M1 Garand Ceremonial offered by CMP

[joewill]

Has anyone seen one of these rifles currently offered by CMP ??

These M1 Garand rifles have the barrels welded to the receiver, but are not plugged. These rifles were in use at veterans' organizations for ceremonial and burial details and for firing blank ammunition only. Finish may be worn. Gas cylinders may be welded. Wood is well used and may have minor cracks, dents, gouges, scratches and repairs. All other parts may be worn. Bolt will open and close for 'manual of arms'. These rifles will clean up well for wall-hangers and displays. We consider these rifles as unsafe to fire regular ammunition.

RM1CERLW
M1 Garand, Ceremonial. Barrel welded to receiver. "LESS WOOD" (no stock or handguards, no stock or handguard metal). $ 250.00

They state " gas cylinders may be welded" but I wonder about on the "less wood" version as, unless they just broke the front handguard off, it may not be welded. They also say " they consider these rifles unsafe to fire regular ammunition". I also wonder about this also. I think it would depend on how it was welded but if it fires blanks. I surely would not attempt to fire reg. ammo in it unless it was checked by a good gunsmith. In fact I have other Garands to shoot so I really don't care if I shoot this one.

For $ 250.00 I am thinking of getting one. I have some nice wood and could put together a pretty nice looking Garand on the cheap. Of course, if the Gas Cylinder is welded on in some way, I will have a real problem getting the front hand guard on. Any thoughts or comments ?

 

[GRIZ22]

I think it would depend on how it was welded but if it fires blanks.

Blanks have nothing to really push but a wad or to open a crimp so there isn't any pressure to speak of. There's no telling what the welding did to the heat treatment of the receiver. I've known some rewelded receivers that are working fine. I've also seen some come apart.

If you want a wall hanger I might give it a try but I wouldn't convert one of these to a shooter.

 

[joewill]

Basicly I am just thinking of it as a wall hanger but am curious as to how they were welded. It isn't the receiver that has been cut and welded back to one piece. It's, for some reason, the barrel welded to the receiver so that the barrel can not be removed. If it can chamber a blank it wasn't done with the intention of demiling the gun. I really can't figure why this was done. I ordered one so we shall see.

 

[HorseSoldier]

They have some in the South Store that have some sort of blank firing adaptor welded to the end of the barrel, and some that are externally pretty close matches to a real working Garand.

One of the woodless ones they have in the South Store has a pre-WW2 serial number (#100,000-ish). Hurts to just look at it. Waste.

 

[joewill]

[Quote}One of the woodless ones they have in the South Store has a pre-WW2 serial number (#100,000-ish). Hurts to just look at it.

Horsesoldier - Did you notice if the gas cylinder was welded in any way on the 100,000 # gun you saw ??? I am just hoping that I will be able to just add the wood and have a Garand that will look good for a display. Also hope the one I get does not have the blank firing adapter welded on the end of barrel. That would really look like sh--. Thanks

 

[jrfoxx]

Personally, for $250 I'd pass myself, as you can get a pretty good, USGI one that you can actually fire for only $500 or so from them. I'm not a fan of having guns just to look at, at least not that cost $250. I'd rather pay more to have one I can look at AND shoot, and am willing to pay for it. If we were talking more like $50 or so, I might consider it though.But, that's just me.YMMV.
Also, If CMP recommends you not try firing them, I'd personally stick with thier advice.They are experts when it comes to all things Garand.Again that's just me though.do what makes you happy, as thats what really matters.

 

[ScottsGT]

If I could get one for $100, I'd make a lamp out of it. $250 is a little steep for me, but some of those (Garand) guys will buy anything the CMP offers just because the CMP sold it.
I'll buy anything from them too, but I do have one requirement. It has to go BANG!

 

[joewill]

$250 is a little steep for me

Yeah, I guess it is a bit steep, could have got a Dane without wood not to long ago for less, and it did go bang. But, on the other hand I have blew $ 250.00 in worse ways than on a Garand, even if it don't go bang. In fact, the ones I own that do shoot have been quiet lately do to the cost of ammo. 100 rounds down range costs about $ 26.00. 100 rds of .22 about $ 3.00. Maybe I really do need a 30-06 that don't go bang. About 10 trips to the range with the .22 and the savings will have paid for the Garand.

A few of my shooters can be seen at http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=345502&page=6

 

[ScottsGT]

Has the CMP .30-06 gone up? Last time I ordered, it was priced right. Cannot remember right off the price, but I'm thinking it was about .25 c per round?
Hey, think silencer and .22 Now that's a lot of fun!

 

[joewill]

Hasn't gone up much, 100 rds @ $ 26.00 is .26 a round.

Seems from what I have been reading on the Forum on the CMP site, it's the luck of the draw with these "ceremonial" Garands. If you are able to get to one of the "stores" ,and can pick one out, you can do OK. Some have just a small tack weld and can be fired. Others have a heavier weld and may not be safe to fire. By sending for one it's the luck of the draw, like alot of the CMP guns. Here is a post from someone over on the CMP forum that got one.

