TheFederalistWeasel
member
I am going thru a very interesting class at present put on by the US Secret Service; it’s a defensive/offensive driving class for law enforcement.
It’s put on for any qualified LEA by the USSS and they bring everything to you, in the form of classrooms on wheels and huge motion simulators inside of semi-tractor trailer trucks, it’s pretty darn cool!
Anyway…
Back to the topic at hand
As with most all cops we eventually turned to war stories and whatnot, which evolved to all that was wrong in the world today to guns….
Over lunch with one of the USSS instructors we talked firearms, he is also Master Firearms Instructor for the USSS and trains their Protective Service Agents gun fighting skills.
He sat on two of the three review boards, where they choose their last issue handgun, the SIG 229 in. 357SIG.
We discussed the current trend in LE as far as issue weapons go and he even took it a step further for us, weaving into our little lunchtime discussion some of his words he teaches in his administrations classes to new Supervisors, Chiefs and Sheriffs when asked.
He brought up the topic of the well founded idea that what drives LEA’s to buy certain items is not quality, reputation or pedigree but price, plain and simple.
Why so many departments including federal agencies went to the Glock.
Also, not only does Glock have the cheapest price but also they have the absolute fastest delivery time for any major contract supplier for any of the major gun makers.
These two reasons alone swayed the FBI into the Glock because SIG could not deliver the amount of pistols needed in the time frame Glock could.
He also relived the days when Glock first came onto the scene, their timing was picture perfect according to him, they arrived at a time when the Hi-capacity demand in LE was growing, gaining momentum and the options were few and pricey.
When the FBI penned the Glock contract, they ordered in the thousands and Glock basically sold them at around $195.00 each, this included 3 mags and a case.
According to him Glock has around $100.00 in each pistol out the door.
SIG and even Beretta could not even come close to that price, at nearly $375.00 for the SIG and $325.00 for the Beretta.
In one of the smartest marketing moves to date, Glock extended this price to many local and state LEA’s if they too would sign on to the Glock bandwagon, which many did, basing their decision to buy on the “testing†the feds had done.
BTW, the Glock failed nearly every safety test the USSS put it in and the Glock failed a number of the tests the US Marshals Service and the US Customs Service demonstrated.
The USMS and USCS were bound by budget constraints so the Glock won out shortly after the FBI began carrying it widespread. But the USSS had a mission that allowed them to demand more from a gun and Congress agreed allowing them to buy the SIG.
The current trend in Local and State LE is to migrate to the lowest bidder and up until the creation of Homeland Security the same was true for the Feds.
Now in this post 9/11 world with the federal cash flowing freely and budgets busting at the seems we see that those agencies which once had to shop cheap and bought Glocks are now opting for the higher dollar SIG’s and HK’s.
HLSD is forking out around an average of $350.00 each for the SIG’s and HK’s.
The department I work for issues the Glock 22 and when we told him that most here do not like it he said he was not surprised, that he has heard that a lot in the past. He said that many cops who are exposed to the Glock end up disliking the gun.
Many Federal Agents he spoke of especially the FBI and USMS, which mandate the type of gun new field agents, are issued, and are vocal about their dislike of the gun. Many wish for what he said, they describe as a higher quality gun such as a SIG or HK.
In the end it’s about price and nothing more, which drives so many LEO’s to carry the Glock.
Glock practically gives them to us and on top of that will take all of our confiscated weapons in as trade, as well as any duty guns we want to trade in too.
Many departments are now running scared about anything which might be a liability these days also run to the Glock because so many people followed the Feds off the cliff and now they can point to the fact that many LE including FEDS carry it, so it must be a good gun!
So far courts have bought this argument at least in the civil cases involving LEO shootings where the gun was questioned.
When Dodge introduced the Enforcer package for the Intrepid as a police car, it sold like hot cakes because it could be had for around $11,000 compared to the Ford CV which will set you back a cool $23,000.
I drown a Dodge Intrepid EP for a PD near Atlanta for a year and I can attest they are crap, not even in the same league as the Ford CV.
Asked the Chief once why he bought them, his answer was simple they were cheap and he could buy two for every one CV.
Funny, he gave me the same answer when I asked him why he went with the Glock over the SIG 229 when they traded up from the old Smith 5906 9mm.
Radio equipment at one point use to be that way, Motorola made a killing off refurbished radios and I cannot remember ever being issued a new radio ever in my LE career, now having worked for 4 departments.
That is changing, a forced change due to the 800mHz systems now becoming mandatory nationwide by 2008 to 2010.
Department like mine are moving away from leather duty gear in favor of nylon gear, they say it’s because of weight and longevity but when you really get down to it it’s price, the average set of leather will cost about $500.00 per officer when the same set in nylon will cost $300.00.
