Lever gun deer cartridge?

[wombat13]

It might be a real good idea to look at the Ohio list since he lives in Ohio.
http://wildlife.ohiodnr.gov/portals/wildlife/PDFs/hunting/Cartridges.pdf

Might be a real good idea to read the original post since he stated that he hunts both Ohio and Indiana.

Sorry for the snark, but if you're gonna dish it out...

Anyway, .44 mag works very well for deer. I took two deer with my Marlin 1894 last year, the first year I had it. Side eject on the Marlin lets you use optics if you wish. I mounted a Burris FF3 on mine. Works very nicely and IMHO doesn't bugger up the aesthetic too much since the FF3 is so small.

 

[MEHavey]

Forgive me if I don't respond.
Enough's been said.

 

[420Stainless]

.45-70 for bambi?

Certainly (at least in places that haven't implemented odd laws against it). Nothing particularly less convenient in .45-70 vs. something smaller unless you shoot so many deer that it becomes a matter of economy. We had an equally strange law in the opposite direction that allowed the use single shot rifles during primitive weapon season (the wildlife management folks allow it as a way to thin an over populated herd) as long as the cartridge had been in production prior to a certain date. I think they've dropped that cartridge restriction now, but when it was in effect the .45-70 Handi Rifle was very popular around here. I love toting my 1895 Cowboy during modern rifle season around here. Don't need that much gun for smallish MS deer, but there's no real downside and I really like that rifle.

 

[Reloadron]

I live in Ohio, and hunt Ohio & Indiana. Both states now allow straight walled rifle cartridges for deer hunting. I was leaning toward 45-70, but I'm thinking it's overkill for deer and will have more recoil than necessary. I need a little advice here before I buy a gun. What about 45 long colt, or 44 mag, or even 357 mag?

The current law in Indiana reads:

Rifles with cartridges that fire a bullet of .357-inch diameter or larger; have a minimum case length of 1.16 inches; and have a maximum case length of 1.8 inches are legal to use only during the deer firearms and special antlerless seasons. Some cartridges legal for deer hunting include the .357 Magnum, .38-.40 Winchester, .41 Magnum, .41 Special, .44 Magnum, .44 Special, .44-.40 Winchester, .45 Colt, .454 Casull, .458 SOCOM, .475 Linebaugh, .480 Ruger, .50 Action Express, .500 S&W, .460 Smith & Wesson, .450 Bushmaster, and .50 Beowulf.

I believe at this time Indiana has pending legislation that will open Indiana up to other rifle cartridges but am unsure what. So as it stands right now cartridges like the 45-70 Government and 444 Marlin while fine and legal in Ohio with Ohio's new laws they are not legal in Indiana due to exceeding the case length limits. However, as of now anything that is legal in Indiana is also legal in Ohio.

Personally I like cartridges like the 45 Colt and 44 Remington Magnum in handy short carbine style rifles. I like the Marlin, Winchester and Rossi lever guns in those chamberings. Both cartridges are fine 100 yard deer cartridges. They are common and readily available and just plain work.

Try and find out more about pending legislation as it applies to Indiana. Then too for a rifle to be used in Ohio and Indiana it will only open the door to the 45-70 Government and 444 Marlin as I do not see Ohio going to bottle neck cartridges anytime soon.

Ron

 

[redneck2]

However, as of now anything that is legal in Indiana is also legal in Ohio.

This is WRONG. There's so much posted so far that's inaccurate it's just unbelieveable

I personally use an AR that's chambered in WSSM necked up to .358. Would not be legal in Ohio.

I posted this back maybe ten posts ago. Indiana has no limitations on bottle neck/ straight wall. Since Ohio passed their legislation a few years after Indiana, i suspect they saw us making up specialty rounds to get around the limitations of straight wall rounds and fine tuned their offerings. My AR has taken deer at 269 yards, about twice the typical range of a .44 mag

As noted, Indiana is looking at expanding legal firearms. Jury is out at this point

 

[damienph]

Straight walled cartridges

I know absolutely nothing about Ohio hunting regs, or Indiana's either. However I do know something about straight walled cartridges; I load for 38-55 (not pictured), 375 Winchester, 444 Marlin and 45-70 Gov't. All four of them are excellent choices for hunting white tail deer. in my opinion, the 45-70 is the most versatile out of the four, especially if you are a handloader. You can load it down to .44 Magnum levels or load it up to exceed the 450 Marlin (close to 458 Win mag).

L-R: 30-30, 32 special, 35 rem, 375 win, 444 marlin, 45-70 gov't.



Too bad that Ohio doesn't recognize bottlenecked cartridges as suitable for deer hunting, any of these would be very effective.