" My drill/ceremonial M1 from Anniston had two TINY tack welds that didn't even come close to fusing the barrel to the receiver.They were too tiny of a weld to have hurt the receiver heat treatment. I separated barrel and receiver, inspected and reassembled into a nice shooter. This may NOT be safe on some of these, but I feel safe with mine. The barrel had a TE of 4 and a muzzle ME of 2. Real pleased wiith it. Bill"

Well I sent for one so will keep you posted and let you know how I make out.
Oh, some of them also have some decent parts even if it turns out not to be a shooter.
If your interested in reading what others have to say go to the CMP page click on "Forum" and do a search for Ceremonial.

 

[iamkris]

Why would you spend $250 for an "iffy" barreled action then add $100+ on a stock when you could spend another $150 and get a rack grade that is almost guaranteed to be in better shape and be safe to fire?

 

[joewill]

Why would you spend $250 for an "iffy" barreled action then add $100+ on a stock when you could spend another $150 and get a rack grade that is almost guaranteed to be in better shape and be safe to fire?

First off, it's not a "barreled action", it's a complete rifle less wood.

No way is a "rack grade" guaranteed to be in better shape. pitting, wood can have cracks, poor fit, dents & gouges. TE 5 or more, muzzel wear over 3. For the most part the wood can be used as firewood. So the way I see it, discounting the wood, you paid $ 195.00 more for a rifle that is pretty much guaranteed to be a piece of cr**. This is where you should spend the extra $ 150.00 for the service grade.

As far as the Ceremonial, I admit it is a gamble, but one I am willing to take. You can't tell what you might get, could be a Winchester, H&R, I.H., a low # Springfield, no telling. Some folks have gotten some pretty nice rifles that shoot just fine. And even if you don't luck out with the rifle, how about the parts. They have value on E-Bay. I have sold rear sight assemblies for $ 50.00 to $90.00, Trigger groups, op-rods, complete bolts, depending on what you get you may get back more than the $ 250.00.

Here is what the weld on the barrel of one Ceremonial looks like, not to say they all are like this, they are not. But you do have a shot at something like this.


This is what the owner of the pictured rifle has to say:

" I opened up the ceremonial rifle box. Suffice to say, I'm very pleased!
--3 million with what look like original finish
--A completely IHC trigger group! Sweet.
--52 barrel with as-new specs (0 muzzle wear and 2 on the throat)
--small tack weld. I am taking this to a gunsmith to have checked
out. If it passes I'll build this into a shooter.
--Other parts are in great shape. Came with the blank adaptor, too."


So, as I said, it's a gamble for sure but one I am happy to take. As far as the wood, I have wood that has been sitting around quite a while waiting to be reunited with a Garand.

 

[usmc68]

About 6 years ago I obtained 9 ceremonial Garands for my local Legion Post. They came from Anniston. I stripped and inspected all of them and none were welded anywhere. I test fired everyone of them at the range.

IMHO what we recieved from the Army were better than my service grade that I bought from CMP.

So I wonder if these CMP ceremonials were from a different era or program than what I experienced. Possibly now very few Legions and VFWs care to provide support for veteran's funerals so maybe now the Army doesn't ruin these rifles?

By the way we were lucky to have received a Springfield, Winchester, International Harverster, and a H&R!
One of the Springfields is a 4 digit SN that I track back to Feb. 1939 mfg.

Yes the above is about Army issued cermonials vs the CMP ones. I suspect many of the ceremonial rifles returned to the Army end up at CMP as rack or service grade Garands?

 

[paintballdude902]

usmc thats too bad that vet organizations dont do much for vet funerals now

at my grand fathers funeral in october of 2006 a bunch of his friends from some detroit polish veterans group did the ceremony made me feel mighty proud of him to see these battle hardened men get a tear in their eye

 

[thomas carey]

Why would you spend $250 for an "iffy" barreled action then add $100+ on a stock when you could spend another $150 and get a rack grade that is almost guaranteed to be in better shape and be safe to fire?

Actually, I would like to get two garands that do not fire, because I need them for a drill & ceremony guard. anything but non-functioning could easily cause problems (i live in chicago.)

Does the CMP ceremonial M-1 look good? $350 is alot of money. any suggestions on where I can get a very nice looking, but totally non-functioning garand, for lower then $350?

 

[usmc68]

Why nonfunctional rifle?

re: anything but non-functioning could easily cause problems (i live in chicago.)

Here in Mass. probably the most liberal state in the country, you do not need a firearms ID card for ceremonial rifles. Of course you must belong to a veterans organization. I would hope Chicago and Ill. would provide the same exemption. I think having a nonfiring rifle can cause the same problems I think you are alluding to as a firing one?

My veteran father's funeral had a single rifleman but even it was remarkable. I have put the word out to the local Legions and VFWs that I offer myself and my Garand for veteral funeral duty. There is an organization called Bugles Across America that volunteers for veterans funerals. I don't see why I can't do the same.