NWCP
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It's your money. Get whatever floats your boat. I would avoid the use of lead bullets in a polygonal barrel. If that's what you intend to shoot buy an aftermarket standard land and groove barrel for the woods. Enjoy!
I'm confused: 10mm woods carry question
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berettashotgun
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Getting a 10mm will change your wallet thickness - dramatically.
Like them, own one. Impulse ( somehow qualifies as an impulse? ) purchase after lusting for a 1006 for years.
Power to size is about unequaled in a pistol.
You would be hard pressed to come up with a more "rounded" tool for the task.
Actually a little overpowered IMHO.
I'd have no problem carrying a 9mm with FMJ.
Gotta' hit where you look.....
Like them, own one. Impulse ( somehow qualifies as an impulse? ) purchase after lusting for a 1006 for years.
Power to size is about unequaled in a pistol.
You would be hard pressed to come up with a more "rounded" tool for the task.
Actually a little overpowered IMHO.
I'd have no problem carrying a 9mm with FMJ.
Gotta' hit where you look.....
inutero1212
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To start with I would call both Glock and your ammunition companies and talk it over with them regarding use of these loads in an unsupported chambered barrel. Perhaps a quality aftermarket barrel that has an supported chamber and traditional rifling might be the answer you are looking for. In addition, I have been reading some very positive reviews on RDS technology on auto's these days, might be worth it if you are concerned at all with reaching longer ranges with your handgun. A few I have know put the new trijicon sights on feel comfortable regularly hitting steel at 40 or so meters with their glocks where before 20-25 was all they felt comfortable with. I agree with you though, 10mm should be sufficient for your needs. with slight modification you may be able to get everything you want out of the gun. I would start by picking up the phone and calling. Hope it works out for you!
John Wayne
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If you're worried about shooting lead, get an aftermarket barrel for $100. If you're going to do that, you can start with the G21 and then you'd have the option of .45 or 10mm.
The G20 has a lot to recommend it as a woods gun -- simple, reliable, powerful, and lightweight. More powerful and controllable than a .357 Mag of the same size, and holds 15 rounds to boot. There are other 10mm auto pistols out there, but none are quite as light or robust as the G20.
The G20 has a lot to recommend it as a woods gun -- simple, reliable, powerful, and lightweight. More powerful and controllable than a .357 Mag of the same size, and holds 15 rounds to boot. There are other 10mm auto pistols out there, but none are quite as light or robust as the G20.
easyg
Member
10mm is just fine for TN.
Heck, even a .40 would probably be enough.
But I would get an after market barrel if you want to shoot reloads or bare lead.
Good luck,
Easy
Heck, even a .40 would probably be enough.
But I would get an after market barrel if you want to shoot reloads or bare lead.
Good luck,
Easy
Mainsail
Member
I owned a Ruger Alaskan in 44 Mag and I loved it. Nevertheless, I sold it and bought a G20SF for exactly the same reasons you mention. I found myself leaving the Alaskan home on hikes where I needed to trim extra ounces. You'll get all sorts of free advice on this issue, and it's worth every penny in most cases. In the end though, you have to make the decision.
The word “hike” means different things to different people (and I know you didn’t use it, but just mentioned a woods gun). To some people a hike is a couple hundred yards over relatively even terrain, to others that description would be insulting. Here in Washington, I consider anything under five miles and 1000’ of elevation gain/loss to be a stroll or a meandering. For that one could carry a shotgun or rifle. But when you start packing up your backpack for a six mile overnight trip with big elevation gains and losses, you quickly start unpacking the extras. After all, you still have to hike those same six miles (or more) back out.
I feel completely confident with my G20SF and one magazine against anything the Olympic or Cascade ranges could throw at me. I carry DoubleTap 200gr hardcast loads that you mention. My G20 has a LoneWolf barrel and a 3½# connector, (which is not a 3½# trigger BTW), and Trijicon night sights.
The gun you carry is far more important than the one you left home to shave weight.
