Light Weight, Soft Recoiling AR15?

Status
Not open for further replies.
H

HGM22

Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
737
I'm wanting to put together a light weight, soft-recoiling AR15 that is still reliable (after tuning if necessary). I was thinking a 14.5'' barrel, mid-length gas with a heavier spring and/or buffer (H2?).

Don't want to go NFA so was going to perm the flash hider. I was thinking the A2X unless anyone has a suggestion for a good flash hider.

I was also thinking at some point changing out the buffer tube for the Vltor A5 when I can afford it. Would this significantly help?

Anyone have any other ideas or suggestions?

Edit: Sorry, thought I was in the Rifle section. Could this be moved?
 
The .223 caliber lives & dies on velocity.

A 14.5" barrel does nothing to help velocity.

Go at least 16" or go home!

Rc
 
i have a legit 5.5 lb rifle, weighs in at 6 lb with a 20 round mag. recoil is not heavy, but you feel it. Its recoil is about as heavy as an ak. after 100 or so rounds you feel like youve shot about 15 rounds of 30-06. RC is right, go 16, and ide stick with a carbine gas, unless you wanna mount a bayonet... theyve been around longer, and have had the bugs worked out. I use standard springs and buffer/gas parts. Incredibly reliable rifle, built from parts, avoided the gimicks.
 
When I went through Basic the rifle committee demonstrator put the stock on his balls and fired a magazine full auto to show us how little recoil there was.
 
I agree with others if you have to go 16 might as well make it all bbl and gain the extra 50 feet per second. I do agree with the mid length but if you want a bit softer recoil you might look at an A2 rifle buffer tube and a light weight rifle stock or an ace tactical style stock. I found with the longer tube, spring and weight it is softer recoil than a carbine with an H2 buffer.

The A2 set up works well on AR pistols, rifles and I do have a 16 in mid length that it works great on as well.

http://www.brownells.com/rifle-part...15-m16-ace-arfx-skeleton-stock-prod16910.aspx

https://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=468
 
Where's that video of the AR pistol cheek brace? Yup, guys fires it against his face. Looks like it rattles his jaw but all of us who have served know it's a pussy cat.

You can't do that with a .30-30 lever gun with steel butt plate. It won't even come to mind. Nope, the AR15 is already soft recoiling and that was a purposeful design goal to get the average soldier to pull the trigger. Large caliber guns weren't user friendly - check your local range. Very few come to shoot 100 rounds of .30-06, plenty show up with 2-300 rounds of 5.56 and blast away.

16", midlength gas ( the rule is gas ports 7" from the muzzle) a rifle weight buffer set up and good to go. It's only the length of a A2 flash hider longer in use, 14.5" pinned is just a NFA bluff to impress friends. It's not really shorter and it loses power.

Go carbine gas if you want more recoil - seems obvious it shouldn't be recommended as picking up gas sooner than needed at higher pressure unnecessary to operation would be detrimental to a "softer recoil." Carbine on 14.5" only - midlength on 16". It's about timing, not what handguard looks cool. The industry moved to midlength because carbine on 16" was causing too many Customer Service issues.

Once you get it done, just go shoot it. Don't worry about recoil, you can take three times as much ammo as the big bore boys, sometimes for the same cost, and get that much more practice with about the same overall results - happy face.
 
A pencil-barrel midlength fits the bill. I'd recommend the 16" too. BCM makes one like that for around $1100 I think.
 
Also consider an adjustable gas block. This way you can adjust the amount of gas needde to work the action which in turn will lower recoil and muzzle rise. Watch some professional 3-gun shooters with their seemingly recoiless AR's, almost all have adjustable gas blocks.
 
Build with a 16" lightweight or pencil barrel, find a good brake or comp. And unless you're sold on an adjustable stock, consider doing a rifle tube & buffer. I have a middy dissipator with Troy Medieval brake and a Luth-AR skeleton stock on it, very gentle critter.

