Largest Army...

[Sheldon J]

Dillon Blue press October 2011 page 48 "The World's Biggest Army" according to data obtained from deer hunting licenses...

Estimated at 600,000 hunters in WI but that number is higher with 843,000 licenses sold, MI 750,000 with 1.56 million licenses sold, Penn 948,000 general hunting licenses sold...

One heck of a potential domestic army, largest in the world bar none....

http://www.horsepropertyguide.com/flipbooks/dillon/oct2011/object_files/main.swf

 

[CWL]

Just because someone hunts doesn't mean that they may work well with others or can operate high tech equipment, which is what a modern Army needs to do.

Don't worry though, we do have about 22 million veterans living in the USA.


add: Check out this site for list of largest armies in the world. Lets you understand why being a World Power takes more than just sheer number of "trigger gingers".
http://www.globalfirepower.com/

 

[cyclopsshooter]

Don't worry though, we do have about 22 million veterans living in the USA.

THIS is why posts on THR need a Facebook type like* button.

 

[303tom]

It was the hunters & shooters of the colonies that defeated the Brit`s.

 

[cyclopsshooter]

Yeah, but the Brit's weren't mechanized

 

[Jeff H]

It was the hunters & shooters of the colonies that defeated the Brit`s.

That was a long time ago

 

[rduckwor]

Look at the Taliban and Al Quaeda in the sandbox, specifically Afghanistan, they had some support against the Russians, but they have held us off pretty well with obsolete weapons and improvised explosives. I dare say the American ingenuity would rise to the occasion.

RMD

 

[blarby]

"there would be a rifle behind every blade of grass"

Mis-attributed, but applicable.

Quote:
It was the hunters & shooters of the colonies that defeated the Brit`s.
That was a long time ago

Yup, but we're a warlike country...depending on how you score it, somewhere in the 20 conflicts in 235 years category.

Every time, american civilians possession of arms seems to come up as a vital line of self defense..... I don't think something along those lines is so easily dismissed.

After all, that whole citizen militia gambit is the pretense under which we get to keep all these fine weapons, isn't it ?

 

[Murphy4570]

After all, that whole citizen militia gambit is the pretense under which we get to keep all these fine weapons, isn't it ?

Yes, but it is to defend ourselves from our OWN government as much as it is from foreign invaders.

 

[blarby]

Yes, but it is to defend ourselves from our OWN government as much as it is from foreign invaders.

"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."


Perhaps. Says secure...doesn't mention from who.


In hindsight, they should have made it a little clearer perhaps...but thats for another thread. Suffice to say they definitely should have specifically mentioned from Vulpes Newscorpis

 

[The_Next_Generation]

After seeing some interviews and videos online, it seems that the thinking, "We stand no chance against our modern mechanized military, the days of the Revolution are over." is relatively mainstream.

What makes people think that our nation's army would turn against it's own people, with all of their weapons to boot?

After all, soldiers were once civilians too. After speaking with my neighbor (Iraq and Afghanistan Veteran, Marine Corps.) it sounded like the majority of modern soldiers would side with the people if the government turned against them.

Is this just me or do others agree?

- The Next Generation

EDIT: Now that I think more about it, the current events in Egypt make for an interesting non-example..hmmm.

 

[blarby]

What makes people think that our nation's army would turn against it's own people, with all of their weapons to boot?

Well, one of the predominant questions on the ASVAB pertains to just this, actually....

 

[Bobson]

Well, one of the predominant questions on the ASVAB pertains to just this, actually....

I took my ASVAB in 2003, and don't remember the question(s) you're referring to, but I do believe many (but not necessarily most) servicemen would follow the order to attack American civilians, if that order were to come down at any point in the future.

 

[DeadLiver]

I would be inclined to agree with that statement.
In the still unlikely event of a real revolution where the military and nat'l guard were called out to counter a general rebellion. I believe that most of the force would turn against the government. Just from people in my network locally, we'd have a couple batteries of M109 howitzers with us....assuming that the Federal Government ever made that sort of thing necessary.

Personally, I don't think that it will ever happen. This nation will slowly vote away it's rights in exchange for promises of "security" until we all realize that we're living in Orwell's 1984 and can't do anything about it.

 

[Bobson]

This nation will slowly vote away it's rights in exchange for promises of "security" until we all realize that we're living in Orwell's 1984 and can't do anything about it.

I agree that this is much more likely than a second American civil war; or, at the very least, that this will happen long before a second civil war might take place.

 

[Murphy4570]

"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."


Perhaps. Says secure...doesn't mention from who.


In hindsight, they should have made it a little clearer perhaps...but thats for another thread. Suffice to say they definitely should have specifically mentioned from Vulpes Newscorpis

In the context given in the document we are discussing, the intended entity to defend against would be the Federal, centralized government. The word "state" in that text refers to the individual, sovereign States of America. Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Georgia, Virginia, et cetera. Basically, the Anti-Federalists were attempting to solidify and stupid-proof the document they were creating during the constitutional convention of 1787, and prevent the centralized government that was to be created from becoming too powerful. Hence the first ten amendments to the constitution, the "bill of rights". In particular note the 9th and 10th amendments as a "catch-all" instrument to curtail federal tyranny and wanton usurpation of the document that binds them, like chains bind a prisoner. Completely and without fail.

