolff springs, polishing, etc. but it never came close to either of my Pythons, or the Smith 25-5 I have now.
I did the work on the Redhawk so I'd be able to shoot DA reasonably accurately at a moose ( on prep for a moose hunt) or bear close up.

 

[kje54]

Had to look it up, I had no idea what a GP was........... Gas Phase..........?

 

[MrBorland]

Can you put five into a man-sized target's chest/groin at 5 yards
or less or at least two into the head? If the answer is yes,
then you are good to go. Just be realistic about the snubby.

The pattern needn't be tight.

“Combat accuracy” at combat speed

 

[Mark_Mark]

“Combat accuracy” at combat speed

I’m going to have to disagree “man size” target is HUGE!

Me… hit what I aim at within 1/2 inch - fists size hip shot from 5 yards

 

[nvcdl]

My first revolver was a GP-100 in 357. Even with a spring kit I could never really shoot it well. Some of that was inexperience but over the years I found I could shoot Smith N Frames, Ruger Speed Sixs, and other revolvers much better. Ended up trading off the GP-100.

 

[Riomouse911]

Riomouse, I notice that you are one of those "thumbs flopping
in the air" kind of shooters and your left hand is way forward, more
under the trigger guard rather than solidly down on the shooting hand.

By the by, is the angle of your trigger finger from grip to front of
trigger feel comfortable, especially during the steady DA pull through.

Do your stocks allow for a straight line of wrist toward gun, no canting
around of gun hand to more comfortably reach trigger.

I get what you’re saying, that picture looks like I am hitch hiking. Part of it is a trick of the frames in bottom picture.

On the .357, my left thumb is pressed against the frame as I pull through my trigger stroke, the top one shows it better. The right thumb is down on the left hand.

With the smaller grip of the .44, my left thumb is hard down over my right, as it cant sit flush against the frame without sticking too far forward towards the B/C gap for comfort. (J frames are the same, don’t want to feel any B/C blast.)

You are right that my left thumb came off the gun wide as it recoiled that time, it usually stays down more, pointed towards the target something more like this. (Im not death-gripping the gun, but these loads do have a bit of recoil so I should hold on better.)



( Another odd thing in that earlier picture is the muzzle blast is visible even though you can see the shadow of the hammer still back.)

The grip on the .357 is the factory Hogue. The grip on the .44 is a factory GP 100 compact grip, not the original weird-feeling grip (to me) it came with. The grip isn't bad on either gun, no more or less trigger finger reach than on my S&W K-L-N frames. The feel of the Ruger trigger pull is just not one I seem to agree best with (and none of my S&W have the big FO front sights).

I think it is probably a combo of the two.

Stay safe.

 

[shoebox1.1]

For me.. the match champion grip is the key. The angle is perfect. My MC has the 8lb wolf spring and is as smooth or smoother than a SW. I literally did 1000 dry fires in a bath of kroil, took it apart got all the grit out then oil.

 

[Mark_Mark]

For me.. the match champion grip is the key. The angle is perfect. My MC has the 8lb wolf spring and is as smooth or smoother than a SW. I literally did 1000 dry fires in a bath of kroil, took it apart got all the grit out then oil.

you soaked the gun in oil and dry fired?

I always thought that I could pack the inside of the gun with Flitz and dry fry it smooth

 

[MrBorland]

my left thumb is pressed against the frame as I pull through my trigger stroke, the top one shows it better. The right thumb is down on the left hand

Do what works for you, but pressing your weak thumb against the frame can affect your shots. And the classic "competition grip" I referred to earlier involves both thumbs forward (and off the frame). Your first photo seems to show your strong thumb also forward, , but if it's bent down (and under your weak hand), your weak hand isn't sitting in the "pocket" as efficiently as it could be.

 

[derek45]

 

[J-Bar]

I would be flinching like hell if I were shooting full house loads inside a steel box! I guess I'm spoiled; the booths at my indoor range are lined with soft stuff.

 

[Riomouse911]

I shot the same two magnum loads through the 4” S&W 686+ today. The grouping wasn’t bullseye worthy, but for full house 175 gr swc (shown) and 200 gr rnfp, they were centered and much better than with the 4” GP-100. (Pushed one right, all on me.)



I’m going to try some new front sights, as a few have suggested, to see if that helps a bit.

Stay safe.

 

[shoebox1.1]

you soaked the gun in oil and dry fired?

