Hello Everyone! I have a Mosin and at the end of the barrel just past the front site there is a very slight buldge. Its about 1/2 inch long and it goes back to normal about 1/4 to a 1/2 inch from the end of the barrel. What could cause this and do you think its safe to shoot? The rifle hasnt been counterbored if that makes a difference.
Mosin Nagant Opinion On Barrel Buldge
- Thread starter Sks39
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Reloadron
Contributing Member
Looking down the bore is there a noticeable dark spot where the bulge is? How about running a patch or bore brush down the bore, do you feel a loose spot where the bulge is? The outward bulge, at that point, could just be some poor machining. Looking at the barrel do you see machining marks and if yes, my guess is it was just poor machining. There were periods when these rifles were turned out in high volume and good enough was simply good enough. Safe to shoot? Yes, as long as the barrel isn't obstructed I would have no reservation with shooting it.
Ron
Ron
Scooter22
Member
What model Mosin? I'm a little confused by your description and location. Is it in front of the sight up to the end of the muzzel? Or behind the front site toward the action? It could be part of the front sight assy where the bayonet lug was. Sometimes the lug has been ground off.
NIGHTLORD40K
Member
Need pictures.
caribou
Member
If there is a bulge at the muzzle end, the simple and easy, effective fix would be a counter bore.
Muzzle problems were delt with by counter bore when necessary, it fixxe's the crown and removes the damage so Its common.
Muzzle problems were delt with by counter bore when necessary, it fixxe's the crown and removes the damage so Its common.
Scooter22
Member
Yes for a damaged crown or worn from cleaning with steel cleaning rods over time in the first inch or so.. Not a bulge that close to the muzzel.
Steel Horse Rider
Member
What is the date on the receiver? After 1942 when the German's forced the arms factories to be moved further east the machining got a lot cruder on the Mosin's. If it is pre-1942 I would think it is probably from a defect. I personally wouldn't spend money repairing it unless you want to change barrels. Hang it on the wall and find another.
The major risk from a bulged barrel is that you can stick a bullet in the barrel firing reduced loads (and subsequent firing generates a kaboom) or even worse can cause a kaboom under the right circumstances. The risk for a kaboom in the latter as I understand it comes from the bullet briefly stopping and then trying to restart which causes pressures to spike behind the bullet.
From the O/P's description, it is hard to tell whether he is referring to a bulge nearly running the whole length of the barrel, whether the bulge is noticeable outside only, or whether it can be seen inside the barrel (the barrel bulges that I have seen usually show up when looking through the barrel as a distortion of the rifling).
For a true barrel bulge which extends from inside the barrel to outside, if it is only at the muzzle end, then counterboring is an easy fix and not uncommon in Russian Rifles as caribou notes above.
If it extends nearly the whole length from breech to muzzle, I would be dubious of firing something through that barrel and doubt accuracy would be good anyway. Not really sure how such a barrel would get that way though without giving way.
If it is simply poor machining on the outside of the barrel, then the barrel may not be particularly accurate or have a wonky point of impact due to harmonics but is probably safe to fire. As Steel Horse Rider notes, some of the later WWII rifles demonstrate pretty ugly machining and finish because of the desperate need for rifles to go bang.
From the O/P's description, it is hard to tell whether he is referring to a bulge nearly running the whole length of the barrel, whether the bulge is noticeable outside only, or whether it can be seen inside the barrel (the barrel bulges that I have seen usually show up when looking through the barrel as a distortion of the rifling).
For a true barrel bulge which extends from inside the barrel to outside, if it is only at the muzzle end, then counterboring is an easy fix and not uncommon in Russian Rifles as caribou notes above.
If it extends nearly the whole length from breech to muzzle, I would be dubious of firing something through that barrel and doubt accuracy would be good anyway. Not really sure how such a barrel would get that way though without giving way.
If it is simply poor machining on the outside of the barrel, then the barrel may not be particularly accurate or have a wonky point of impact due to harmonics but is probably safe to fire. As Steel Horse Rider notes, some of the later WWII rifles demonstrate pretty ugly machining and finish because of the desperate need for rifles to go bang.
entropy
Member
Sure and then you find out it's a Finnish M27.......
I’ve took a hack saw to a lot more expensive weapons to make them how I want em! Just leave yourself enough room a real smith can fix it if need be
Scooter22
Member
Yup, and the used gun racks are full of them that nobody wants.
caribou
Member
I have owned two Mosin 91/30's that had bulges near the muzzle fixed with counter-boring and one had a bit of filing done on the exterior, and from the blue/steel wear, it was to get the bayonet on.
Cutting the barrel down would ruin its overall collect-ability, but its your rifle.
I wonder what other ways a bulged barrel would be fixxed?
Cutting the barrel down would ruin its overall collect-ability, but its your rifle.
I wonder what other ways a bulged barrel would be fixxed?
I cant tell if says 1941 or1944?
