dickydalton
Member
Here's another one I picked up last winter. A 19 no dash 4 screw from 1961. A NY Trooper's gun that's been shot a bunch but mostly with 38s. It's on the nightstand a lot.
Looking for a Smith
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Driftwood Johnson
Member
Howdy
Personally I prefer a 38 to a 357 Magnum. I seldom shoot Magnums out of a 357, almost always shooting them with 38s.
You absolutely cannot go wrong with a Model 10. The iconic 38. They broke the mold after they designed it. This is a Model 10-5, probably made around 1964. The Model 10 is still produced today, albeit with a heavy barrel and the built in lock. As previously stated, the Model 10 is built on the K frame, which was designed in 1899 as a six shot medium size revolver for the then brand new 38 Special cartridge.
As a comparison, here is a 38 Military and Police on top, and a Model 10 below. The 38 M&P, not to be confused with the silly semi-auto S&W is producing today under the same name, was the original name of the Model 10. The 38 M&P was the predecessor to the Model 10. Notice the different style front sight and the different style hammer. In 1957 S&W went to a model number system of nomenclature and the 38 M&P was renamed the Model 10. This Model 10-5 probably also dates from around 1964. I got it for $125 a bunch of years ago, but you won't see that kind of price anymore. Notice what I assume is a police armorer's inventory number stamped on the frame above the trigger guard.
Smith & Wesson had offered the 38 M&P in a target version, with an adjustable rear sight, for many years. However directly after WWII they updated the sights on the 38 M&P Target Model to include the modern click adjustable rear sight. This model was called the K-38, because it was a 38 Special on the K frame. The K-38 was a companion to the 22 caliber K-22 and 32 caliber K-32. This K-38 Combat Masterpiece, with a four inch barrel and Baughman front sight shipped in 1953.
After 1957, the K-38 became the Model 14. This Model 14-3 shipped in 1974.
The first ever 357 Magnum built on the K frame was simply known as the 357 Combat Magnum. It was developed to provide law enforcement with a lighter 357 Magnum revolver than the earlier large frame (N Frame) 357 Magnum revolvers. In 1957 the 357 Combat Magnum became the Model 19. I bought this Model 19-3 brand-spanky new in 1975 for $125. They cost a little bit more than that now.
The Model 13 was a K frame 357 with a non-shrouded, heavy barrel. This Model 13-2 probably shipped around 1979.
In the 1930s S&W developed a high velocity 38 Special cartridge and designed a new revolver for it. The new cartridge developed higher pressure than a standard 38 Special, so a new revolver was designed on the larger N frame with the cylinder chambered for 38 Special ammunition. The new revolver came in two versions. The adjustable sight version was called the 38-44 Outdoorsman. The name 38-44 meant that although it was a 38 Special revolver it was built on the large N frame, usually reserved for 44 caliber revolvers. This one shipped in 1933.
The fixed sight version was called the 38-44 Heavy Duty. This one shipped in 1931.
This photo shows how much steel surrounded the chambers in the N frame 38-44 revolvers.
The problem with the 38-44 revolvers was the high velocity 38 Special ammunition could accidentally be loaded into a standard K frame 38 Special, possibly blowing up the gun. So in 1935 S&W developed a new high velocity cartridge. It was a slightly longer version of the 38 Special so it could not be loaded into a standard 38 Special revolver. The new cartridge was known as the 357 Magnum, and the large, N frame revolver designed for it was simply called The 357 Magnum. Smith and Wesson started a marketing campaign for the new revolver, registering each one to the owner. These became known as the Registered Magnums. The Registered Magnum program only lasted a few years, then the model was continued simply as The 357 Magnum. Sorry, I don't have one to post a photo of.
In 1957, the name for The 357 Magnum was changed to Model 27. This one shipped in 1959.
One of the features the Model 27 carried forward from The 357 Magnum was the fancy checkering on the top strap and barrel rib. In this photo, the Model 27 is at the bottom, the Model 19 is at the top.
