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Is Colt Doomed?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Wishoot, Nov 14, 2014.

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  1. Warp

    Warp Member

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    If you don't mind inferior build quality, durability, and reliability, sure, why not buy something cheap and inferior?

    Why buy a Glock or M&P or whatever you can just buy a hi-point? They work and when you take to the range to slow fire paper-punch it will work just as well.
     
  2. USAF_Vet

    USAF_Vet Member

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    Hey, it's your money, buy what you want. I stand by my statement. Your average gun owner won't shoot enough or in the conditions to make any noticeable difference between the two. Even between a Hi Point and a Glock.

    Is it easier to push the limits of a Colt than it is a DPMS? Of course. Will the average Joe range guy ever push it there under typical circumstances? Doubtful.
     
  3. Warp

    Warp Member

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    Rifles such as DPMS can't even reliably ignite "hard military primer" 5.56 ammo.

    If your average gun owner might shoot Federal Lake City XM855, that DPMS might fail them on occasion. Of course, if punching paper at the range is the only thing you will ever use it for, who cares?

    Or I suppose you could start replacing/upgrading parts, like the FCG, on the DPMS to make it more reliable, since the $850-$900 Colt is too expensive.
     
  4. itsa pain

    itsa pain member

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    But an SKS will outlast any AR cheap and built like a tank
     
  5. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    I think the point remains that Colt owned the market in the 70's and most of the 80's and if they would have innovated and tooled up they could have offered their Mil-Spec guns for close to what the competition had. They already had the factory in place, DPMS, Bushmaster, Olympic all had to build and develop. There was also some collusion with the gov prior to the AWB that removed or changed configurations that left a bad taste in some peoples mouth.
    Colt has never had a very good add campaign for their products and they have produced some real bummers as well.
    S&W managed to keep their revolver line as competitive as ever and they still produced semi custom Pro Shop guns as has Kimber and Springfield.
     
  6. Chris Sarno

    Chris Sarno Member

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    I think Colt's is doomed, as is the other government contract gun maker, HK! In the case of Colt's they will resurface for certain, they are a legendary concern that has simply been mishandled due to its dependence upon government contracts, and its own visionless internal leadership. HK is not a legendary concern, they just suck.
     
  7. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    Doubtful. Colt comes with a huge amount of baggage. Remember when they died in the late 1980's?

    Colt closed for an extended period after WWII. It's been a very poorly run company with a greedy union (UAW) for decades. Watch Beretta buy the name with the rest going to the scrapper.
     
  8. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    Colt was already in deep financial trouble back then...
     
  9. Old Dog

    Old Dog Member

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    Speaking to the "needs of the avergage Joe" might not be the best plank to base your argument on. Absolutely true that many, if not most, civilian AR owners might not ever need to wring every last ounce of performance out of their ARs, but what's that really matter? If all of us here have only the number and performance-level of firearms we truly need, then most of us probably have only an old revolver, a bolt-action rifle and a pump shotgun in the safe ...

    Betcha a lot of guys here own big pickup trucks that they've never used on a farm, never taken off-road or never hauled anything more than a new big-screen TV home from Best Buy ...

    How many of us really need our expensive Swiss chronographs? Do you use all its features when you're piloting your private plane over to Telluride for the weekend or when you're diving the reef off your favorite Caribbean island?

    Own a 'Vette or a 7-series BMW? How often do get to bury the needle on your speedometer (well, if they were still analog gauges) or test all its supposed attributes on a long straight stretch of deserted highway, a winding mountain road or a racetrack?

    Getting back to a previous comment by BSA1, well, I should've said "most practical applications" not "any ..." But, do any of us really stick to one gun manufacturer for every single one of our "needs?"

    Why do some of you seem to expect that one company should try to fill every single niche? I'll stack my Colts up to comparable products from any other company and know that they'll perform at least as well and usually better, plus maintain their value longer.
     
  10. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    So was Winchester, S&W, Chrysler, Harley Davidson and many other Iconic brands.
     
  11. Warp

    Warp Member

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    Definitely disagree with the specifics here.

    I see no compelling argument to only have an "old revolver" for carry, or for only having a pump shotgun for home defense. Or why the home defense long gun would be in the safe.

    But I get the direction you are taking.
     
