Katrina,Guns ,unrest etc

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bcbr

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Had to post on this,
What is happening down south is a damn shame and disgrace,
I am no saint or even educated that well,but I know that those folks could have been gotten the hell out of there.
This govt and or country has got to be the laughing stock of the world.
What a time to shine and there is hardly anything.
Who was shooting at the choppers and relief vehicles,where is mighty ups with the largest fleet of trucks in the world and facist exspress?
Those folks are being called refugees by the meemphis mayor and wmctv 5 .

5 times in 10 seconds,refugees,whats up with that?
And to classify and group them,I can see it faintly.
I could take a few flat bed trucks and have those folks out of there,the ones that want out.
This is telling and frustrating,and have been following a lot of net news and threads on various forums.
*** are the NG and all our so called leaders waiting on.
Rapes in the superdome,c mon folks.
Ad all that with gas rationing and gouging and 1000s pleading for help.
How can rescurers be over whelmed and this show the media is putting on,this is a national emergency and if we dont do something fast,fergit it.
Where are the aavs,lavs,c130s c17s ,trapped trapped .these People are refugees Brian williams just sayed on NBC
How can there be no end in site?
Line some God dd..., vehicles up and git those folks out of there.
I do not care what color they are or where they hail from,this response is a sad part in the history of this country.
We have lost a city or 6 and no telling how many dead.
This whole thing is reeking of corruption in our govt.
Some billion air trucking co I will go in an 18 wheeler for free if provided the trucks.
To many chiefs and no grunts to git em out.?
I remember the tons of supplies dropped to aphganistan pallet after pallet.
Rubber boats ,flat barges ww2 landing craft.
Git it all git it all now.Git those folks out.
We are losing the city of NO,and some of MS,and the world is watching how we cannot even take care of our own.
The govt has fu@#$% up on the response on this one.
I am grieved ,and shocked and dismayed at it all,TEOTWAWKI,SHTF etc.
I will vow to never allow myself to trust in the govt to help in a crisis
These blowhard talking sobs in govt, Ass sod i would love to slap him for what he has said.
Our fellow citizens,Americans,good decent people are suffering and dying while people stand around and talk about who does what when under whos authority,is sickening
We needed a Stormin Norman in this,attack attack attack the problem.
All those military bases up and down the coast,
And all the recently closed bases with housing still there.
Letting a few shooters decide on who gits out?
Unsafe enviroment? No Shii aattt sherlocks ,git those people out.
Well my nerves and emotions are shot,I pray for our country and would kill any one tryin g to disarm me in a crisis like that while I was trying to git out,and would not will not loan my equipment to a LEO who should have his own,and would git as many out as i could.
I would summarily execute rapists,and murderers on the spot in the superdome.
I will plan differant from now own and look for bans and shortages of all kinds in the firearms scene nationwide.
May be the un is coming with all the use of refugees terminology.
I am off for three days and could prolly git a week and would go down there to volunteer on my vac time,I will be checkin on this.
Shotgun and 308 for the looters and bad bad crminal element.
People are suffering and dying. The world is watching.
Super power? More like super soupy
Thanks and God bless all who are helping,rescueing those poor folks.
PS just re read this and there are a lot of I"s in here,this post is really not about me ,.
 
I have to agree. You'd think there would have been a constant parade of military craft going in with generators, lights, mre's, water, tarps for shade, etc. I'm truly suprised and dissapointed.
 
See Northcom. See also Mudville Gazette

And I was at Keesler AFB for training, lo these many years ago.

It just isn't possible to move much faster than is happening.

Finally, see Austin Bay
We’ve a million people dispossessed and they are suffering. Critics grouse that the response to Katrina’s devestation has been abysmally slow. Compared to what? Slow compared to our expectations is the correct answer. Compared to every other nation on the planet, we’re moving at warp speed to address a natural disaster of extraordinary magnitude.
Click to expand...
 