As to your question specifically, I doubt you’ll be practicing with several hundred rounds of lead hardcast ($!) so you should be just fine using them. The barrel isn’t going to lead up after one or two mags, and you’ll never shoot more than that in a self defense situation. So practice with FMJs, plus a magazine full of hardcast for the feel and zeroing, and carry the hardcasts when you’re out. If you’re worried, drop the >$150 for an aftermarket barrel. (I might have gone with the 6” barrel if it would fit in the Bianchi holster I like to use.)
I’m also curious about the recoil spring and whether I should go with a few pounds heavier.
The word “hike” means different things to different people (and I know you didn’t use it, but just mentioned a woods gun). To some people a hike is a couple hundred yards over relatively even terrain, to others that description would be insulting. Here in Washington, I consider anything under five miles and 1000’ of elevation gain/loss to be a stroll or a meandering. For that one could carry a shotgun or rifle. But when you start packing up your backpack for a six mile overnight trip with big elevation gains and losses, you quickly start unpacking the extras. After all, you still have to hike those same six miles (or more) back out.
I feel completely confident with my G20SF and one magazine against anything the Olympic or Cascade ranges could throw at me. I carry DoubleTap 200gr hardcast loads that you mention. My G20 has a LoneWolf barrel and a 3½# connector, (which is not a 3½# trigger BTW), and Trijicon night sights.
The gun you carry is far more important than the one you left home to shave weight.
As to your question specifically, I doubt you’ll be practicing with several hundred rounds of lead hardcast ($!) so you should be just fine using them. The barrel isn’t going to lead up after one or two mags, and you’ll never shoot more than that in a self defense situation. So practice with FMJs, plus a magazine full of hardcast for the feel and zeroing, and carry the hardcasts when you’re out. If you’re worried, drop the >$150 for an aftermarket barrel. (I might have gone with the 6” barrel if it would fit in the Bianchi holster I like to use.)
I’m also curious about the recoil spring and whether I should go with a few pounds heavier.
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I'm a hiker as well, afflicted with attention to gear weight. I am not about to claim that a 10mm is not adequate for your purposes, but I think you'll find a fully loaded G20 is quite heavy (Glock figures around 39oz, probably heavier with 200gr loads), though you're by no means obligated to load it up with 15 rounds. Should your reasoning have been based on weight interest rather than just what you liked, I just wanted to bring to your attention that there are revolvers out there that would save you some weight when loaded, even in .44 magnum. A good example is the S&W 4" 329PD, though it'll cost significantly more and wouldn't be as enjoyable to shoot with full power loads.
Anyway, certainly nothing wrong with your choice. Hope that didn't violate your opening caveat too offensively.
Anyway, certainly nothing wrong with your choice. Hope that didn't violate your opening caveat too offensively.
NMGonzo
Member
You shoot well with it?
Bring it!
Bring it!
KBintheSLC
Member
Man... only made it to post 3. I guess to each their own. I have used the G20 for several years now for a backpacking gun. Been all through the Rockies, Uintas, Sierras, and of course the deserts of the west. Its been wet, dirty, muddy, snowy, and freezing and it has shown no signs of problems. I assure you, there are few beasts on this continent that cannot be taken with full-house 10mm loads. Not to mention that it is easier to hump up the mtn at half the weight and nearly 3x the capacity of a big revolver.
As for the OP's inquiry, I just use the 200g FMJ-FP from DoubleTap, intermingled with the 200g XTP loads. I am guessing that the hard cast stuff won't cause a problem if you just use 1-10 rounds for self defense, but I have never tried it. Here are some tests of those two loads for your enjoyment...
http://brasstard.com/?cat=40
I don't recall the OP mentioning anything about fishing trips in Alaska. If he did, we'd all say ditch the pistol and bring a long gun. For what the OP is planning on doing, the .454 is beyond overkill. Check out this post from "revolvers" http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=508236 about a charging griz being taken with a .38 spl. Shocking.
...
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Confederate
Member
Although I agree a revolver would be the best way to go in the wilds, I have no problem with a good penetrating 10mm round.