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caribou
Member
A 1941 Isvehsk's made with a couple holes drilled and tapped on the receiver by someone much much later..
By '42 they would have been pushing the machinery pretty hard and broaching chatter marks would have not been smoothed on the reciever's outside surfaces.
The bulge is very fixable with counterboring and file work, if the materials there. If not, then just counter bore and shoot shoot shoot....
By '42 they would have been pushing the machinery pretty hard and broaching chatter marks would have not been smoothed on the reciever's outside surfaces.
The bulge is very fixable with counterboring and file work, if the materials there. If not, then just counter bore and shoot shoot shoot....
NIGHTLORD40K
Member
How does it look with a bore light? If the rifling looks straight I'd say leave it alone. If it is slightly bulged inside, I would cut it off and recrown. Its a pretty run of the mill Mosin- the improved accuracy would offset any loss of value to me.
This could be either poor machining or the result of a discharge with the muzzle obstructed (such as shoved in the dirt and snow). If you want a degree of extra reassurance, you could take the action and bolt to a machine shop and have it magnafluxed for cracks.
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Steel Horse Rider
Member
The last number looks like a 4 to me. I think it is just bad machining. If you can't feel a lack of resistance when you push a patch in the front of the barrel I would go shoot it. The outside profile does not appear to be a bulge to me. To bulge in that area it would require a Bugs Bunny - Elmer Fudd finger in the end of the barrel trick......
caribou
Member
I think its a 41, if you compare the straight back edge of the 4, and you can barely make out the 1 of the 1941 and its top sweep is curved.
This wouldnt be a factory defect, they would have filed the outside diameter to proper profile. Especially pre-war.
I bet a bayonet won't fit over that muzzle.
Ive seen bulged barrels over the years, from mud, ice and snow. Its not uncommon at this end of the earth.
Take it out and shoot it, it may not be effected at all.
This wouldnt be a factory defect, they would have filed the outside diameter to proper profile. Especially pre-war.
I bet a bayonet won't fit over that muzzle.
Ive seen bulged barrels over the years, from mud, ice and snow. Its not uncommon at this end of the earth.
Take it out and shoot it, it may not be effected at all.
Scooter22
Member
I haven't seen one bulged like that. I agree on trying it first. It may shoot ok and not a safety issue. If it shoots crappy then a counter bore could help. Looks like 41. Good luck.
Swampman
Old Fart
I'd shoot it.
Then depending on the accuracy you get (and your intended use of the rifle) you can either leave it alone, counterbore it (plus maybe cleaning up the outside contour with file work and some cold blue), or cut the barrel back.
Have you tried running a tight patch down the bore as previously suggested?
I recommend that you thoroughly decopper and clean the bore before doing so. It'll make it a lot easier to feel changes when you run the tight patch.
Then depending on the accuracy you get (and your intended use of the rifle) you can either leave it alone, counterbore it (plus maybe cleaning up the outside contour with file work and some cold blue), or cut the barrel back.
Have you tried running a tight patch down the bore as previously suggested?
I recommend that you thoroughly decopper and clean the bore before doing so. It'll make it a lot easier to feel changes when you run the tight patch.
If the bulge is at the end of the barrel, I would not be very concerned about it from a safety aspect. I will explain that later. I have a 270 Win barrel that I did not notice the dark spot at the end of the barrel till I bought the thing. It probably had been fired with snow, of something stuck in the muzzle and it had a dark spot that rotated when the barrel was rotating, indicating a bulge. That barrel would fling rounds, get a half decent group and then the thing would fling one way out. I sent it to a gunsmith who counterbored the thing and then it shot round groups, not particularly good round groups, but they were round.
If the bulge is further back in the barrel, lets say midway or closer to the chamber, I would recommend scrapping the barrel. If the internal diameter of the barrel has been permanently stretched, then the material has been stretched beyond yield, and it is weaker than it was before. The barrel is a pressure vessel. And it expands as a bullet and gas go down, each shot. The risk is, a weak spot in a barrel, given enough shots, or a high pressure round, the barrel could burst at that spot.
This was not a blow up due to a bulged barrel, but due to a rebored barrel. I disagree with reboring used smokeless barrels, barrels are not meant to have an infinite number of load cycles and this barrel was enlarged to a 35 Whelen, from what I think was a 30-06. The barrel was old, had been shot, it was a vintage barrel so the barrel materials were probably not as good as today, and the thing ruptured. The shooter was lucky it did not blow up where his hand was located, or blow up at the chamber. Barrel blow ups are dangerous and unpredictable and it is not worth getting hurt over some $200 rifle, or even, a $2,000 rifle.
MY GUN BLEW UP!!! Full disclosure on page 4 UPDATE.
http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/3221043/m/8041046622/p/1
illinoisburt
Member
Thats close enough you could certainly cut and recrown while staying in front of the sight. Should be a simple and straightforward fix. Heck the bayonet would still fit just fine too.
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