Interesting thing I just heard on the news a few minutes ago:

Police attempted to enter the Superdome in force, and were beaten back. Essentially, it looks like either the predators have taken over, or the population at large felt like it was being abused by the police.
 
"I could take a few flat bed trucks and have those folks out of there"

How are you going to move the estimated 50,000 to 100,000 out of New Orleans with a few trucks?

John
 
Yeah, most folks don't have the balls to blame God, so let's pick on Bush; he's a much easier target. :rolleyes:
 
Reply

Reply,I aint bashing the Pres,the lame govt officials running the show,
A few trucks,line em up.let the people git on,flat beds preferrably,and drive them out rd trip ,drop em off out of the Shi ttt ttttayyy, and back in for more folks,say a camp or staging area.
Turn the Sea Beas loose with some camps,etc.
Slow is correct and compared to what is corect ,altho the talk and some planning had to have taken place. what of the war gaming and tsunami relief effort training?
What I see are cops in SuVs and what we used to call six bys rolling thru the water empty driven by NGs.
Thanks for the links .I will check them out.
I still say attack the problem with action,any any all volunteers current and former military,come on and help.
I was impressed with the site of red cross trucks lining up to go in and help.
 
most folks don't have the balls to blame God
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Hmmmmm....

Interesting take on the root cause of the imminent demise of a once great city. I suppose that fundamentally it is GOD's fault at the most basic level.

OTOH...
Since GOD gave mankind free-will the real cause is the short sightedness of those who built their homes and businesses inside a great bowl that's 20' below sea level gambling that the sea could never break thru their supremely engineered dams.

Hmmmm...
Thinking - thinking - thinking...

I guess I'll go with option 2! It's man's fault that NO is no more and never to be again.
 
Well, if we expect the government to be responsible for us in every concievable location and instantly, that's all well and good--but that's a police state and we need to learn a new salute. And it wouldn't be any different, we'd just have the media muzzled.

Sure, we should drop complete care packages in there immediately. From what stocks, what stores do we have in place? I don't expect or want stockpiles like that all along the gulf coast for hurricanes, in texas and oklahoma in tornado alley, in California for earth quakes and mudslides, in the north east for blizzards--just what kind of boondoggle pork project do you think that would turn out to be? That bs about "well, we've got all that stuff over in Iraq"--that kind of movement takes time--it took us MONTHS to position that stuff for Iraq.

The issue is that we've brainwashed ourselves into thinking the government is the solution. Well, guess what--they aint. No matter how bad we want it to be true. Personal responsibility. No one is going to be as concerned about your safety and well being as you are personally.

You know what sucks--NY handled their issues, 9/11 and the blackout, with calm civil order. In the South, we lose our freakin minds like its LA or something. (Sorry for the good folks still stuck in LA--I like both of ya'. :p )
 
The very problem is that these dumb folks expected the government to come in on a chariot and save them just like that welfare check they've been getting. Didn't happen so they had no idea what to do.

They were given ample warning to leave, but many stayed and decided to loot the city. Where do we draw the line between the freedom of choice to do stupid things and the government's power to take you out of your home and MAKE you get the heck out. I tend to think that if they wanted to stay they have no right to complain about bad conditions.
 
Reply

Mud ,not sure of your response.
1 thing we saw was some authority stopping people with boats from going in to rescue folks,no govt involvement but the checkpoint road block telling them it was unsafe and getting dark etc.
I cannot find that story,and yes as a nation we should prepare for similar events,
We,as a nation are asleep if we do not pull together ahead of events like these. the govt should have some preps and plans.
I really cannot give good examples ,but the national hiway,strategic oil reserves and the whole NG come to mind.
All this worries and concerns me and some responses from a bunch of different forums on this topic.
to me it is more like tactics and training,strategy.
What I have seen is the squandering of resources,and giving a lot to other countries.
We should be united, a United States of America .
Some one has to lead and The President is sort of and believe he should be making this a top priority even over foriegn policy and Iraq.
We are donating some time and money and contemplating getting down there for a few short days.May need to contact a recongnized org. of some sort on that one.
We need a link on that police /dome story some one put up.
 
