magnum primers for 223rem

[Axis II]

loading hornady v max with h335. the guy that runs the reloading store I go to said I should try cci 450 primers/magnums instead of cci400 because my accuracy may improve.

any thoughts on this?

 

[spitballer]

The .223 being basically a .222 remington magnum I never hesitated to use the magnum primers with a full case of ball powder in a long rifle. Opinions regarding use with extrudeds seem to differ.

 

[TimSr]

Won't hurt to try them, but I wouldn't expect to see much difference.

Interesting that Winchester does not even make Small Rifle Magnum primers.

 

[WelshShooter]

Don't forget that you should back off the powder load when changing any component, primer included.

 

[sixguns]

Only buy 100 primers to test with instead of 1000 would be my advice.

It is interesting that Winchester doesn't make a SRM, but CCI does and also makes the No. 41 5.56 NATO which is a magnum. Perhaps the No. 41 is used only in specific types of ammo for the military? You know CCI isn't making the 41 just for us civilians.

 

[dirtman]

I have always used mag primers when using 748. Mostly because I tend to hunt and shoot in very cold conditions..... Any powder that is temperature sensitive is more consistent with a mag primer.

 

[NWcityguy2]

H335, of all the ball powders out there, tends to be harder to ignite. I avoid the powder because I think there are better powders out there and I have no legacy loadings that use the powder. With modern ball powders, there isn't an across the board benefit to magnum primers.

 

[otisrush]

My Speer manual calls for CCI 450 primers when using H335. (And when using all ball powders I believe - but don't quote me on that.) I can't comment on how it impacts accuracy - but based on that Speer manual 450s are the only primer I've ever used.

 

[sixguns]

My chronograph results show going to the magnum primer increases velocity about 50fps & that's without changing anything else.

 

[SIG9Fan]

I use CCI 450 primers and H335 without any issue. When I started reloading, I read magnum primers are preferable with an AR-15. Don't know what you're shooting but it won't hurt to use the magnum primers (aside from a few bucks more per box).

 

[ETXhiker]

The most commonly used justification for magnum primers with an AR, is the belief that the magnum primer cups are thicker and reduce the chances of a slam fire. But some people have used regular small rifle primers for decades with no problem. I haven't reloaded enough 5.56 to have an opinion about it.

 

[matrem]

Myself and several others I know and trust have done numerous accuracy tests through numerous .223s (bolts & ARs) with ball powders, H335 being the most often tried ball powder.

With H335, CCI 450s have not only consistently outperformed 400s, but BR4s as well.

The fact the magnum cup is a tick thicker is just an added bonus if you're using a .223 with a floating firing pin.

 

[Jim Watson]

Winchester does not make a specific small rifle magnum primer because all their primers are a bit hotter to ignite Winchester Ball Powder. Amazing coincidence.

 

[ZGunner]

I've used Magnum primers with AR-Comp and even Varget. Using low to mid loads it functions flawlessly with no sign of excessive pressure.

All round were fired through ARs.

 

[Seabeeken]

Cant hurt to try them and compare to standard. The cci 41 has a heavier cup for use in the AR-15 rifle to prevent slamfires. It also has a brass cup instead of the chrome plated one in the magnum. Don't forget to reduce your powder charge when going from standard to magnum primers. They will increase pressures. H-335 shoots best in both my AR and Savage varmint rifle.

Ken

 

[David4516]

I've been using the CCI 41 primers and H335 for .223 reloads, seems to be a good combination. H335 is so far the best powder I've tried in this caliber (compared to CFE223 and IMR4198, only other powders I've tested thus far)

 

[homatok]

Quote "Winchester does not make a specific small rifle magnum primer because all their primers are a bit hotter to ignite Winchester Ball Powder. Amazing coincidence."

So, does this mean I can expect Winchester primers to duplicate magnum primer performance from other manufacturers using extruded powders?

 

[ColoradoShooter77]

I've been using CCI 400's for a couple thousand rounds in a Mini-14 and no issues.

 

[W.E.G.]

The thicker (magnum) small rifle primers are thicker than the non-magnum by about 0.004"

This is enough to matter when running pressures near the limit.

If the primer cup is too thin, you will get piercing and/or blanking of the primer, and the gas escaping through the hole in the primer will do bad things to your firing pin and your boltface.

I am aware of no evidence whatsoever that the one or the other (standard vs. magnum) has any effect on practical accuracy.

I don't doubt that some benchrest shooter may have shot a slightly smaller cloverleaf using one or the other.

 

[RainDodger]

Just out of curiosity, does the same basic info hold true for Large Rifle also? Any problem going to a magnum primer instead of a standard one, regardless of caliber? Just back off the load a bit to test?

Not trying to hijack the thread, but it seems pretty well answered and I thought this was related....

 

[TimSr]

Just out of curiosity, does the same basic info hold true for Large Rifle also? Any problem going to a magnum primer instead of a standard one, regardless of caliber? Just back off the load a bit to test?

As with anything, requires some testing and your mileage may vary. Its the primer powder combination that may have varied results. It may not change anything, or it may give you greater or lessor velocity variations, or it may chnage your group size. Typically none of the changes will be drastic. Published load data is your friend. Primer recommendations are based on what gave them best results.

 

[tcoz]

H335 is a spherical powder and is coated to retard ignition. Per Hodgdon technical support, magnum primers are recommended for this reason. Either CCI450 or CCI41 which is what I use.

 

[Sunray]

Magnum primers have nothing whatever to do with the cartridge name. They're about the powder used. They burn a bit hotter for a bit longer and are for igniting hard to light powders and extreme cold weather shooting.
Using 'em or not using 'em doesn't make much difference.
There's nothing on Hodgdon's site about H335 needing 'em for .223. Hodgdon does say to use 'em for .222 Rem Mag and other magnum cartridges for unknown reasons though.
CCI "milspec" primers are nothing more than magnum primers. Brilliant marketing, but that's all.

 

[tcoz]

There's nothing on Hodgdon's site about H335 needing 'em for .223. Hodgdon does say to use 'em for .222 Rem Mag and other magnum cartridges for unknown reasons though.

When I first started loading .223 with H335, I called Hodgdon to see which primers they recommended. I was told by the technical rep I talked to that they recommended a magnum primer such as CCI450, CCI41 or Rem 7-1/2 for H335 as well as all of their spherical powders.

 

[Reloadron]

CCI No. 41 is a magnum primer
CCI BR4 is a magnum primer
CCI No. 450 is a magnum primer

Those are the main primers I use when loading 223 so I would guess all I use is magnum primers. While I have used standard primers with 223 I would say 90% of my loading is done with magnum primers regardless of the powder used. I always work my loads up noting velocity and accuracy.

For those who may be curious as to primer cup thickness:



The numbers on the chart are pretty much what I have come up with during my own curious experimenting. While the chart does not cover all primers it does cover several popular ones.

Happy Priming....
Ron