 

[Miata Mike]

I have a Ruger 96/44 44 magnum. I plan on using a 300 grain bullet and just can't wait to bag a deer with one of my reloads!

 

[swampcrawler]

Id vote for 45-70. I used one a few years ago in a tc contender to take 2 pigs and a nice 7 point. Recoil was a bit stout in the 5 lb rifle but I like to refer to the cartridge as beautifully brutal. It seemed to me that it actually results in less meat damage than a high velocity round.

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

a 454 in a lever action would be a good option too

 

[damienph]

300 gr .44s

Miata Mike, the 300 grain Hornady XTP is my favorite in my 444P Outfitter. I also load them in my Ruger SBH. The Sierra 300 grain JFP is a good alternative to the XTP. Recoil can be a little stiff, but I have found them to be very effective on white tails and hogs.

 

[HexHead]

I was talking to someone from Ohio last week that was looking for a deer rifle. Most of the cartridges available to use are commonly found in a lever gun. He said there was also a three round capacity limit, so the magazine needed to be plugged to two rounds +1 in the chamber.

 

[StrawHat]

Prior to Ohio legalizing rifles for deer hunting, I used a revolver chambered in 45 long Colt and took several deer using black powder and lead. Out of a rifle (legal in both states mentioned) that cartridge would be plenty.

Not much recoil either.

 

[Crosswire3]

I live in Ohio as well. While it is a rather restrictive law (and list of cartridges), it is a welcomed change. I ended up getting a Ruger .44 Carbine and topping it with a Leupold M8 3x. It looks and handles like a big boy 10/22. With decent loads it is darn near the same as a standard muzzle loader. Even with the 3x optic, it is easy enough to keep on a 6" steel plate at 100yds. Given the 3 quick shots you have have onboard and lack of car-sized smoke cloud; it should do nicely.

That said, if I was to go with a lever, I would consider 444 Marlin or 45-70. Where the 44Mag is about done at 100yds, and dropping like a rock past 150yds...the other two will gain you some additional range. It depends on where and how you hunt to say the least.

 

[Speedo66]

I was talking to someone from Ohio last week that was looking for a deer rifle. Most of the cartridges available to use are commonly found in a lever gun. He said there was also a three round capacity limit, so the magazine needed to be plugged to two rounds +1 in the chamber.

This is from the official OH site:

"Straight-walled cartridge rifles in the following calibers: .357 Magnum, .357 Maximum, .38 Special, .375 Super Magnum, .375 Winchester, .38-55, .41 Long Colt, .41 Magnum, .44 Special, .44 Magnum, .444 Marlin, .45 ACP, .45 Colt, .45 Long Colt, .45 Winchester Magnum, .45 Smith & Wesson, .454 Cassull, .460 Smith & Wesson, .45-70, .45-90, .45-110, .475 Linebaugh, .50-70, .50-90, .50-100, .50-110, and .500 Smith & Wesson.

Shotguns and stright-walled (sic) cartridge rifles can be loaded with no more than three shells in the chamber and magazine combined."

It lists the cartridges allowed, so no .38-40 or .44-40 like IN, regardless of length.

It says you can only load 3 cartridges, it doesn't say the rifle can only hold 3 cartridges.

 

[natman]

They list 444 Marlin, but not 444 Rem mag. Are they the same?

No. There's the 44 Remington Mag which is a pistol cartridge. There's the 444 Marlin, which is much longer and more powerful. They use the same diameter bullets but it's not safe to fire a 44 RM in a 444 Marlin.

There's no 444 Rem Mag.

 

[stonecoldy]

You don't have to insert a plug in a magazine tube to limit your rifle to three rounds, this was hashed out earlier this summer. Actually your choices to cover both states with an effective cartridge get narrowed down pretty quick with the Indiana case length restriction and the Ohio determination of a straight-wall (cased) cartridge. These put you in the more "common" calibers of .357 Magnum, 41 and 44 Magnum and 45 Colt, plus a few of the more powerful big bore revolver cartridges. The Rossi Lever actions are top-eject and don't lend themselves well to scope use, a decent Marlin is not easy to find, perhaps a single shot can be found (H&R or T/C). If I had none of the above available but had a good muzzle loading rifle I'd just use that. A single shot but greater energy down range.
Personally, we didn't gain much in Ohio with the passage of this regulation. We may have gained the use of centerfire rifles but few on the list will surpass the best muzzleloaders and bullets available today for 200 yard energy, with the exception of the .375 Winchester, .444 Marlin and the .45-70.

