Let’s talk blow-backs

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test drive

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ok when talking about blowback pinned barrel guns what would happen if the pin was removed ? Pressure builds up in chamber, round starts moveing and recoil is created. So the round should drag the barrel forward. since the recoil should mostly be directed against the breech face the only real force pulling the barrel to the rear should be the extractor pulling against the expanded case. Agree so far ?
 
ok when talking about blowback pinned barrel guns what would happen if the pin was removed ? Pressure builds up in chamber, round starts moveing and recoil is created. So the round should drag the barrel forward. since the recoil should mostly be directed against the breech face the only real force pulling the barrel to the rear should be the extractor pulling against the expanded case. Agree so far ?
It makes sense to me.
 
Over on YouTube, there is an excellent channel called "Forgotten Weapons". Some time ago, the guy that runs it (aka "Gun Jesus") did a video on a North Korean 32 blowback pistol where the barrel was NOT locked to the frame, but was free to move back and forth, with a spring pushing on it so it did not just flop around. You might hunt that up and see if there is anything in it relevant to your question, test drive.

PS - This is the video:
 
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ok when talking about blowback pinned barrel guns what would happen if the pin was removed ? Pressure builds up in chamber, round starts moveing and recoil is created. So the round should drag the barrel forward. since the recoil should mostly be directed against the breech face the only real force pulling the barrel to the rear should be the extractor pulling against the expanded case. Agree so far ?
With most designs of blow-backs if the pin is removed, the main spring shoots the slide and barrel off the frame, and you don't get to shoot it.....
 
I’m not saying to try this, just discussion. I was installing a barrel on a FEG R61 the other day and while installing the barrel pin it just got me thinking.
 
Walther PP series barrels are press-fit snugly in the barrel hood, which also holds the spring end. Would work fine, possibly for quite a while. Recoil might eventually make the barrel move back or rotate. That would jam it for sure.
 
With most designs of blow-backs if the pin is removed, the main spring shoots the slide and barrel off the frame.
I’m not saying to try this, just discussion. I was installing a barrel on a FEG R61 the other day and while installing the barrel pin it just got me thinking.
In the particular case of an FEG, nothing will happen.

- The barrel removes to the rear.
- The drag of the bullet on the rifling pulls the barrel forward.
- The gas pressure is balanced between the base of the bullet and the rear of the case, there is no fore & aft gas pressure in the barrel directly (only indirectly through the above).
- If for some reason the barrel did shift back, the next time the slide came back into battery, it would push the barrel back in place
 
The extractor is not pulling the case out of the chamber. The case is blowing the slide back. The extractor is going along for the ride. The extractor aids in directing the direction of the fired case when it hits the ejector and enables the user to extract a unfired case. Check out a Beretta Minx which is missing a extractor.
Depending on weight of the barrel and weight of the bullet the forces generated by a fired cartridge would push the barrel forward. consider a cylinder with a piston on each end.The firing chamber in the middle. pressure would move both pistons away from the center. Change the piston weights and you have your barrel and projectile answer.
 
to the OP, I'm not expert - but, in your description of what pulls the barrel, I think the round sealing against the chamber and the pressure of the gas as the round is fired, creates the greatest force backward on the barrel/chamber when the round is fired. Is this offset by the drag of the bullet in the barrel pulling it forward, never worked through the exact timing of how that all works from a science thinking perspective. If I had to hazard a guess, most guns would probably be fine if the barrel is press fit and the pin is there as much for alignment as to secure it. Eventually use and recoil might work it loose, but like old revolvers have pinned barrels, and some of the new ones of the same model, now they don't have pins because they decided not needed. Although, now sometimes revolvers get sent back because the barrel is a little canted/tilted, and the pin would prevent that QC issue.
 
In the particular case of an FEG, nothing will happen.

- The barrel removes to the rear.
- The drag of the bullet on the rifling pulls the barrel forward.
- The gas pressure is balanced between the base of the bullet and the rear of the case, there is no fore & aft gas pressure in the barrel directly (only indirectly through the above).
- If for some reason the barrel did shift back, the next time the slide came back into battery, it would push the barrel back in place
This.
 
The extractor is not pulling the case out of the chamber. The case is blowing the slide back. The extractor is going along for the ride. The extractor aids in directing the direction of the fired case when it hits the ejector and enables the user to extract a unfired case. Check out a Beretta Minx which is missing a extractor.
Actually, you can remove the extractor from just about all blow backs and they still work, most will even eject the case properly. Unloading them become problematic though.
 
My old Beretta Jetfire had no extractor. It had the tip-up barrel and you lifted an unfired .25 ACP case out of the chamber with a fingernail. :)

Stay safe.
 
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