In 1954 S&W introduced a lower cost N frame 357 Magnum revolver. Originally called the Highway Patrol, the name was quickly changed to the Highway Patrolman. It was basically a no frills version of The 357 Magnum, without the checkering on the top strap and barrel rib, and the finish was a less highly polished satin blue finish. In 1957 The Highway Patrolman became the Model 28. This six inch Model 28-2 shipped around 1964.
This four inch Model 28-2 probably shipped around 1973.
Personally I prefer a 38 to a 357 Magnum. I seldom shoot Magnums out of a 357, almost always shooting them with 38s.
You absolutely cannot go wrong with a Model 10. The iconic 38. They broke the mold after they designed it. This is a Model 10-5, probably made around 1964. The Model 10 is still produced today, albeit with a heavy barrel and the built in lock. As previously stated, the Model 10 is built on the K frame, which was designed in 1899 as a six shot medium size revolver for the then brand new 38 Special cartridge.
As a comparison, here is a 38 Military and Police on top, and a Model 10 below. The 38 M&P, not to be confused with the silly semi-auto S&W is producing today under the same name, was the original name of the Model 10. The 38 M&P was the predecessor to the Model 10. Notice the different style front sight and the different style hammer. In 1957 S&W went to a model number system of nomenclature and the 38 M&P was renamed the Model 10. This Model 10-5 probably also dates from around 1964. I got it for $125 a bunch of years ago, but you won't see that kind of price anymore. Notice what I assume is a police armorer's inventory number stamped on the frame above the trigger guard.
Smith & Wesson had offered the 38 M&P in a target version, with an adjustable rear sight, for many years. However directly after WWII they updated the sights on the 38 M&P Target Model to include the modern click adjustable rear sight. This model was called the K-38, because it was a 38 Special on the K frame. The K-38 was a companion to the 22 caliber K-22 and 32 caliber K-32. This K-38 Combat Masterpiece, with a four inch barrel and Baughman front sight shipped in 1953.
After 1957, the K-38 became the Model 14. This Model 14-3 shipped in 1974.
The first ever 357 Magnum built on the K frame was simply known as the 357 Combat Magnum. It was developed to provide law enforcement with a lighter 357 Magnum revolver than the earlier large frame (N Frame) 357 Magnum revolvers. In 1957 the 357 Combat Magnum became the Model 19. I bought this Model 19-3 brand-spanky new in 1975 for $125. They cost a little bit more than that now.
The Model 13 was a K frame 357 with a non-shrouded, heavy barrel. This Model 13-2 probably shipped around 1979.
In the 1930s S&W developed a high velocity 38 Special cartridge and designed a new revolver for it. The new cartridge developed higher pressure than a standard 38 Special, so a new revolver was designed on the larger N frame with the cylinder chambered for 38 Special ammunition. The new revolver came in two versions. The adjustable sight version was called the 38-44 Outdoorsman. The name 38-44 meant that although it was a 38 Special revolver it was built on the large N frame, usually reserved for 44 caliber revolvers. This one shipped in 1933.
The fixed sight version was called the 38-44 Heavy Duty. This one shipped in 1931.
This photo shows how much steel surrounded the chambers in the N frame 38-44 revolvers.
The problem with the 38-44 revolvers was the high velocity 38 Special ammunition could accidentally be loaded into a standard K frame 38 Special, possibly blowing up the gun. So in 1935 S&W developed a new high velocity cartridge. It was a slightly longer version of the 38 Special so it could not be loaded into a standard 38 Special revolver. The new cartridge was known as the 357 Magnum, and the large, N frame revolver designed for it was simply called The 357 Magnum. Smith and Wesson started a marketing campaign for the new revolver, registering each one to the owner. These became known as the Registered Magnums. The Registered Magnum program only lasted a few years, then the model was continued simply as The 357 Magnum. Sorry, I don't have one to post a photo of.