Going against bear, for example, one might think that fast repeat shots would be beneficial and perhaps they'd be right; however, one should shoot for the nose or the mouth to end the fight. This puts the bullet(s) in the brain (nose) or severing the spine (mouth). Putting your shots anywhere else can be ineffective.
The 10mm clearly has the power to deal with an aggressive black bear. Occasionally, one may also encounter (increasingly) packs of feral dogs. An auto would certainly have an advantage there. A good grade of pepper spray (like Cold Steel's Inferno) also works well in the woods and in camping.
Revolvers also have the benefit of being able to shoot at greater distances than autos, but again, the 10mm has sufficient power to be a good companion while camping or hiking.
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Going against bear, for example, one might think that fast repeat shots would be beneficial and perhaps they'd be right; however, one should shoot for the nose or the mouth to end the fight. This puts the bullet(s) in the brain (nose) or severing the spine (mouth). Putting your shots anywhere else can be ineffective.
The 10mm clearly has the power to deal with an aggressive black bear. Occasionally, one may also encounter (increasingly) packs of feral dogs. An auto would certainly have an advantage there. A good grade of pepper spray (like Cold Steel's Inferno) also works well in the woods and in camping.
Revolvers also have the benefit of being able to shoot at greater distances than autos, but again, the 10mm has sufficient power to be a good companion while camping or hiking.
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Doulbetap hardcast lead WFNGC ok in Glock barrels
To get back to the original poster's question of the DoubleTap hardcase lead through the stock Glock 20 polygonal-rifling barrel, I emailed DoubleTap last year with the same question and here is the reply I got:
Further reading seems to indicate that the use of the copper gas-check prevents much of the lead erosion at the base of the bullet, reducing the lead build up in the barrel.
To get back to the original poster's question of the DoubleTap hardcase lead through the stock Glock 20 polygonal-rifling barrel, I emailed DoubleTap last year with the same question and here is the reply I got:
Further reading seems to indicate that the use of the copper gas-check prevents much of the lead erosion at the base of the bullet, reducing the lead build up in the barrel.
Chas.
Member
Folks are right that we don't have any 900 lb bears here, but we do have a few Bubba's that'll go 900.
c919
Member
^^^ That's for sure.
...but as long as they're not running moonshine on 4 wheelers, they aren't known to be aggressive without provocation.
...but as long as they're not running moonshine on 4 wheelers, they aren't known to be aggressive without provocation.
thirdeagle
Member
I spent 18 yrs in WNC, 7 years in ETN followed, 2 yrs in NGA and now I'm in western MT. My two woods gun are a SW Model 19 and a 3rd gen Glock 20; 99% of the time I carry the G20. I've heard all same crap the 10mm naysayers throw around but it boils down to this:
My G20 has functioned under some of the worst conditions imaginable - sand, dirt, leaf debris, copious amounts of rain and snow, and blood and guts. I handle my G20 better than most of my buddies handle their heavy hitters and I'm not a big fella. I have a 16 rnd capacity of some of Double Tap's best. We have bears, big cats and increasingly more interactions with wolves (don't get me started here). I don't feel the least bit under gunned. My biggest concern is and always has been two legged predators for which the 10mm is more than sufficient. An after market barrel and a Serpa retention holster have turned my G20 into one of the best all-around firearms (and woods guns) I have ever owned.
My G20 has functioned under some of the worst conditions imaginable - sand, dirt, leaf debris, copious amounts of rain and snow, and blood and guts. I handle my G20 better than most of my buddies handle their heavy hitters and I'm not a big fella. I have a 16 rnd capacity of some of Double Tap's best. We have bears, big cats and increasingly more interactions with wolves (don't get me started here). I don't feel the least bit under gunned. My biggest concern is and always has been two legged predators for which the 10mm is more than sufficient. An after market barrel and a Serpa retention holster have turned my G20 into one of the best all-around firearms (and woods guns) I have ever owned.