It just isn't possible to move much faster than is happening.
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BULLS***. Pres. Bush could look at the Chief of Staff of the Air Force and said "I want C-130s dropping pallets of MREs in New Orleans 12 hours. Cut thru the red tape, ignore the procurement laws, cancel the training schedules, just find planes, find MREs, marry them up, and drop them in round the clock -- or you will very publicly lose your job." AND IT WOULD HAPPEN.

On another note, I'm tired of hearing politicians bloviate about how NO will be rebuilt. That can wait; any consideration or talk of that can wait. Right now, feed the citizens, hydrate them, get them out. All else is secondary.
 
Dear Mr. President...

Commandeer every schoolbus within a radius, until you have approx. 1,500 vehicles. Grab a few dozen tankers of diesel and gas too.

Drive to New Orleans. Park at a good loading spot, and start loading. Work your way into the city, removing anyone who wants to leave as you reach 'em.

You're gonna have folks who want to prey upon society. Realize that the police do not understand how to deal with this situation. They can not fall back, form a perimeter, and then negotiate until they can haul someone off to jail. So they're doing nothing. Let the police direct traffic.

Take a few companies -yes, _companies_ - that's probably all you'll need - of those wild and crazy Marines along. Yup. Uncle Sam's Misguided Children. If someone shoots at the convoys, let the Marines shoot back. That's what they live for.

Put the refugees on these military bases that we're shutting down until we get things back together.

Now, quit having meetings, quit trying to worry about public opinion. Just do _something_. People will understand if it's screwed up. It's inaction that is unforgiveable.
 
Spartacus, saw something on the news a little while ago...

Some woman refugee was HIGHLY irate that all they they had to give her was some sort of _cold_ food. I suspect it was an MRE. What is good enough for our solidiers obviously isn't good enough for inner-city welfare recipients.

Maybe if she'd been a little hungrier.
 
Dolanp

http://drudgereport.com/
Go there now or the news or any of a number of uther places and see the sick and crippled and now dead setting in a god da mmned wheelchair,begging for help,asking for help ,who could not git out.
Now is not the time to critisize those there,but for us to help git them out,.
I will not armchair lecture or moralize any more on this one,this is all way beyound me.
All this Bull sh,bravado ,and our fellow citizen are calling us to arms .
God help us all.I am off for a while on this one.
 
Well, as New Orleans was originally a French city, maybe we should place a little blame them as well as Uncle Sam's Corp of Engineers.
I believe that Uncle Sugar is doing what they can and aid is going to be coming once they get ramped up. The darned storm hit only 3 days ago (wasn't it the 29th?). There was some pre-planning from what I read
http://www.fema.gov/
FEMA’s emergency teams and resources are being deployed and configured for coordinated response to Hurricane Katrina. This includes pre-staging critical commodities such as ice, water, meals, and tarps in various strategic locations to be made available to residents of affected areas.
FEMA’s Hurricane Liaison Team is onsite and working closely with the National Hurricane Center in Miami, Fla.
FEMA’s National Response Coordination Center and Regional Response Coordination Centers in Atlanta, Ga., and Denton, Texas, are operating around the clock, coordinating the prepositioning of assets and responding to state requests for assistance.
FEMA has deployed a National Emergency Response Team to Louisiana with a coordination cell positioned at the State Emergency Operations Center in Baton Rouge to facilitate state requests for assistance. In addition, four Advance Emergency Response Teams have been deployed to locations in Mississippi, Alabama and Florida. The teams include federal liaisons who work directly within county emergency operations centers to respond to critical needs as they are identified by local officials and prioritized by the state.
Rapid Needs Assessment teams have been prestaged in Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama.
Nine Urban Search and Rescue task forces and incident support teams have been deployed. The task forces are from Florida, Virginia, Maryland, Texas, Tennessee, Indiana, Ohio, and Missouri.
Thirty-one teams from the National Disaster Medical System (NDMS) have been deployed to staging areas in Anniston, Ala., Memphis, Tenn., Houston, Dallas, and New Orleans, including 23 Disaster Medical Assistance Teams. The teams bring truckloads of medical equipment and supplies with them and are trained to handle trauma, pediatrics, surgery and mental health problems. Two Veterinary Medical Assistance Teams are also included as part of NDMS assets deployed, which are able to support and rescue pets, and provide any needed veterinary medical care for rescue dogs.
Voluntary agencies, important partners in disasters, are prepared to augment local government services with shelters, mobile feeding units, water and clean-up supplies.
FEMA has 500 trucks of ice, 500 trucks of water and 350 trucks of meals ready to eat (MREs) available for distribution over the next 10 days.

