Lessons learned from recent NO bug-outs

Status
Not open for further replies.
It's funny - every time I start to read one of these "bug-out-bag" threads, I think, "aw, I've read all this before" .... And then I find something else I've left out.

Great tips, Preacherman - thanks.
 
I think one key benefit, if you can even think of benmefits as you watch this happen, is that it has made us all take stock of our own abilities to survive, and take action where necessary.

Personally, after watching this, I've reahed a couple of conclusions about my own needs.

FRS radios. Our plan is to run in both vehicles if necessary. Can't count on the cell phones for communication. FRS radios are inexpensive, small sized, and work so long as we have batteries. And we always have batteries, since we have kids with electronic toys.

Ammo. I need more. Nothing fancy. Just a few hundred rounds of quality ammo to have stored and forget about until needed. Went shooting last weekend, and I've only got enough 9mm to fill the magazines.

Gas cans. Got one. Need more. Also, big cans for non-potable water. Hate to fill a radiator after a hose leak with my bottled drinking water.

Travel grill. Sure, a backpacking stove would be more desirable size-wise, but a traveling gas grill would do better if we cannot build a campfire, like in a parking lot along the way. A few bottles of gas, and I'd be set.

Lightsticks. Need to get some. No batteries needed. No flames to worry about around the kids.

Maps. Good road atlas to help find alternate routes as necessary.

Let's keep this going. Great to bounce ideas off each other.
 
Potable water may be in very short supply, and trying to travel with a 500 gal tank wont work too well - filtration systems may be handy.
 
I think it might be a good idea to run an occasional load up drill. That way families could practice getting everything loaded up and out the door. Then if they ever need to do it for real things should go much smoother.

I really feel for people that have no where to go. It sounds like their best bet would be to drive North to a larger city and look for a new job and an apartement. Putting your life on hold and waiting for things to get better in NO is not going to be a very good decision financially.
 
Awesome - though I don't live below sea level, I have a mild evacuation bag packed for "what ifs" and stock it a little better for snow season. Good info.
 
Don't forget good lights!

I prefer LED flashlights. I have a Streamlight TL-2 for "tactical" uses, as well as a UK 4AA LED (excellent, inexpensive, tough light -- under $25 from Brightguy.com) for general utility. These have made great gifts for family members.

I also use an Inova X-1 as a personal utility light. The spot (with little sidespill) is good for moving around the house at night without disturbing others. My old CMG Utility Tasklight is also useful.

The UK, CMG and Inova all use AAs. I need to find out if Lithium AAs can be used in any of them, to take advantage of the 10-year shelf life.

Streamlight TL-2 LED "tactical" light
attachment.jpg


UL 4AA eLED utility light (bottom), shown with a Mini MagLite
attachment.jpg


Inova X-1 utility spotlight
attachment.gif


Regards,
Dirty Bob
 

Attachments

  • uk_4aa_eled.jpg
    uk_4aa_eled.jpg
    10.6 KB · Views: 2,676
  • inova_x1.gif
    inova_x1.gif
    11 KB · Views: 2,691
  • tl-2_led.jpg
    tl-2_led.jpg
    8.1 KB · Views: 2,667
Last edited:
One of the best threads I've ever read, anywhere! Thank you Preacherman.

Don't wait too long to bug out!I spent a few years on the NC coast and had to react to a few storms. Most people wait until they are certain they need to leave, or until they are told to leave. That's too late, you leave when the need is likely, not certain. Politicians are not going to risk making a decision until they are certain. By the time the Mayor of New Orleans gave the order, it was way too late.

If you live in a hurricane area, you should know a thing or two about hurricanes. Knowing how hurricanes work allows you to make decisions on your own. Last year I was in Cape Hatteras the week Charlie came through. One day the Park Ranger came through handing out info about closing the campgrounds. I said that I would be gone or close to it by the time they decided to close. We all got a chuckle two days later when they came around to announce the closing of the campground. I was just about ready to pull out. I avoided the gridlock leaving the island because it was all behind me.
 