In the end it’s all about price not quality and that goes for our handguns to our duty gear.
It’s put on for any qualified LEA by the USSS and they bring everything to you, in the form of classrooms on wheels and huge motion simulators inside of semi-tractor trailer trucks, it’s pretty darn cool!
Anyway…
Back to the topic at hand
As with most all cops we eventually turned to war stories and whatnot, which evolved to all that was wrong in the world today to guns….
Over lunch with one of the USSS instructors we talked firearms, he is also Master Firearms Instructor for the USSS and trains their Protective Service Agents gun fighting skills.
He sat on two of the three review boards, where they choose their last issue handgun, the SIG 229 in. 357SIG.
We discussed the current trend in LE as far as issue weapons go and he even took it a step further for us, weaving into our little lunchtime discussion some of his words he teaches in his administrations classes to new Supervisors, Chiefs and Sheriffs when asked.
He brought up the topic of the well founded idea that what drives LEA’s to buy certain items is not quality, reputation or pedigree but price, plain and simple.
Why so many departments including federal agencies went to the Glock.
Also, not only does Glock have the cheapest price but also they have the absolute fastest delivery time for any major contract supplier for any of the major gun makers.
These two reasons alone swayed the FBI into the Glock because SIG could not deliver the amount of pistols needed in the time frame Glock could.
He also relived the days when Glock first came onto the scene, their timing was picture perfect according to him, they arrived at a time when the Hi-capacity demand in LE was growing, gaining momentum and the options were few and pricey.
When the FBI penned the Glock contract, they ordered in the thousands and Glock basically sold them at around $195.00 each, this included 3 mags and a case.
According to him Glock has around $100.00 in each pistol out the door.
SIG and even Beretta could not even come close to that price, at nearly $375.00 for the SIG and $325.00 for the Beretta.
In one of the smartest marketing moves to date, Glock extended this price to many local and state LEA’s if they too would sign on to the Glock bandwagon, which many did, basing their decision to buy on the “testing†the feds had done.
BTW, the Glock failed nearly every safety test the USSS put it in and the Glock failed a number of the tests the US Marshals Service and the US Customs Service demonstrated.
The USMS and USCS were bound by budget constraints so the Glock won out shortly after the FBI began carrying it widespread. But the USSS had a mission that allowed them to demand more from a gun and Congress agreed allowing them to buy the SIG.
The current trend in Local and State LE is to migrate to the lowest bidder and up until the creation of Homeland Security the same was true for the Feds.
Now in this post 9/11 world with the federal cash flowing freely and budgets busting at the seems we see that those agencies which once had to shop cheap and bought Glocks are now opting for the higher dollar SIG’s and HK’s.
HLSD is forking out around an average of $350.00 each for the SIG’s and HK’s.
The department I work for issues the Glock 22 and when we told him that most here do not like it he said he was not surprised, that he has heard that a lot in the past. He said that many cops who are exposed to the Glock end up disliking the gun.
Many Federal Agents he spoke of especially the FBI and USMS, which mandate the type of gun new field agents, are issued, and are vocal about their dislike of the gun. Many wish for what he said, they describe as a higher quality gun such as a SIG or HK.
In the end it’s about price and nothing more, which drives so many LEO’s to carry the Glock.
Glock practically gives them to us and on top of that will take all of our confiscated weapons in as trade, as well as any duty guns we want to trade in too.
Many departments are now running scared about anything which might be a liability these days also run to the Glock because so many people followed the Feds off the cliff and now they can point to the fact that many LE including FEDS carry it, so it must be a good gun!
So far courts have bought this argument at least in the civil cases involving LEO shootings where the gun was questioned.
When Dodge introduced the Enforcer package for the Intrepid as a police car, it sold like hot cakes because it could be had for around $11,000 compared to the Ford CV which will set you back a cool $23,000.
I drown a Dodge Intrepid EP for a PD near Atlanta for a year and I can attest they are crap, not even in the same league as the Ford CV.
Asked the Chief once why he bought them, his answer was simple they were cheap and he could buy two for every one CV.
Funny, he gave me the same answer when I asked him why he went with the Glock over the SIG 229 when they traded up from the old Smith 5906 9mm.
Radio equipment at one point use to be that way, Motorola made a killing off refurbished radios and I cannot remember ever being issued a new radio ever in my LE career, now having worked for 4 departments.
That is changing, a forced change due to the 800mHz systems now becoming mandatory nationwide by 2008 to 2010.
Department like mine are moving away from leather duty gear in favor of nylon gear, they say it’s because of weight and longevity but when you really get down to it it’s price, the average set of leather will cost about $500.00 per officer when the same set in nylon will cost $300.00.
In the end it’s all about price not quality and that goes for our handguns to our duty gear.