In 1957, the name for The 357 Magnum was changed to Model 27. This one shipped in 1959.
One of the features the Model 27 carried forward from The 357 Magnum was the fancy checkering on the top strap and barrel rib. In this photo, the Model 27 is at the bottom, the Model 19 is at the top.
In 1954 S&W introduced a lower cost N frame 357 Magnum revolver. Originally called the Highway Patrol, the name was quickly changed to the Highway Patrolman. It was basically a no frills version of The 357 Magnum, without the checkering on the top strap and barrel rib, and the finish was a less highly polished satin blue finish. In 1957 The Highway Patrolman became the Model 28. This six inch Model 28-2 shipped around 1964.
This four inch Model 28-2 probably shipped around 1973.
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If1HitU
Member
I know you've been told about the S&W 686,but my choice is the S&W 686-6 .357 Mag.4" 6 shot revolver. I love mine,that's it's my choice.
While this is excellent advice and suggestion, there is something special about shooting 38 Special ammunition in a gun chambered for 38 Special.
I thoroughly enjoy shooting 38 Special wadcutters in my Model 14 and Model 15 38 Special revolvers.
grampajack
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You would have to be more specific. I'm not a revolver guy, so the subtleties might be lost on me.
AZAndy
Member
As Mr. Johnson has shown, there are several models that would fit your requirements of a blued classic with a target barrel. If you sign up at the S&W forum, the "for sale" section there has a steady stream of the sort of thing you're looking for. Gunbroker items tend to be exuberantly priced, from what I've seen, though there are occasional finds. Living in such a big city, you might be able to find something nice in a local shop if you look around. Even in my smallish town, I've found some real keepers (4" 10 no dash, 6" 19-3, 6" M1905). Some of the more collectible items command a higher price, of course, but you should be able to find something decent for around $500. I look forward to seeing news about what you've found.
NIGHTLORD40K
Member
Theoretically you might get slightly better accuracy shooting .38s from a .38 cylinder (due to the shorter free bore), than out of a .357 cylinder.
But, all else being equal, I do tend to avoid .38s in favor of the .357 (though I rarely shoot magnums in them) I'm a bit of a doomsday nut and like the ammo availability.
Some issues with Smiths......and I do love and own many.
Worn timing: many, if not most, old S&WS have poor "carry up" due to hand/ratchet wear. In this case the cylinder won't turn far enough to lock the bolt in place positively, especially if the hammer is cocked slowly or with a little drag on the cylinder.
Though rarely dangerous, this can be $$$ to fix, as recessed cylinder ratchets are pretty much unobtainable today.
Cracked forcing cones: older K-frames (model 10, 19, 66, etc), can crack at the flat machined part of the barrel extension if fed too many hot rounds. Some people opine that the 110gr bullets are the culprit- I avoid shooting magnums in them at all or only occasionally. Once again, tough and $$$ fix- if you can find parts.
MIM parts: the reason I hate the internal lock guns has more to do with this than the lock itself. The hammer, trigger, and internal workings on these is made of a form of melted powdered steel. A close visual of the hammer will show it to be smooth and glob-like around the edges, like it oozed into a mold from a drain pipe. Although breakage of these parts is rare, when it does occur, it is sudden- MIM doesn't bend or crack- it snaps and shatters. On the upside, parts are generally available. Plus, I just hate the way MIM components look, but that's just me......
So, a few things to watch out for when shopping for old Smiths, but these are still great guns.
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grampajack
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Could be. Sounds like something Luckygunner should do.
Actually, it is well known that shooting 38 Specials in a 38 Special gun will yield better accuracy than shooting 38 Specials in a 357 Magnum. It is one of the reasons the bullseye shooters would shoot 38 Special revolvers. But, alas, most of us probably cannot tell the difference.
These days, there are very few revolvers made chambered for only 38 Special not counting the small 5 shot revolvers such as the Ruger LCR or the S&W J frames. 38 Special ammunition and guns chambered only for 38 Special have a long successful history in the firearms world. Taking one to the range for an afternoon of shooting is kind of like taking a Sunday drive in your '57 Chevy Bel Air.