Ham (Amateur) radio. Here's where it gets good, IMO. I got my ticket last month. Although you need a license, the entry-level Technician class license isn't hard to get, and the info you learn while studying for the exam can be useful. You can get a good handheld (AKA "handie talkie" or "HT") for as little as $100 which will allow you to transmit and receive on the 2M FM band. These are good for commo up to several miles if you have line of sight. I can hit a 2M repeater ~10 miles away from inside my house with my Yaesu VX-5RS. Once I get my General ticket I'll be able to use the HF bands and transmit much longer distances without relying on a repeater.

Dave, PM me please or start a thread at APS. I would like to discuss this further.

Thanks,
 
Just got my Ham radio license as well.

A 2-meter handi-talkie is good for about that 10 miles, and in a disaster, I'd bet the repeaters are knocked out.

On the other hand, a high-wattage rig with a properly mounted directional antenna can go 150+ miles (as I heard last night, when I chatted with a Duluth, MN ham in Minneapolis).
 
I've had a day to think further about lessons to be learned from my friends' experience in evacuating New Orleans, and other feedback. Here are some more ideas.

1. Route selection is very, very important. My friends (and their friends) basically looked at the map, found the shortest route to me (I-10 to Baton Rouge and Lafayette, then up I-49 to Alexandria), and followed it slavishly. This was a VERY bad idea, as something over half-a-million other folks had the same route in mind... Some of them took over twelve hours for what is usually a four-hour journey. If they'd used their heads, they would have seen (and heard, from radio reports) that going North up I-55 to Mississippi would have been much faster. There was less traffic on this route, and they could have turned left and hit Natchez, MS, and then cut across LA on Route 84. This would have taken them no more than five or six hours, even with the heavier evacuation traffic. Lesson: think outside the box, and don't assume that the shortest route on the map in terms of distance will also be the shortest route in terms of time.

2. A few thoughts on the social implications of a disaster situation. Feedback from my contacts in the LSP and other agencies is very worrying. They keep harping on the fact that the "underclass" that's doing all the looting is almost exclusively Black and inner-city in composition. The remarks they're reporting include such statements as "I'm ENTITLED to this stuff!", "This is payback time for all Whitey's done to us", and "This is reparations for slavery!". Also, they're blaming the present confused disaster-relief situation on racism: "Fo sho, if Whitey wuz sittin' here in tha Dome waitin' for help, no way would he be waitin' like we is!" No, I'm not making up these comments... they are as reported by my buddies. This worries me very much. If we have such a divide in consciousness among our city residents, then when we hit a SHTF situation, we're likely to be accused of racism, paternalism, oppression, and all sorts of other crimes just because we want to preserve law and order. If we, as individuals and families, provide for our own needs in emergency, and won't share with others (whether they're of another race or not) because we don't have enough to go round, we're likely to be accused of racism rather than pragmatism, and taking things from us can (and probably will) be justified as "Whitey getting his just desserts". I'm absolutely not a racist, but the racial implications of the present situation are of great concern to me. The likes of Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and the "reparations for slavery" brigade appear to have so polarized inner-city opinion that these folks are (IMHO) no longer capable of rational thought concerning such issues as looting, disaster relief, etc.

3. The above has obvious implications for security. If one has successfully un-assed the danger zone, one will be in an environment filled, to a greater or lesser extent, with other evacuees. How many of them will have provided for their needs? How many of them will rely on obtaining from others the things they need? In the absence of immediate State or relief-agency assistance, how many of them will feel "entitled" to obtain these necessities any way they have to, up to and including looting, murder and mayhem? Large gathering-places for refugees suddenly look rather less desirable... and being on one's own, or in an isolated spot with one's family, also looks less secure. One has to sleep sometime, and while one sleeps, one is vulnerable. Even one's spouse and children might not be enough... there are always going to be vulnerabilities. One can hardly remain consciously in Condition Yellow while bathing children, or making love! A team approach might be a viable solution here - see point 6 below.