Guns and unrest.
It's called survival after a Cat3 (or 4) hurricane in a low-lying region where the local gov't threw up their hands and said "Ya'll on yer own". Some of the looting is opportunistic greed, theft, payback (lawlessness)... some is survival.

Comparing this to 9-11 NYC is apples to oranges geographic-wise. One was condensed into a few square city blocks, this is spread out and wet.
Don't give up in dispair, the Cavalry is coming. Lots of hard work ahead for the entire nation.

Just another really big splinter as we slide down the bannister of life.
 
Oh, FEMA would be in there, except that folks were shooting at 'em. So the strategy is to "pull back until the situation is under control." Remember the Colorado police at Columbine?

Cops are NOT there to protect you.
 
Some woman refugee was HIGHLY irate that all they they had to give her was some sort of _cold_ food. I suspect it was an MRE. What is good enough for our solidiers obviously isn't good enough for inner-city welfare recipients.
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That's what I thought. And I know I heard here say "Army food and it was aweful".
 
bogie,
Interesting you should mention school buses. On a Columbus Ohio radio station today a tour bus company exec called with the answer. Because of the time requird to board and transport FEMA requires the buses have toilets. That's the problem with a school bus.
 
MREs normally come with a water activated heater. The water doesn't need to be clean and they certainly got enough dirty water there.

Sounds like bellyaching from someone that's gotten used to entitlements.
 
IIRC MREs normally have some way to heat the food if requird.
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They do. I forget what the fuel is called now, but it's in that little can... used to be, they used C4 (out of a claymore)- burns real hot real fast in a little stove made from one of the smaller cans, but stomp it out and it'll blow your foot off.
 
Well, that's quite nice.

Let the folks crap in buckets or on the floor in the dome or in a ditch in the field, but ohmigawd, they gotta have a toilet for a 2-3 hour drive to a bloody staging area.

Too Damn Many Bureaucrats.

Schoolbuses. 50-60 people can deal with a 2-3 hour drive to a place where they can get a coupla hots and a cot. Then put 'em on different buses when you have a chance.

This waiting around for the perfect conveyance is gonna kill folks.
 
In the 1970's, I was stationed at Pope AFB in North Carolina. We could pack up the entire 82 ABN Division with their equipment and have them anywhere in the world in 72 hours. If anyone suggests we can't move people and supplies into New Orleans, I say they're full of it. What we see going on is a gigantic cluster f*** with nobody in charge. There are too many agencies involved with too many plans and nobody to coordinate them.
 
Too Damn Many Bureaucrats.
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Yep. This is what you get when the bureaucrats rule the earth. Too many people get trained to obey the rules instead of getting trained to think, so, when faced with the new or the disordered, they sit around waiting for someone to tell them what to do instead of exercising initiative and ingenuity.

Last time I checked, them schoolbuses could pull over so people could get off to go tinkle in the woodline :fire:
 
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