Louisiana Traffic Stop abilities

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Jimmy Dean

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Can a cop search your vehicle w/o a warrant, RS, or PC, during a routine traffic stop?

Are you required to answer an officer during a routine traffic stop if they ask if you have a firearm in your vehicle? (When they know that you own a pistol and are legally allowed to own one)

This is, obviously, in Louisiana
 
Search? No. One must have PC.

With reasonable suspicion that you are armed and may pose a threat of some kind, an officer may terry-pat you. In the past, a cursory "terry-pat" of a vehicle has also been allowed if there is RS to believe weapons are in the vehicle and may pose a threat.

It might be kind of a gray area. The vehicle terry-pat might work, but would likely depend a lot on how well the officer can articulate the reasonable suspicion in a report.
 
the reasonable suspicion of me posing a threat?

They are pretty sure that I have a firearm in my truck, which in La is legal no matter its location in the vehicle, loaded or unloaded.

This happened in a location where I am allowed to have a vehicle in my truck as well according to the law, but against school policy (which is not a law, so, carrying in a vehicle is still not illegal)

The police officer(s) involved know me personally, they have for some time, they are also aware that I am in no way a threat to their safety.
 
Here's part of your answer from the LA Code of Criminal Procedure:

Art. 215.1. Temporary questioning of persons in public places; frisk and search for weapons

A. A law enforcement officer may stop a person in a public place whom he reasonably suspects is committing, has committed, or is about to commit an offense and may demand of him his name, address, and an explanation of his actions.

B. When a law enforcement officer has stopped a person for questioning pursuant to this Article and reasonably suspects that he is in danger, he may frisk the outer clothing of such person for a dangerous weapon. If the law enforcement officer reasonably suspects the person possesses a dangerous weapon, he may search the person.

C. If the law enforcement officer finds a dangerous weapon, he may take and keep it until the completion of the questioning, at which time he shall either return it, if lawfully possessed, or arrest such person.

D. During detention of an alleged violator of any provision of the motor vehicle laws of this state, an officer may not detain a motorist for a period of time longer than reasonably necessary to complete the investigation of the violation and issuance of a citation for the violation, absent reasonable suspicion of additional criminal activity. However, nothing herein shall prohibit a peace officer from compelling or instructing the motorist to comply with administrative or other legal requirements of Title 32 or Title 47 of the Louisiana Revised Statutes of 1950.
 
If the officer asks you if he/she can search your vehicle and you say "no" or "do you have a warrant" the officer will automatically assume you are hiding something and call in to get a warrant issued and brought to him so he/she can search your vehicle. I've seen them do it. In Louisiana.

And in case your wondering, when the warrant gets there, you get to sit in the back of the patrol car while the officer and his/her back up officers and supervisors search every square inch of your vehicle. And they do not have to put all the stuff they toss out of your vehicle back where it came from so you are left (assuming you don't go to jail) with a pile of stuff on the side of the road and an empty vehicle while you watch the police drive off.
 
And they do not have to put all the stuff they toss out of your vehicle back where it came from so you are left (assunimg you don't go to jail) with a pile of stuff on the side of the road and an empty vehicle while you watch the police drive off.
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So better to give up your rights voluntarily than be inconvenienced huh?

No thanks......I'd rather clean up the mess.
 
Policemen will ask if they can search you vehicle. They are trained to control the situation and to mix legal requirements with requests so that you are unaware as to which are which. If you do not know, ask in a respectful manner.

NEVER EVER allow a cop to search your vehicle. If they threaten you with the drug dog or something ask them what is their “reasonably articulated suspicion.” Also ask it you are free to go. If they detain you they have to tell you what they suspect you of.
 
So better to give up your rights voluntarily than be inconvenienced huh?

No thanks......I'd rather clean up the mess.
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Actually, I agree with you. I will clean up the mess every time. No problem at all.
 
One more tip

Use humor so as not to escalate the situation.

My line is “I would let you but my best friend is an attorney and she would never let me hear the end of it if I did.”

This also lets them know, in a non confrontational way, that you have legal help.
 
Unfortunately, what does happen and what SHOULD happen are not always the same thing.