  12. Sol

    Sol Member

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    Yep, This x100^^^. Only if Colt faulters.

    This isn't Colts first rodeo. They will probably pull through.

    If I had to guess, excessive government contracting probably had a hand in this. Lack of innovation and QC issues may hinder civilian sales but people will buy it for the horse rollmark regardless.

    A company cannot expect profitablity soley on government contracts and sales.

    Beretta already has a brand. It would only make sense for them to buy Colt out for their capital.
     
  13. Sunray

    Sunray Member

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    "...They continue to overprice their products..." Yep. Just like Browning, Weatherby and all the rest. Unions and MBA's wrecked 'em all.
     
  14. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    Sure they can -- there are several military contractors out there that do just that.

    You're wrong about Beretta/Colt. Beretta already has plenty of $$$. They also have manufacturing expertise, but little or no position in the 1911 market. Buying the Colt name would make them instant players in that market, plus some of the SAA revolvers they already sell under their Uberti name could be sold as Colts for a great deal more.
     
  15. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    "Unions and MBA's" didn't "wreck" Browning nor Weatherby.
     
  16. HankB

    HankB Member

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    I had a Colt Government Model Jammamatic for a while. After being returned to Colt's several times for warranty work - it remained a jammamatic. :fire: Usually would jam at least twice per magazine, even with hardball (Yes, I tried different magazines. Good ones.)

    Any company can, and will, make an occasional lemon; good companies will make it right.

    My experience with Colt's tells me it's NOT a good company. I'll shed no tears when they're shuttered.
     
  17. barnbwt

    barnbwt member

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    ""Unions and MBA's" didn't "wreck" Browning"
    Browning still makes products domestically?

    TCB
     
  18. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    I remember when Colt died in the late 1980's. The State of Conneticut made an "investment" to keep them going and any buyer/partner had to agree to keep production in a terribly antiquated factory in CT.

    I remember watching video of the manufacturing process. They were still using metal shapers and filing machines... It appeared the line had been set-up for WWII and never improved.

    Ruger comments in his book that he had the chance to buy Colt but felt he could do better on his own. I suspect if the right person/group had bought Colt in 1989, distanced it from its problems in CT and focused on the M16/AR15, M1911, 1873 SSA, perhaps the Python line and finally a truly good polymer line that it would be worth more than all of Ruger today.

    Just like Ferrari, that horsey is worth $$$ as a brand.
     
  19. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    Browning designs were first bought by Oliver Winchester and produced under the Winchester brand. Later Browning designs were built by FN, Remington (limited, under the Remington brand), Miroku and others through licenses with Browning.

    Browning handguns were and are made in Utah. Today Browning as we know it is owned by FN.

    Most Weatherby rifles have been built by Miroku, Howa (both Japanese) and now Saco Defense and Acrometal/ATEK (both US.)
     
  20. coyotehitman

    coyotehitman member

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    Colt has been doomed for years. Govt. contracts buttered their bread and they turned their backs on the civilian market. Buh, bye Colt! I hope Norinco takes over the factory so we can get better 1911's at lower prices.
     
  21. Kynoch

    Kynoch member

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    I wonder if ALL of Colt is on its backside?

    At one point Colt was broken up into Colt Defense and Colt's Manufacturing. CD was the larger and healthier of the two. Quite recently they were merged back together, so I would conclude that the whole place is on the rocks?

    All kidding aside, the Colt name and model names are worth a considerable amount if they can be acquired w/o all the baggage. It really would be interesting who might buy them?

    Might FN buy/license the names as they have with Winchester and Browning?
     
  22. Onward Allusion

    Onward Allusion Member

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    Neo - you'd beat me to it! I would love, to have a 32 ACP the size of a 1908!!!
     
  23. wojownik

    wojownik Member

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    So you hope a state owned company of a fairly hostile communist country, basically at war with us already in the economic in cyber space, to come in and buy a firearms manufacturing facility in the United States. Just so you can get your hands on a cheaper pistol, while they export the capital and profits back home to the PRC. Seriously....
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2014
  24. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

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    Buckmark line & 1911/22s are made in the USA.
    Mind you it is an independent subcontractor that does the work but the guns are domestically produced.
     
  25. Deltaboy1984

    Deltaboy1984 Member

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    Sad but as Momma said Colt made their bed and they are going to Lay in it.
     
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