018b6430-3e7d-4ac2-b822-8c4f41008c1d_zps325c5c71.jpg
 
Look at something like the Ruger SR556 Carbine ( it's got a fluted barrel, that's a little shorter and a permanent flash hider.) Their piston system is sort of a two stage that is a little softer. Swap out the butt pad for a padded one..

The other option would be to find a relatively lightweight carbine, and change out the butt pad with a padded one, and also swap out the flash hider for a muzzle brake.
 
Full disclosure: I've never fired one and I'm simply regurgitating info to you that I've heard.

I've heard a lot of people speak highly of the KAC SR 15. Specifically, many cite how well balanced, soft shooting, and smooth it is. KAC is expensive. Not sure what your budget is.

Again, I cannot personally attest to any of what I typed above. That's just what I've always heard about the SR 15. Passing the word is all.
 
All good suggestions.

Look for a BCM deal, get a 16" middy lightweight and BCM comp. pair with a rifle length buffer. Done.

Otherwise lots of aftermarket stuff:
Vltor A5 buffer system
Adjustable gas block
Muzzle brakes
Shock absorbing MAKO stock
 
I guess I'm just numb or something. I bought my first AR about two years ago and since then have bought more and shot many more. Up until I bought an AR, my rifle shooting for over 50 years was limited to bolt guns in 30-06, 300 Winchester Magnum and .308 Winchester and 30-30 and 45-70 in lever actions. I know it's not a rifle, but my favorite shotgun is a Browning Citori 12GA O/U. Even the lighter loads in all of the aforementioned guns get tiresome rather quickly.

How is any AR-15 (.223 Remington/5.56 NATO) anything but a light recoiling rifle?
 
The difference in velocity from 16" to 14.5" really doesn't amount to much. http://www.sadefensejournal.com/wp/?p=1093

About 150 fps.

Going 10.5" nets about 2600 t0 2700 fps. Still fast for the average bullet. Why some are concerned is that military ammo - specifically rounds like M855 - have a high floor level of speed in order to fragment on impact. That's a FMJ round with steel core.

Hunting loads? Expansion points with hollow tips or polymer plugs will expand down to 1800 fps, some lower. It's arguable, but more effective than military rounds, and just as legal. OTM bullets are issue and have been since the 1980's. The aren't general issue, because the average soldier has to shoot thru cover to hit the enemy. Penetrator cores are more effective in combat. Hunting tips are more effective on live targets.

The "need for speed" has been addressed in modern ammunition, it's been 45 years since the introduction of the M16 and we aren't still shooting Ball ammo from them.
 
Last edited:
Is this a recreational AR or one you need absolute reliability from? If you just want to play around with tuning an AR for minimal recoil, I'd look at anything you can do to reduce reciprocating mass (lighter buffers and bolt carriers, not heavier, stronger springs), a good muzzle brake, and an adjustable gas system. You can get some of those to run amazingly well, though they may become more ammo/dirt sensitive.

If reliability is an issue, then muzzle brake and/or a system that has already been tested extensively like the SLR-15, or Knights SR15, JP Rifles, etc.
 
Three questions:
1) What are you going to do with the rifle?
2) How do you rank these: recoil, reliability, weight?
3) Is this rifle going to get an optic?

For a general purpose rifle that reliable and light, the BCM lightweight midlength upper with standard furniture works very nicely. I know, because that what I did. I could reduce recoil even more by adding a muzzle brake instead of the flash hider I have now.

The barrel adds the most weight of any component, so choose carefully. Also, avoid the temptation to add stuff to the rifle that you don't really need, like railed handguards scope elevating bubble levels.

Just because you have rail space left over doesn't mean it has to be filled with something.

For what it's worth, my ranking is reliable>weight>recoil.

BSW
 
Muzzle brakes work great...... but they make an AR 5.56 sound like a .308. The AR is such a low recoil rifle it makes the added noise of a brake a no go in my book... unless it's a competition gun.
 