For woods carry, a G20 would be fine, especially if you bought the real HAMMERS (buffalo bore, double tap, etc.) Plus you'll get 15 rounds per mag (assuming you live in a non restrictive state). If the polygonal rifling is a problem, you can get a replacement barrel from lone wolf for about 100 bucks, and if you can afford 10mm ammo, you can afford the barrel swap.
ECVMatt
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I carry my Glock 20 all over the woods and deserts of CA. I also take it to TX hog hunting and have shot a few with it. We usually catch with dogs and then stick the hogs, so the ones I have shot have been a very close range. The 10 works great for this. I use Dbl. Tap 200 HP and the just hammer the hogs. The biggest one I have shot was about 200 lbs, so not overly large, but just fell over dead. I also took this gun on a 12 moose hunt to AK. I was surprised to find 10mm stocked at Aniak, a small village north east of Anchorage. The owner stated that lots of pilots fly with a 20 and I did see several carrying 20's in a nice chest rig made in Anchorage. I have good faith in the 20. It has endured desert sand storms, crossed the Red River, and froze every night in AK. You can completely take it a part with an old rusty nail, clean it in whatever water is near, put it back together, and it will still work. I would say you are making a good choice.
surfinUSA
Member
I have a G20 and think its one of the finest woods guns made. Its practically impervious to the weather etc. Its reliable and powerful and relatively light. I also have a 44 mag but the G20 gets out more often. As a side note, if it can't be done wih a 44 mag I'm using a rifle.
As far as the S&W 460 or 500 goes, they are so big and heavy, even compared to a 8 3/8 INCH 44 MAG MODEL 29 I would rather carry a long gun.
For 10mm ammo I usually use Winchester 175gn silvertips.
As far as the S&W 460 or 500 goes, they are so big and heavy, even compared to a 8 3/8 INCH 44 MAG MODEL 29 I would rather carry a long gun.
For 10mm ammo I usually use Winchester 175gn silvertips.
If you're uneasy about the lead rounds, try the "controlled expansion" of the DT line. I have 200 grainers, and they're Hornady XTP bullets. I know it's debatable, but the box says 1250 out of a G20. If it's even close to that...
I carry them in the woods.
I carry them in the woods.
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Hickock45 just posted a video on youtube showing how the standard glock 10mm barrel reacted to Double-Tap or Buffalo Bore (one of the heavy loaded ammos) and the stock barrel was super inaccurate even at short distance. He replaced the glock barrel with a lone wolf replacement and it was a tack driver.
The slug would tumble with the glock barrel due to the odd rifling. Plus, the bullets were not completely copper coated, just the sides, not the tips. He has not noted any leading of the glock barrel though.
The slug would tumble with the glock barrel due to the odd rifling. Plus, the bullets were not completely copper coated, just the sides, not the tips. He has not noted any leading of the glock barrel though.
hogshead
Member
Next one that bad mouths the g20 must report to Ted Nugents office.Trying to remember where I read about him shooting a cape buffalo[already deceased] In the spine and crushing the vertabrae. Just in case you run into any buffalo.
I've been looking at a polymer Witness pistol in 10mm,with some of the same use in mind. It seems as light as the Glock, but has a rifled barrel. I haven't read any reviews about the 10mm version, but people seem to like the others.
hogshead
Member
I have a buddy who bought the witness first shot the white dot in the rear sight blew out. Shot 3 more clips with ajam every time. Granted it was a brand new gun.I told him they were made by jennings and called my other friend at the gun store and got him in on it .You shoulda seen my friends face when he told them jennings made them. He sent the gun back and they attempted to fix it.It never was reliable and he sold it for a big loss. Bear in mind that is my experience with the witness.Results may vary. Never had any problems with my g20 except finding the brass.
Airman193SOS
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I'd imagine he would be surprised, given that Jennings does NOT make the Witness. It's made by Tanfoglio and imported by European American Armory.
That's some good disinformation you gave him. Did you get it cheap?
Gunfighter123
Member
Hiya hogshead ---- saying a EAA Tangfoglio Witness is a made "jennings" is like me saying that North Carolinians was made by "yankees"
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