If the officer asks you if he/she can search your vehicle and you say "no" or "do you have a warrant" the officer will automatically assume you are hiding something and call in to get a warrant issued and brought to him so he/she can search your vehicle. I've seen them do it. In Louisiana.
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From a strictly legal point of view, refusing to a search is not grounds for a search by itself. If it were, then there really wouldn't be a legal way to refuse a search, ever.

Now, that doesn't mean that such searches haven't ever landed someone in jail. If you're in that situation, you need a competent lawyer. A competent lawyer will get that warrant thrown out pretty quickly, and any "evidence" obtained as a result of it.

Aaron
 
The best answer is right in the law and in the section I posted earlier, if we are talking merely a traffic stop:

D. During detention of an alleged violator of any provision of the motor vehicle laws of this state, an officer may not detain a motorist for a period of time longer than reasonably necessary to complete the investigation of the violation and issuance of a citation for the violation, absent reasonable suspicion of additional criminal activity. However, nothing herein shall prohibit a peace officer from compelling or instructing the motorist to comply with administrative or other legal requirements of Title 32 or Title 47 of the Louisiana Revised Statutes of 1950.
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That is Louisiana Code of Criminal Procedure, Article 215.1d. The simple solution is to ask if you are being detained for any reason other than the traffic violation. The fact that you said no to a search (which I have never been asked myself, even when 20 years ago I was stopped while DWI), does not constitute reasonable suspicion of additional criminal activity - it is cause for reasonable suspicion of you just wanting to get the ticket and be on your way. Politeness will get you a long way, just a simple answer of NO to the question of may I search your vehicle without any tone or explanation is sufficient, and a simple, "Am I being detained for reasons other than the traffic violation" followed with "Am I free to go?".
 
I think the fear not mentioned here is that out of spite, a dirty cop might plant drugs or something else to get back at you for giving him a rough time over the search.
 
I thought Louisiana cops were nationally very well-known for being upstanding beacons of justice that would never contemplate doing something as nefarious as that.

Reid
 
When LEO ask to search my vehicle I always reply "no, I dont think it would be right to waste your time like that"

But as far as weapons.
I always carry my long guns in the trunk so if they ask to see the guns I will pop the trunk for them but I won't give them free reign over the whole car.
Another tip, if you have a gun in your glove box go ahead and lock the glovebox. That way if Officer Law decides do go ahead and search illegally he will still not be able to get at your gun. Presuming that he is not going to find anything that warrents probable cause.
 
As a former resident of the fine state of Louisiana, who still travels there on business, here is how I handle travel in LA.

1] This is the only state with reciprocity that I consider NOT carrying in (depends on how long I'm there and where I'm traveling). When I do travel to LA with a CCW, I carry my cheapest KT.

2] Try my best not to speed (I don't always succeed). I set the GPS speed alert for 3 mph over the limit! I leave my radar detector at home.

3] At a traffic stop I say "Yes Sir", "No Sir", "Anything you want Sir"

4] I carry prescription and OTC meds ONLY in their original container.



[Strike]Louisiana has repeatedly proved they are not part of the United States of America.[/strike]
Louisiana, its like traveling to another country.
 
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As another former resident of Louisiana and a person who has a very large family that still lives in Louisiana and someone who still considers Louisiana to be home, I find your quote HIGHLY OFFENSIVE. If you don't like our state the stay the hell out of it.
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Well first off yes his comment was probably not High Road but let's be honest here both ways.

From an outsiders viewpoint, after watching the LA governor, the police of New Orleans, the politicians etc during the Katrina fiasco you have to admit that it would be easy to come to the conclusion that things are pretty messed up there.

Perception is a big part of reality. I've done business in LA for many years and I know firsthand it's a great place and some of the best people on the planet but if you got most of your information on the state from watching the reaction to Katrina you would truly never want to go there in your life.

What happened there could have happened anywhere and the response from gov would likely not be much difference,, but unfortunately it happened there and it's put a spin on people's feelings about Louisiana that will stick with them for a long time.

