Leather like wad

[rusty from italy]

Hi!
Nobody try the leather like wad material??

I'm still searching the right recipe for decent shoting from my .451 volunteer rifle!

I think to try 2/16 leather (3 mm)

I've tested cardwad, felt, corn, nothing...but after 4-5 shoot the groups enlarged too much!
I didn't shoot long range, for me the goal is a tight group at 100mt for muzzleload italian champinship in the whitworth category.
Actually i load a 450 grain lyman bullet on top of 64 to 67 grains of fffg (i find the fffg granulation better than ffg in that rifle)
ciao
Rusty

 

[Steve499]

Rusty, I have a .451 volunteer also, and have tried everything, too. Except leather. One thing I learned about mine was that it wanted the bedding re-done. I relieved the barrel channel in front of the rear band so the stock didn't touch the barrel at all, and also relieved the inside of the top on the front band so it didn't touch the barrel either. From the rear band forward the barrel touches nowhere until it reaches the brass at the stock tip where I have a shim just to put a little upward pressure. I also found out that I needed to grasp the stock with my left hand on the checkering just behind the rear band, every time. If I am shooting from a bench I often will rest the rifle on the sandbags directly. With this rifle, unless I hold the stock as I said and rest my hand on the bags, I get poorer groups. I'm sure it has something to do with the harmonics.

My quest with this rifle is ongoing. I'm shooting 80 grains of Swiss FFF and a 550 grain grease groove bullet right now, with a card wad between them, and it's shooting well enough to keep me interested, but there's room for improvement. I've tried three different bullets, one of them paper patched, and have experimented with all the possible variations on the cleaning process. Now I use a patch moistened with rubbing alcohol, followed by a dry patch between shots, done with the rifle empty. Some load the powder into the rifle and then ram a wad over it with a wet patch on the rod so the bore is cleaned ahead of the powder and fouling isn't pushed into the flash channel.

I killed two deer with it this fall and was impressed with the performance of that big bullet on game. The longest shot was exactly 100 yards, measured with a laser range finder later, and even though I want to be able to shoot one hole groups at that distance, the deer didn't notice I hadn't quite achieved that, yet.

The target shown was fired at 100 yards with three different changes to the loading/cleaning process to try to duplicate the range of conditions I might experience while hunting.

I hadn't thought about leather wads, Rusty, but I'm going to try them!


Steve

 

[sjohns]

dam Steve....

NICE group

 

[rusty from italy]

Hi Steve!
I know your story about volunteer i readed an old post from you about it, the path followed by me is similar, first thing i adjusted the bore channel in the stock, then a bedding under the breech and the band, a good fitting of the lock with the base of the nipple that don't force tied toghether!
Mine bore have a problem, is oversized, a bullet that fit well the bore must sized to .454, another volunteer in my shooting club need perfectly .451 slug.

For first i selected the Lyman mould 451114 special bullet for volunteer, but is slightly undersized, now i'm testing tle lyman 457121PH, sized to .454 with a Lee press mount sizer, the grease groove are filled with a melt of beewax ad animal fat.
The problem of this bullet is the last grease groove near the base it's too near the base, maybe the pressure and the hot of gases deform the flat base
This the reason for the leather, is strongly than cardwad, is hard respect felt so to transmit the impulse and push the bullet in the bore rifling!

I must test the alloy too, now i'm using pure lead, i thinking it's too soft and it resize in the rifle, jumping it and take less gyroscopic impulse and lower rotation, expecially after some shot when the bore is build up by the powder fouling, passing a pathc between the shot is not a real cleaning, delayed only the complete build up uf the bore!

You clean the barrel with lead remover somtimes??

ciao
Rusty

 

[DaveP (UK)]

If your getting good results with the first few shots and then a falling off in performance that does suggest a few possibilities:
Some type of fatigue - do you find the rifle heavy or the recoil unpleasant?
Barrel heating up - take your time!
Fouling building up - probably the one to think about here. I know a few people who shoot these rifles and the service version (.577). They dont seem to be worried about lead fouling. Some swab out between shots, some dont!. Taken as a group they seem to have decided that the right bullet is the thing to go for, with the right lube a close second. Changing the lubricant can have a marked effect, they tell me.
In the present occasion why not try a session where you carry out a comprehensive cleaning between shots. Not a way of life to adopt perhaps, but if it improved things then it would appear that lube or cleaning routines need attention.

I couldnt find a picture of the mould you mention or the bullet from it. Is it a flat base? Some of the .577 shooters in particular prefer a minie style.

 

[rusty from italy]

Dave, in .577 (.58) use a minie bullet me too, in .451 i've never try miniè, the mould i have for .45 minie is to much undersized for that rifle, is good for Pedersoli Tryon

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lymanproducts/bpmold.htm

This is the link to lyyman mould, the first two moulds are the mine kind.

The test firing is made with rifle on the rest, so to minimize personal error and fatigue of the shooter, this saturday i'll give a try to alloy bullet made with 20-1 alloy.

ciao
Rusty