 

[average_shooter]

On the point of many in the federal armed services being on one side or the other should it come to that, Time Magazine just had an interesting article regarding "The Other 1%," referring to the military.

According to their studies, the majority of servicemembers today self-identify on the right-leaning end of the spectrum, tending to be Republican. Also, Time noted that the longer someone stayed in military service the more they tended to identify as Republican.

On its face that might not mean much, but it seems to me to imply that many would at least refuse assignments asking them to apply force towards American citizens. Also, we'd likely see many in leadership positions, officers and the like, working on the side of the citizenry.

 

[CapnMac]

much more likely than a second American civil war

This is a highly intriguing intellectual point. (If one difficult to keep firearms-oriented<sigh>.)

If the "1%" (or 2, or 3, or 5, or whatever percent) do something so egregious as to trigger belligerency, that percentage will face a distinct problem. In that the Armed Forces will be about the same percentage. And, modern, first-world militaries select for smarter-than-the-average-Sparky, too.

Which, to me, suggests it would be all-too-similar to 1860, with some following their Oath, some following their Leaders, some just following the herd.

Which, as it was in 1860, would be awful, horrific, terrible in every way.

And, a complete surprise to the n-percenters, too.

 

[NoirFan]

And yet we field the most expensive national defense forces in history. Kind of redundant, hm?

It was the hunters & shooters of the colonies that defeated the Brit`s.

No it wasn't, it was the French Navy. The citizen militia were fairly ineffective against the British, and the Continental Army had to learn Euro-style discipline and mass tactics before they were a match for the Redcoats.

According to their studies, the majority of servicemembers today self-identify on the right-leaning end of the spectrum, tending to be Republican. Also, Time noted that the longer someone stayed in military service the more they tended to identify as Republican.

On its face that might not mean much, but it seems to me to imply that many would at least refuse assignments asking them to apply force towards American citizens. Also, we'd likely see many in leadership positions, officers and the like, working on the side of the citizenry.

Political affiliation has little to do with willingness to kill your own civilians. If this really were to happen the military could just do what empires have always done; use troops from one region against rebels from another region. Don't tell me some Georgia good ol' boy wouldn't love the chance to blast an obnoxious Manhattan yuppie or vice versa.

 

[MtnCreek]

Just because someone hunts doesn't mean that they may work well with others or can operate high tech equipment, which is what a modern Army needs to do.

Don't worry though, we do have about 22 million veterans living in the USA.


add: Check out this site for list of largest armies in the world. Lets you understand why being a World Power takes more than just sheer number of "trigger gingers".
http://www.globalfirepower.com/

Thanks for the link; never seen that before. Also some good info at global security ‘dot’ org and cia world fact page.

I think if this Nation is ever overrun it would be more like a hostile takeover than an invasion.

 

[303tom]

Yeah, but the Brit's weren't mechanized

I have a Deuce & a Half.......

 

[memphisjim]

yeah the usa would present problems for any army including its own
so many vehicles, structures, guns and land
the greatest weakness is probably the reliance on electrical power
take out the power grid and cities lose running water

 

[SSN Vet]

Call me a pessimist....

I think our government will implode under its own weight.

Were raising up generations completely dependant on the nanny state to take care of them.

When the "real" economic collapse happens (making '08 look like a picnic) the only way the gubment will be able to make good on its myriad of promises will be to wholesale print money. Over night your life savings will be worthless! Then the Saudis and the Chinese will stop pegging the price of oil and the Won to the USD, and all the stuff we import will be ridiculously expensive. But there will be no capacity to manufacture even a snot rag left in the CONUS.

Chaos and anarchy.... like the Watts and Detroit riots simultaneously occurring in every US city.

No fuel for the police and the fire departments, let alone the military.

Municipalities all bankrupt, so no wages for the police and firemen. No wages for the military either.

Fracturing of the country along the lines of regional resources.

Bye bye birdie.

I just can't see how it can't happen.

 

[Wishoot]

Call me a pessimist....

I think our government will implode under its own weight.

Were raising up generations completely dependant on the nanny state to take care of them.

When the "real" economic collapse happens (making '08 look like a picnic) the only way the gubment will be able to make good on its myriad of promises will be to wholesale print money. Over night your life savings will be worthless! Then the Saudis and the Chinese will stop pegging the price of oil and the Won to the USD, and all the stuff we import will be ridiculously expensive. But there will be no capacity to manufacture even a snot rag left in the CONUS.

Chaos and anarchy.... like the Watts and Detroit riots simultaneously occurring in every US city.

No fuel for the police and the fire departments, let alone the military.

Municipalities all bankrupt, so no wages for the police and firemen. No wages for the military either.

Fracturing of the country along the lines of regional resources.

Bye bye birdie.

I just can't see how it can't happen.

Man this is a depressing commentary. Unfortunately, it seems like we're heading down this path. I don't have a lot of faith in our current government and I pray that a positive and peaceful change will come soon.

 

[Shovelhead]

The next generation seems to be dependant on "finding an 'App' for that" for every task or they're lost.
They seem to think all food comes from a mysterious well of foodstuffs in the back of the grocery store.
"Blue Collar" is a dirty word, and people who work with their hands are looked on as second class citizens.
This is the way they were raised.

Unless the 'Redneck country folk' are willing to continue to break their backs to supply for those elitists unwilling to work to provide for themselves, either all of our supplies are going to come from overseas, or "some" folks are in for a world of disappointment.