I always thought that I could pack the inside of the gun with Flitz and dry fry it smooth

No dunk.. just kept drowning the fire control group. It was coming out of every orfice

 

[cfullgraf]

I have a 44 Special and 327 Fed Mag GP100 and I really do not see much difference in shooting them vs my S&W revolvers. I like the Ruger factory rubber grips with wood inserts and my S&W guns have Pachmayr Presentation grips.

But, grips are a big personnel thing.

With semi-autoloaders, I tend to shoot off center with then sights centered on the gun, I forget which way, it is always the same way but that is in material. If I change my grip on the gun, I can get the gun to shoot center to match the aim but it is not "natural" to grip the gun quickly that way.

Anyway, GP100's look frumpy me to me but they have a good reputation for reliability. The ones I bought are not readily available in S&W revolvers.

I can't shoot single action revolvers very well except for a Ruger Single Six. I have not found a hold that work for me on the larger center fire single actions.

Not much help I'm afraid.

 

[stonebuster]

I had serious problems shooting my first ccw. A Ruger sp101. Low and left every shot.
I am usually a pretty decent shot with my other handguns....Blackhawks, 1911s, single sixes. MKII..... all single action.
I had to work at it with the sp101. It a whole different cat for some reason....not sure what...?
I'm very pleased with my accuracy with my kframe s&w's.

I sold my first DAO SP101 2.25" 357 because I got frustrated with my inability to master it. After a year of missing it, I bought an older DA/SA SP101 2.25" and practiced single action at only 20ft. until I was confident the SP was accurate. My DA "groups" are tighter now than the first go-round but still shoot other short barrels better. I just traded a GP100 5" + cash for a 1980 k frame S&W Model 65-2 3" 357 that I shoot very much better than I do the SP. I like my Rugers a lot but starting to drift towards older Smiths recently.

 

[Armored farmer]

I sold my first DAO SP101 2.25" 357 because I got frustrated with my inability to master it. After a year of missing it, I bought an older DA/SA SP101 2.25" and practiced single action at only 20ft. until I was confident the SP was accurate. My DA "groups" are tighter now than the first go-round but still shoot other short barrels better. I just traded a GP100 5" + cash for a 1980 k frame S&W Model 65-2 3" 357 that I shoot very much better than I do the SP. I like my Rugers a lot but starting to drift towards older Smiths recently.

Same here.
I fell in with a bad bunch of model 10s and have been happy ever since...
Apologies for the detour @Riomouse911

 

[tightgroup tiger]

I don't think your GPs like those loads. They be protesting.

I have to agree also. I sent my GP100 to my gun smith as soon as I got it. He did his magic and mine has one super smooth, steady pull of about 8 lbs in double action and has a about a 3.5 lb single action pull.
No creep, no staging. I don't stage my shots in double action anyways I don't think it's a correct way to shoot double action, but that' just me. I don't feel a second stage with it anyways. Feels like a good S&W.

I do also think your gun doesn't like your load.

I stumbled around with mine when I first got it and finally found that 2400 was the most accurate magnum powder in it.
I tried H110, Lill' Gun, AA9 and some others. Mine just simply like 2400 for magnums and Power Pistol or BE-86 for low to midrange loads.

Try changing your loads a little or try some 2400 to see if yours like it also.
I done some complaining about the barrel in my getting burned up but I never complained about it's accruacy.

This is 7 yds with my everpresent flyer.
I either just got lucky when I picked it out or the work the gun smith did on it really comes shining through.

I also tried some of Matt's Bullets 172gr Kieth style bullets in it and it did NOT like them at all. I got about a 6" group at 7yds with them. I stay with 158gr coated or jacketed bullets these days and all my .357Mag loads are based around that weight. GP 100 does well with that weight and it's what I shoot the best through it.

 

[entropy]

Same here.
I fell in with a bad bunch of model 10s and have been happy ever since...View attachment 1190928View attachment 1190929View attachment 1190930
Apologies for the detour @Riomouse911

You and me both; though at the price of this 25-5, it won't be a bunch of them. There is the 625 JM that came in with the 25-5 still in the gun case at work.....

 

[mavracer]

I am a huge fan of the GP series. I shoot them very well. However, I can not shoot handgun with a fiber optic front sight. It is too hard for me to get a clear sight picture. All of my GP's have a black front sight or a gold bead.