Muzzle brakes work great...... but they make an AR 5.56 sound like a .308. The AR is such a low recoil rifle it makes the added noise of a brake a no go in my book... unless it's a competition gun.
Click to expand...

I agree 100%. But low recoil and light weight don't go together and a good break is a cheap way to reduce recoil even further.

A good break runs $50-100. Going for titanium parts costs way more than that really quickly.

BSW
 
How is any AR-15 (.223 Remington/5.56 NATO) anything but a light recoiling rifle?
Click to expand...

You need to adjust your thinking on recoil to understand. It's not that any 5.56 AR generates painful recoil; it's that any recoil will move you off target, and the games we play with ARs generally require lots of rounds on target in a short amount of time. Same reason guys run cream puff loads and compensators on race guns.

As well:

Even the lighter loads in all of the aforementioned guns get tiresome rather quickly.
Click to expand...

I won't hazard a guess at the average number of rounds fired through an AR in a range session, but there are certainly plenty of us who will go through hundreds in day or weekend. Can you imagine firing 300 rounds out of your .30-06 in a day? And the .30-06 is also modest on recoil at ~20 ft lbs. Heck, even the .300 WM ain't that bad. My two big game rifles are Both Remington 700 BDLs, one in 8mm Rem Mag and one in .375 RUM, which generate 2-1/2 and 4 times the recoil of a .30-06, respectively. But again, I'm not putting hundreds of rounds through them in a day, and I'm not competing for points on time and accuracy in a carbine game by poking around the corner and unleashing 303 grains of powder out of the RUM for a double tap + head shot on a silhouette with the .375. In point of fact, I could probably nearly empty the 30 round magazine of one of my ARs with a good brake/comp into slhouette COM at 50 yards in the time it would take to cycle the bolt and get back on target 3 times with the big boomers.
 
I agree with Briansmithwins and his questions but would add one more--where do you plan to shoot. Certain muzzle brakes and the like can make you quite unpopular at indoor shooting ranges and outdoor benches without partitions. You also need better hearing protection if any of the blast is directed somewhat toward the shooter.

Due to living in an urban location, I have done a fair amount of shooting at indoor ranges and being next to someone firing with a muzzle break not exactly conducive to your accuracy nor your hearing. However, it is a good test for flinching!
 
Of course there is a way to reduce recoil w/o adding much weight or blasting yourself senseless: get a rifle suppressor.

They reduce the recoil caused by the muzzle gas w/o causing increased blast and the modern ones don't weigh very much.

Naturally there are minor complications.

BSW
 
Light weight is relative. The Faxon 14.5" pencil barrel is extremely light and reasonably priced, paired with a V7 titanium extended A2, it would be silly light. The problem with heavier buffers or say an A5 system is now you are just adding those ounces right back on.

I built a LW with the 16" Faxon pencil barrel and a $110 AIM Surplus lightweight BCG, took the weights out of a buffer (weighs 1 oz now) and an adjustable gas block. Haven't shot it yet, but this is the way to really low recoil, reduce the reciprocating mass and the gas entering the system to match. I'm not forging new territory with this set up, it has been done befo' many, many, times with success and reports of crazy low recoil.

I wouldn't take it to combat, but this isn't my HD gun.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

drobs
Lemons into Lemonaid (braced AR pistols soon to be rifles)
2
Replies
25
Views
861
LiveLife
LiveLife
R
  • Locked
Will this AR15 kit meet my needs?
2
Replies
26
Views
1K
Roc_Kor
R
M
  • Locked
Testing Buffer Weights and Gas Flow
Replies
9
Views
2K
MistWolf
M
D
  • Locked
School Me- Why Light Weight bolt/carrier & buffer for AR15
Replies
8
Views
15K
Zak Smith
Zak Smith
L
  • Locked
ar buffer weight quesion
Replies
17
Views
3K
likesguns
L
Back
Top