I hear the same thing from people I work with when I tell them I'm going to LA for whatever; "don't take your guns, they will take them", "the cops will steal your car" etc. Hey, it was on TV so it must be true right?
 
I have lived in Louisiana for most of my life, my entire family is from here. I have to say, this i the dirtiest state I have ever lived in. We have the , at least openly, the dirtiest cops and politicians. I love the land, the people, it is the gov't that is simple not right around these parts. Jfountain, if you wish to say otherwise, you DO need to open your eyes. Howmany of our govenors and senators/congressman have been thrown in jail in the last 10 years? Do we not have a serious problem with illegal search and seizure? (The issue I am involved in is just another one)
 
From an outsiders viewpoint, after watching the LA governor, the police of New Orleans, the politicians etc during the Katrina fiasco you have to admit that it would be easy to come to the conclusion that things are pretty messed up there.
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Since when has one city ever been the basis to form an opinion of an entire state?
 
Since when has one city ever been the basis to form an opinion of an entire state?
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Did you watch any of the coverage at all?

You are arguing with me like it's my fault. How many times did we hear the media blame the Governor of LA for this and that? How many times did she go on TV and the media spin anything she said out of control?

The media all but flat out said that it was a statewide issue of mismanagement, corruption and incompetence in addition to blaming the fed.

Doesn't matter if it's true or not, that's how they presented it to get the ratings up.

You live there so you have a close up view of it, I live next door and I see reality too. If you live in Chicago and you have never been to Louisiana and the only perception you have is what the new showed you would think it an awful place.

No one is saying its' true, but that's sure how it was spun.

The "dirtier" and "meaner" they could make it then the better the ratings were.

Remember stories of rapes and murders in the LA Dome? Any of it true? Not really but you couldn't tell from the coverage.

Remember the stories of the National Guard and so called "abuses"? Very little of that true either.

The people of Louisiana should be pretty pissed at the national media for their coverage, it was horrible.

But at the end of the day you have to be realistic and understand that some people's opinions were formed from that coverage.
Right or wrong that's how it happened.

Pretty extreme thread drift and my apologies, but you guys from LA, and most of the south honestly (me included), have to admit that there's been a presentation of law enforcement in the south as being "Sheriff Pusser" for many years now.

Stories like this don't help:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351618,00.html
 
Did you watch any of the coverage at all?
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No, I was kinda busy.. you know... being a mere 5 miles outside of New Orleans during the whole ordeal.

You are arguing with me like it's my fault. How many times did we hear the media blame the Governor of LA for this and that? How many times did she go on TV and the media spin anything she said out of control?
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Not quite. I am not arguing with you. I asked a simple question.

I for one am very disturbed by the misconstrued media but that is not what I am talking about.

Gun owners should know better (And just for clarification, I am discussing with you, not blaming you or saying that you are doing the things I am pointing out. Is that better?) We deal with the media spin on a daily basis. Shouldn't we (As a group) know better than to listen to the media?

Also, if a person doesn't have the mental prowess to figure out that a 199 square mile area doesn't represent the 51,000 square miles of Louisiana, then we don't really need that person here... (Once again, not you.)
 
jfountain2, Your over-the-top reaction to a throwaway comment like that, which by the way, is often repeated in reference to California, New Jersey, D.C., Illinois and a few others, gives an impression of reckless immaturity, and hurts your own credibility. A thinly veiled invitation to a confrontation doesn't help. Chest-thumpers don't impress here. If you feel so abused by a comment posted on an internet forum that you feel you might have to abandon it, perhaps you should, and save yourself and us further aggrivation...
 
jfountain2, Your over-the-top reaction to a throwaway comment like that, which by the way, is often repeated in reference to California, New Jersey, D.C., Illinois and a few others, gives an impression of reckless immaturity, and hurts your own credibility. A thinly veiled invitation to a confrontation doesn't help. Chest-thumpers don't impress here. If you feel so abused by a comment posted on an internet forum that you feel you might have to abandon it, perhaps you should, and save yourself and us further aggrivation...
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Oh, ok... so here on the "High Road" where respect for others is SUPPOSED to be the golden rule... showing disrespect isn't frowned upon... but defending against that disrespect is?
 
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