4. There seems to be a severe case of "too many chiefs, not enough Indians" in New Orleans at the moment. The mayor has already blown his top about the levee breach: he claims that he had a plan in place to fix it by yesterday evening, but was overruled by Baton Rouge, who sent in others to do something different. This may or may not be true... My LSP buddies tell me that they're getting conflicting assignments and/or requests from different organizations and individuals. One will send out a group to check a particular area for survivors: but when they get there, they find no-one, and later learn that another group has already checked and cleared the area. Unfortunately, in the absence of centralized command and control, the information is not being shared amongst all recovery teams. Also, there's alleged to be conflict between City officials and State functionaries, with both sides claiming to be "running things": and some individuals in the Red Cross, FEMA, and other groups appear to be refusing to take instructions from either side, instead (it's claimed) wanting to run their own shows. This is allegedly producing catastrophic confusion and duplication of effort, and may even be making the loss of life worse, in that some areas in need of rescuers aren't getting them. (I don't know if the same problems are occurring in Mississippi and/or Alabama, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were.) All of this is unofficial and off-the-record, but it doesn't surprise me to hear it. Moral of the story: if you want to survive, don't rely on the government or any government agency (or private relief organization, for that matter) to save you. Your ass is in your own hands - don't drop it!

5. Long-term vision appears to be sadly lacking at present. Everyone is focused on the immediate, short-term objective of rescuing survivors. However, there are monumental problems looming, that need immediate attention, but don't seem to be getting it right now. For example: the Port of Louisiana is the fifth-largest in the world, and vital to the economy, but the Coast Guard is saying (on TV) that they won't be able to get it up and running for three to six months, because their primary focus is on search and rescue, and thereafter, disaster relief. Why isn't the Coast Guard pulled off that job now, and put to work right away on something this critical? There are enough Navy, Marine and Air Force units available now to take over rescue missions. Another example: there are over a million refugees from the Greater New Orleans area floating around. They need accommodation and food, sure: but most of them are now unemployed, and won't have any income at all for the next six to twelve months. There aren't nearly enough jobs available in this area to absorb this workforce. What is being done to find work for them, even in states remote from the problem areas? The Government for sure won't provide enough for them in emergency aid to be able to pay their bills. What about mortgages on properties that are now underwater? The occupants both can't and won't pay; the mortage holders will demand payment; and we could end up with massive foreclosures on property that is worthless, leaving a lot of folks neck-deep in debt and without homes (even damaged ones). What is being done to plan for this, and alleviate the problem as much as possible? I would have thought that the State government would have had at least the skeleton of an emergency plan for these sorts of things, and that FEMA would have the same, but this doesn't seem to be the case. Why weren't these things considered in the leisurely days pre-disaster, instead of erupting as immediate and unanswered needs post-disaster?

6. This leads me to consider my own emergency planning. I've planned to cover an evacuation need, and could probably survive with relative ease for between two weeks and one month: but what if I had been caught up in this mess? What would I do about earning a living, paying mortgages, etc.? If I can't rely on the State, I for darn sure had better be able to rely on myself! I certainly need to re-examine my insurance policies, to ensure that if disaster strikes, my mortgage, major loans, etc. will be paid off (or that I will receive enough money to do this myself). I also need to provide for my physical security, and must ensure that I have supplies, skills and knowledge that will be "marketable" in exchange for hard currency in a post-disaster situation. The idea of a "team" of friends with (or to) whom to bug out, survive, etc. is looking better and better. Some of the team could take on the task of keeping a home maintained (even a camp-type facility), looking after kids, providing base security, etc. Others could be foraging for supplies, trading, etc. Still others could be earning a living for the whole team with their skills. In this way, we'd all contribute to our mutual survival and security in the medium to long term. Life might be a lot less comfortable than prior to the disaster, but hey - we'd still have a life! This bears thinking about, and I might just have to start building "team relationships" with nearby THR members!

7. The "bank problem" bears consideration. I was at my bank this morning, depositing checks I'd been given by my visitors in exchange for cash. The teller warned me bluntly that it might be weeks before these checks could be credited to my account, as there was no way to clear them with their issuing banks, which were now under water and/or without communications facilities. He also told me that there had been an endless stream of folks trying to cash checks on South Louisiana banks, without success. He warned me that some of these local banks will almost certainly fail, as they don't have a single branch above water, and the customers and businesses they served are also gone - so checks drawn on them will eventually prove worthless. Even some major regional banks had run their Louisiana "hub" out of New Orleans, and now couldn't access their records. I think it might be a good idea to have a "bug-out bank account" with a national bank, so that funds should be available anywhere they have a branch, rather than keeping all one's money in a single bank (particularly a local one) or credit union. This is, of course, over and above one's "bug-out stash" of ready cash.