Especially the front sights Ruger likes to put on, the dot makes it nearly impossible to use the post as a post so you're stuck with a round peg in a square hole.
I've used some Dawsen fiber fronts on my 1911s and they have a much smaller diameter FO pipe and have a good balance for the ability to focus on the FO for speed or the post for precision.
Now that I'm thinking about this I'm probably going to look to change the sight on the 44 and MC I'll probably leave Wiley alone.

 

[CZguy75]

My GP wasnt terrible out of the box. DA was real gritty and stagey. Accuracy was there in SA so I started tinkering. It got the rubber grips with wood inserts and a spring kit. That helped a little. Then I went and cleaned the trigger plunger and hole and installed hammer and hammer dog shims. THAT made it an entirely different gun! The DA grittiness went away and the staging went to near nill. I have no issues with it now.

However, I only have a few revolvers to compare it to. The GP was my first revolver. I like it so much that I started looking for another. I wanted a cosmetically challenged project but still mechanically sound revolver. I eventually picked up an ugly 10-5 smith and found that the action is indeed as smooth as what I had been led to believe. I enjoy shooting both. For me, right now, I still like the GP more. Like I said, though, that is a sample of two from an unaccomplished shooter. I just know that the shims made a major difference. You might try them!

 

[TarDevil]

People come in all different sizes and shapes, but the GP doesn't feel good in my hands.

 

[westernrover]

Looks like a good "thumbs-forward" competition grip. It's how I shoot (non-magnum) revolvers as well. Rotating the weak hand forward gets the weak hand fitting nicely into the pocket between your string hand fingertips and thumb pad - as such, there may be less weak hand on the shooting hand, but really, more on the grip itself. The canted weak hand also helps recoil control.

This is probably the most popular grip these days and is promoted by a lot of instructors at most training academies. It offers, as you wrote, more pressure on the handgun grip from the support hand because there is no hollow in the support hand palm.

I think most people agree that position offers more recoil control. I've heard differing opinions as to whether thumbs forward or thumb wrapped offers more retention. Some have argued that thumbs forward offers more retention for the same reason it offers more recoil control -- there is more pressure on the grips. Others have argued that a wrapped thumb retains the gun better, where straight thumbs could be hyper-extended by torquing the gun against them.

I once had an instructor that was zealous to show me the superior retention of thumbs-forward have me assume the grip on a blue-gun. They then attempted to disarm me, succeeding in hyperextending my thumb. Those injuries to tendons take a long time to heal. If you've ever had 'tennis-elbow', it's like that. I can still feel it and it's 10 months later, but most of it was healed after about 4 months. It's not that painful. I didn't even mention it to them at the time. But it sure takes a while to feel 100% again.

Does retention really matter? Am I ever going to need that? Do split times actually matter for anything but the shot-timer's opinion of my Bill Drill?

I'm not going to solve all the possible problems with any method I adopt, but I do rotate my support hand even farther forward into a what's called a "wedge grip." With the wedge, when you roll the support hand forward, the middle finger is wedged between the trigger guard and the strong hand's middle finger.


For a revolver, I do thumb on thumbnail. When my trigger finger comes back, it hits the support hand thumb and that doesn't matter. I do this to avoid burn from the gap, to prevent hyper-extension of the support hand thumb, and also to keep from thumb from dragging on the cylinder.

 

[Mark_Mark]

were’s @Riomouse911 been? have not heard from him in a minute… @Riomouse911 well-fare check please

all never mind, just check his activity, he’s just off on a tangent somewhere

 

[Riomouse911]

were’s @Riomouse911 been? have not heard from him in a minute… @Riomouse911 well-fare check please

all never mind, just check his activity, he’s just off on a tangent somewhere

I’m around. I haven’t done much with the GP’s since I posted, but I did swap the FO front for a red ramp blade on the .357 and shot the same loads again. (Brought the S&W 686+ along, too.)





These are pretty much the average. The heavy 200 gr bullet load still shot high, but this time a tad right (top). The other two were better at 10 yds. (175 gr center, 165 in the X Ring)

In my 686+, the heavy 200 gr loads were spot on at ten.



The FO sight wasn’t helping, the ramp sight on the GP is better for me. Still, I just shoot the S&W better than the GP.

I think it’s the trigger action. All of my S&W triggers don't stack right before the break like the GP/SP triggers do, so I guess the guns stay on target more consistently through the duration of my pull.

YMMV.

Stay safe.