AZAndy
Member
You can still buy a brand-new Model 10 or 64. How could anybody need more gun than that?
Charliefrank
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BeautyHere's another one I picked up last winter. A 19 no dash 4 screw from 1961. A NY Trooper's gun that's been shot a bunch but mostly with 38s. It's on the nightstand a lot.
Charliefrank
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I would still like to find an older 6 1/2" model 29 to complete my collection. I have the 4" and the 8 3/8". Last one I saw at a gun show was without the original grips and presentation box. The seller wouldn't budge from $1200.00.
NIGHTLORD40K
Member
Got my Victory model for $200 because it wasn't Tacticool and the owner of that gunshop "Just wanted that rusty old thing out of my display case."
Guess he was afraid it would "infect" all his Glocks and ARs.....
J-Bar
Member
Find one made in the 1950s-60s in good condition. Pay the premium price, more than you expect to, more than the folks here say you should. Life is short, enjoy it.
SwampWolf
Member
If I had to get rid of all of my S&W revolvers chambered in .38 Special/.357 Magnum except one , the one I'd keep would be my K-38 "Masterpiece", made in 1957-an absolutely exquisite example of fine workmanship long absent from "affordable" handguns available today.
, the one I'd keep would be my K-38 "Masterpiece", made in 1957-an absolutely exquisite example of fine workmanship long absent from "affordable" handguns available today.The one that I would recommend categorically is the 586/686, and I'd go for an earlier model prior to the incorporation of MIM parts (which are probably perfectly fine, but I'd just rather have the earlier versions). I think it's almost impossible not to LOVE this gun. I have two friends with corresponding Pythons, but they aren't as smooth and sweet as my 686. They simply are NOT. The K-frame is also very nice, but the L-frame is just outstanding for shooting enjoyment, IMO.
CopperFouling
Member
I think you're looking for a 686-4 with a 4" barrel. Just sayin'.
CajunBass
Member
My favorite S&W is the Model 15 "Combat Masterpiece." Just hard to find a nicer gun.
This particullar one, a -2 (the "dash number" really doesn't matter except to us S&W geeks) made about 1966, has the target hammer, trigger, sights (all 15's have adjustable sights) trigger stop, and target stocks.
They didn't call them "Masterpiece" for no reason. They are just a joy to shoot, and handle.
This particullar one, a -2 (the "dash number" really doesn't matter except to us S&W geeks) made about 1966, has the target hammer, trigger, sights (all 15's have adjustable sights) trigger stop, and target stocks.
They didn't call them "Masterpiece" for no reason. They are just a joy to shoot, and handle.
bangswitch
Member
Wow, you restored my belief that you can get a deal on GB, and made me envious you paid that little for an unfired gun of that stature and quality.
I found a M19-3 4" about two years ago after a long search to replace the M66-2 I used to have, that I had traded an M19-3 6" for. My 'new' M19 has been shot quite a bit, it has the beginnings of flame cutting under the top strap. Otherwise, not a mark on it, and it is a "3-T" model (Target trigger, Target hammer, and Target grips. Got the original box, too. $800 all done at my LGS (consignment sale).
Reloadron
Contributing Member
If I were to suggest something in a moderate price range and yet a nice revolver it would be a S&W Model 19 or S&W 586 (as far as blue guns). Moving up in price a Colt Trooper or S&W 28. Really a matter of your budget and personal taste.
Ron
Ron
buck460XVR
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I'm going to agree with many others that a S&W 586/686 would be your best choice to start your S&W revolver adventure with. If it's going to be something you are planning to shoot regularly and keep for a long time, I would advise you to bite the bullet and buy new. You do not need the aesthetics of older classics in your case, you need an accurate handgun and a firearm that by lasting your lifetime, will become a classic to you. S&W's lifetime warranty on new guns will guarantee that to you.
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