8. Finally, helping one's friends is likely to prove expensive. I estimate that I'm out over $1,000 at the moment, partly from having all my supplies consumed, and partly from making cash available to friends who couldn't cash their checks. I may or may not get some of this back in due course. I don't mind it - if I were in a similar fix, I hope I could lean on my friends for help in the same way, after all! - but I hadn't made allowance for it. I shall have to do so in future, as well as planning to contribute to costs incurred by those who offer me hospitality under similar circumstances.

Just some thoughts to ponder. Any more ideas from our members?
 
Trebor commented, " Don't live in a Hurricane zone.

Don't live in a known earthquake zone (that one's harder since the New Madrid fault is in the midwest. Quake's can happen even if you aren't in California)

Don't live on a known flood plain.

Don't live below sea level if you are near the ocean.

Don't live where there is a known risk of mudslides or wildfires.

In other words, to avoid having to evacuate at the last minute, move away from those dangerous areas ahead of time."

I had all that, but there are no jobs in Cleveland and I ended up in Florida, hey, at least I live on a hill! 60 feet above sea level.

Geoff
Who posted hurricane info at work, the "Preacherman List" will join it.
 
Preacherman; Thank you again for your insights. I have been watching this mess play out and had the same thoughts that basically the city of New Orleans and the state of Louisianna were woefully unprepared and no longer in control of the crisis. I am sitting high and dry in Pa. and thought maybe I was too far removed and that I was missing something from my perspective.

Unfortunatly I don't think this is done getting bad yet. People are hungry, thirsty, tired and soon will be getting sick and watching their families die. Meanwhile the government they've placed their trust in is unable to do enough, fast enough to save them. I listen to comments these people are making to the news crews and I hear a desperation in their voices that is truely frightening. They feel abandoned, betrayed, scared, desperate and are near panic. It is going to get ugly down there real soon. God be with them all.
 
When disaster strikes you do what you gotta do and if that involves taking in refugees (preferably family and close friends) you accept them. If it involves packing your truck and waving goodbye to your home you do it early. Make a plan and when the time comes, execute the plan.

Up until now I thought my plans were maybe a bit over the top, but the cash in my BOB now seems correct and with the price of fuel doing what it's doing, I may add even more cash.

What else do I plan to add:
More food and other consumables so that I'm not competing for stuff to eat on the road or at my destination. I already had camping/hiking stuff including small stoves (Svea 123, Optimus 111B) and fuel, titanium pots & utensils.
Fuel to get there, with that thought I just bought two plastic 5 gal gas cans which will get me another 220 miles down the road and should be enough to get me there and back assuming normal driving. Once you slow down to bumper-bumper stop and go speeds, fuel economy suffers so the extra fuel should be very useful. Even if I don't need it, it's not like fuel is something I won't use eventually.
From what I'm seeing in NOLA, I'll be adding a lot more in the hygiene department, soap, shampoo, toothpaste et al. Stuff to stay clean and maybe a gallon of unscented chlorine bleach and laundry detergent.

Bottom line is don't assume that you'll buy what you forgot when you get there. This is a logistics nightmare and it's much better to have than to be looking.

Those who plan ahead and stockpile needed supplies do not stress the system and make life a lot easier than those who hoard in the hour of need.
 
Preacherman - If any of those checks fail to clear I'll be in for a reimbursment fund. Don't be shy to make a post requesting such. Heck, if I can pony up $10 to get blackrazor a new bolt for his .50, I can pony up at least that much to help you out.
 
Excellent thread, much food for thought. Thank you for sharing!

I second Strumruger's firedrill suggestion. The best plans in the world are useless if they aren't tested, practiced, and refined. My B/SIL live outside Albuquerque, and while they don't have hurricanes or floods, they do have wildfires.

