Looking for the lightest powder charge

[ThorinNNY]

I can get away with for punching hole in paper with a .50 cal ML rifle. I`m looking for a very light load that will give consistent accuracy. I MAY have to switch to shooting from a shoulder that`s going to be VERY recoil sensitive to due to the lasting effects of an injury 45 yrs ago.
I was very fortunate to keep the arm, even more fortunate to regain as much use of it as I have now. I`d like to keep on shooting, but not at the cost of re-injuring an already compromised shoulder.
I guess I could start off very light, and increase the powder charge until it becomes painful to shoot. I wonder how many grains would be a reasonable starting point.
Any info you might have on light loads would be greatly appreciated.Thanks.

 

[St8LineGunsmith]

that is something you are going to have to work out
work up several diffrent loads and see which is the most consistant and something you can stand to shoot.
a pad on your shoulder will help to absorb some of the recoil also

you can also put a slip on recoil pad on the rifle to help relieve some of the recoil too.

 

[DoubleDeuce 1]

Thor

I have a .50 Hawken. The lightest loads I have shot were 40 gr FFFG. Those were for close in targets. 45 gr FFFG is another good light load. It will depend on your rifle and the distance over which you will be shooting. I would start low and increase 5 gr at a time.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

We routinely start beginners with 30 grains of 3fg in 50 cal frontier rifles .

 

[Hanshi]

I've found 30 grains 3F bp is reasonably accurate in my .50 and have tested light up to 40 grains. At a woods walk at a rendezvous I was once out shot by a guy who shot 29 grains of 3F in his .50.

 

[Robtattoo]

I've gone as low as 12gn of FFFG Goex in a .50 Lyman. Shot very nicely at 50 yds too!
My regular target load is actually for a Colerain barreled .54 & that goes with 30gn of FFFG, a .530 ball & .024 canvas patch. It'll hold a 1¼" 5 shot group all day long although it drops like a rock much past that. Luckily, however, my POA is exactly the same with 30gn at 50yds as it is with my equally accurate hunting load of 85gn at 100yds.

If you want a real laugh (& it took me ages to convince a friend of mine that I wasn't joking) my squirrel load & most accurate load for my .32 is 8gn of FFF! That load has shot me several groups of around ¾" at 30yds!

 

[ThorinNNY]

Thanks, everybody. 30 grains fffg seems like a reasonable starting point. A slip on recoil pad is a good suggestion but might require some modificastion to fit on a curved buttstock.Maybe a chunk of wood cut to square up the stock will allow use of a slip on recoil pad.

 

[dprice3844444]

.Maybe a chunk of wood cut to square up the stock will allow use of a slip on recoil pad.

thor,pachmeyer magnum decellerator recoil pad attached to wood

 

[KenHulme]

I'm gonna go way out on a limb here and suggest that if you want to keep target shooting you trade your .50 cal on a .30, .31, or .32 caliber long rifle; or something like a replica 1873 Colt Revolving Carbine, or a .31 or .32 cal. 'buggy rifle' single shot pistol with say 14"-18" barrel and a shoulderstock. Then work up an accurate but low powder load. It's not all about the big bore and the big bang!

 

[Robtattoo]

The only problem with dropping to a smaller & lighter ball, is that wind drift becomes a huge factor. A .310 roundball only weighs around 47 grains. Compare that to a .50 weighing 177 grains & you can see, there's a significant distance.
Don't forget, roundball ballistics pretty much dictate that if you want to go farther or faster, you have to go bigger & heavier.
.45 seems to be the most popular caliber for serious target shooters. But, I have met & shot with a lot of folks that are very competetive with .50, .54 & .58 rifles.
It's not always about finding the lightest load, it IS about finding the most accurate for your particular rifle.
There is still a persistent myth that roundballs are not accurate & sidelock muzzleloaders are 'just a fun toy'
When properly loaded & at reasonable ranges, a good shooter can be just as accurate with a roundball as with a centerfire. Take a drive over to Friendship some time & see what the benchrest shooters can do with a roundball at 100yds. It's quite an eye-opener, I can tell you!

 

[[email protected]]

See what they do at 200 yds with roundball. The little 32 is the most used
in the pistol matches. Wind don't really bother it even at 50 yds. Light
powder chargers too like 10-12 grs. The record spring agg is held by a 32.

 

[BCRider]

You say you MAY have to switch to the shoulder that suffered that old injury. So you've been shooting with the other shoulder up to now? Is some change to your vision forcing the shift to the previously injured shoulder?

Just curious since the first option to my thinking is that you could simply learn to shoot from the other good shoulder. But if your vision is forcing you to consider switching shoulders then that's a different situation.

As for the rifle my thinking was to switch to a smaller bore size and keep a heavy barrel. It's one thing to lower the charge but as suggested by the guys you need enough charge to get the ball to where it's nicely stabilized. If your current rifle can do that with 20 to 40gns behind a .50 it's simply a case of finding out where the "sweet spot" is for that barrel. If it turns out that even the kick from 40 gns is too stout then the next option is to shift down in size and try that.

For the local club's black powder event with targets that range from 30 yards out to around 100 yards I'm using 40gns so far in my GPR flinter. It seems to provide an excellent level of accuracy although I haven't tried it on paper yet. The drop is such that for targets out to 50 yards I use a "6 o'clock" hold. For 70 and more yards I put the sights right on to allow for a little drop. So obviously the muzzle velocity isn't all that high. And with the weight of the heavy octagonal barrel the kick to the shoulder is pretty soft.

 

[ThorinNNY]

The reason I may have to switch shoulders is I might need surgery, not on the dominant shoulder. But recoil could cause problems to what needs fixing because it is close enough to be adversely affected by shooting from that shoulder.Nothing has been decided on yet, depends on results from tests to be done next month.
I could come out of this with no problem at at all , but having a plan b, plan c , plan d looks good right now.

BCrider,check yr messages.

 

[St8LineGunsmith]

Thorin
I understand your plight
I used to be a professional Archer and had to quit due to bad shoulders and elbows.I am eat up with arthritis and surgery is not really an option. I tried changing over from left to right but was never able to get a good shooting form not to mention the right side is nearly as messed up as the left side so I just threw in the towel but fortunately I can still shoot.
If I absolutley had to I could probably switch sides for shooting a rifle, hopefully that dont become an issue for me.

good luck with the tests and hope you can get your troubles behind you soon.

 

[ThorinNNY]

Trading my .50 for a .32 might be workable, Ken.It`s a good thought, thanks for the suggestion
Robtatto, I`ve never been to Friendship, sigh! But I`ve shot in local matches with an NMLRA affiliated club. I`xe seen really impressive NMLRA six bull targets turned in -49 s with multiple X`s, sometimes even 50 s with multiple X`s turned in for scoring.
Khwi I`ve seen some of your targets posted here, along with your videos. Most impressive!
st8linegunsmith
Sorry to hear about your arthritis.That monster, arthritis sure has eaten up a lot of good people.Stay well and thanks.

 

[Oldnamvet]

An off the wall suggestion came to mind. A guy on another forum delights in finding new things to replace lead for target shooting. One of those things was 1/2" dead hard rubber balls with a weight of only 22 grains each. they will blow around in the wind but they will shoot straight at shorter ranges on a calm day and there is almost no recoil even with heavier powder charges. In addition, you can recover them and reuse them. You might have to register on the site (free) to look at what he has done shooting rubber balls, brass balls, and glass marbles.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/220746/fromsearch/1/hl/rubber/tp/1/