 

[cpt-t]

((( redneck2 ))): Tim Pierce`s OP was to ask advice on Over Kill and excesive Recoil on a 45-70 Lever Gun. He also asked if a 357MAG, 44MAG, or a 45LC in a Lever Gun would be acceptable to use as a deer rifle. I tried to give him the best advice I could because I shoot, hunt, and reload for a 357MAG, 44MAG, and 45LC in Lever Guns and Hand Guns as well and have for many years. I also shoot, hunt, and reload for the 444, 45-70 and 450 Marlin in Lever Guns, Single Shots, and Bolt Action Rifles and have for many years. And again I tried to give him my best advice from personnel experiences using the 444, 45-70, and 450 Marlin. He did not ask me about any Game Laws. I do not live in Ohio or Indiana nor do I hunt there, or do I ever expect to hunt in either State. And I don`t know and could care less about there BS Hunting Regulations. I have always Lived and Hunted in States that have not been Soiled and Controled by LAWYERS, UNIONS, an WORTHLESS TWO BIT ELECTED OFFICALS. I pitty the fact that You do. But I will give You some Old Southern Advice. It is best that ((( You not Run Your Mouth Or Try To Rawhide ))) some one You don`t know.
ken

 

[ArchAngelCD]

"Straight-walled cartridge rifles in the following calibers:
.357 Magnum, .357 Maximum, .38 Special, .375 Super Magnum, .375 Winchester, .38-55, .41 Long Colt, .41 Magnum, .44 Special, .44 Magnum, .444 Marlin, .45 ACP, .45 Colt, .45 Long Colt, .45 Winchester Magnum, .45 Smith & Wesson, .454 Cassull, .460 Smith & Wesson, .45-70, .45-90, .45-110, .475 Linebaugh, .50-70, .50-90, .50-100, .50-110, and .500 Smith & Wesson.

You just have to love it when bureaucrats who know nothing about guns, cartridges or hunting make up the regulations. When they do they allow a hunter to use a .38 Special to hunt deer or a 41 Long Colt or a 45 ACP. That's right, a .38 Special is allowed but not the 30-30! Gota love this system alright! lol

I know how it happened, the law said any straight walled cartridge with a bullet diameter of .357" to .500" so out came the book and the none-hunting bureaucrat listed everything that fell into that box... (notice the 45 Colt and 45 Long Colt listed as two different entries even though they are the same cartridge) :banghead:

 

[rondog]

.44 mag kills 'em right dead-like.

 

[eastbank]

the 45-70 can be loaded down for chipmonks or up for elk-bear and if you cast or buy lead bullets it is pretty cheap to load. these two deer were shot with cast lead bullets at 1300-1400fps. in a ruger #3. when i have to use a smaller case i like the ruger 44/77 on the bottom. eastbank.

 

[Reloadron]

((( redneck2 ))): Tim Pierce`s OP was to ask advice on Over Kill and excesive Recoil on a 45-70 Lever Gun. He also asked if a 357MAG, 44MAG, or a 45LC in a Lever Gun would be acceptable to use as a deer rifle. I tried to give him the best advice I could because I shoot, hunt, and reload for a 357MAG, 44MAG, and 45LC in Lever Guns and Hand Guns as well and have for many years. I also shoot, hunt, and reload for the 444, 45-70 and 450 Marlin in Lever Guns, Single Shots, and Bolt Action Rifles and have for many years. And again I tried to give him my best advice from personnel experiences using the 444, 45-70, and 450 Marlin. He did not ask me about any Game Laws. I do not live in Ohio or Indiana nor do I hunt there, or do I ever expect to hunt in either State. And I don`t know and could care less about there BS Hunting Regulations. I have always Lived and Hunted in States that have not been Soiled and Controled by LAWYERS, UNIONS, an WORTHLESS TWO BIT ELECTED OFFICALS. I pitty the fact that You do. But I will give You some Old Southern Advice. It is best that ((( You not Run Your Mouth Or Try To Rawhide ))) some one You don`t know.
ken

Ken, I was fine with your post right till that last part. Take a look at the Population Density of Kansas. Kansas, much larger than Ohio has few areas where the population density exceeds 1 person or less per square mile. Now take a look at the Population Density of Ohio. Ohio, much smaller than Kansas also has a much tighter population density and while far from being as flat as Kansas is still relatively flat. The population density and terrain are what was used to determine what Ohioans could hunt with, not the crooked lawyers and rest assured despite your apparent distaste for unions they do not control Ohio's hunting laws. No, I never held a union or bargaining unit job either. While I do live here I am not particularly fond of Ohio.

So it becomes important to understand why Ohio's hunting laws are the way they are and the reasons you mentioned are not the case. There have been some changes for the good and I hope the changes remain.

Ron

 

[kanook]

I use 45LC, Mrs Kanook uses 44mag, and we both use 357mag. They all work fine for deer.