It's just the two of them, but they also have three dogs and two cats who they'd never leave behind. Critters add an extra layer of complexity. They have a small trailier, and prepared a list of stuff to pack for evacuation, but it wasn't until they actually had a fire scare and had to pack up that they got a reality check on what they really could pack and carry reasonably. Fortunately, it was just a scare, but the list is a lot different now, priorities have been re-thought, some stuff is just left packed and pre-staged all the time, other things are grouped for easy gathering if TSHTF.

Chance favors the prepared mind.

My tip: I have a 160 Gb external USB drive that I back up to weekly. I figure it's much easier to grab that and split rather than trying to hump the computer to the car in the event of an emergency. I also have hardcopies of pertinent docs in a waterproof bag and all my Cr cards, acct #, etc in my PDA (now al I need to do is get a spare charger for it and the cell phone for the BoB.
 
Sumpnz, thanks for the offer, but I'd rather you donated to the Salvation Army or other charity of your choice for relief work in NO. I consider my expenses to be my contribution to disaster relief.
 
My observations for what I will carry.

1. More water than food. I'm a little chubby so I can loose a few pounds anyway. Just keep some vitimans handy. Water filter kit would be nice. I have 7 gallons of water right next to me in a container that I have kept for several years (I change the water every now and then.)

2. Weapons. Realisticly, I would probably only take my 10/22 and my SKS, probably my Astra .357 as well. My Garand and 22-250 are too heavy for all the other stuff I will need. My AK I don't trust yet. My 10/22 is light and has a nice folding stock and you can cary lots of 22LR. Most people will probably find an easier target when lead in any form is flying their way. Use the SKS for the heavier stuff. It pains me to leave everything else behind, but the choice has to be made. If possible I would take as much as I can.

3. Try to travel by car, but plan on traveling on foot. If you have to ditch you're car. Take the above and remove an important part from the guns you have to leave behind. (Bolt from my bolt guns, trigger group from my Garand.)

4. Camp out of you're car if the roads are cloged. If you're moving really slow and wasting gas, get to an "out of the way" place and wait for it to clear. In the case of NO, you would have probably felt more of the storm, but at least you would not be driving. Try to find a wind break if possible (Stay away from trees.) Again, I'm in ND right now so this may or may not have been a good idea.

There is another thread about a SHTF bike. It was a good read and in light of current events it would be a good read.
 
The easiest way to carry 13,000 gallons of water.
Pocket_Produktseite.gif


Katadyn Pocket Filter ~$200.00. It would be priceless in a disaster zone like the one on the Gulf Coast.
 
Here is another thing I don't think I have seen. Someone suggested a chainsaw, but I think an axe would serve better, especially if gas is running low. Take a metal file too, and that axe will serve for a long time.
 
Someone suggested a chainsaw, but I think an axe would serve better
Yeah, in a camping situation where firewood is all you're concerned about that might be a good idea. However, if I was having to clear downed trees from the road while making my escape the last thing I want to do is play Paul Bunyan when I could be playing Tim Taylor.
 
For those interested in communications check out the ARRL.

Mike in VA, if your relatives are interested have them get together with some of us next time we have a shoot. Also ask them to look into building a pool or pond. Often the fire department will not be able to bring their own water but if there is water on site they may be able to get a pumper in. At least with water your brother might have a chance of doing something himself.

And he would have a guaranteed water supply.

A firebreak is something he could make himself.

I have hinted about caches in other threads, I will bring up the subject again here. At destinations and waypoints you can keep small caches of supplies handy. If Preacherman's home was a potential destination I would store supplies there, and I would contribute to his stores in payment for this.

In Louisiana where water is abundant filters are easier to carry than water at 8lbs/gallon. Food is not as important in a hot climate. Your home may be different, so plan accordingly.

If you must go on foot be realistic about how much weight you can carry and how far you can go each day (or night as the case may be).

Preacherman's team concept is very much like some of the things I have been considering for years. If you consider the concept of the Special Forces A and B teams, but modified to include specialities such as construction and transportation, you could have a small core team of shooters supporting a larger group of folks with important skills who are also capable of defending themselves. This team would not only be able to help others but also train others to help themselves.

That is one thing I would have liked to have seen in "Lights Out", not only would such a team help to draw the county together, they would also be able to gather intelligence on the area, so there would be fewer suprises.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top