My Defense Kit O.K.? What do U use?

[drjoker]

Are my strategies O.K.?

Nightstand Kit;
9mm Glock 19, sure fire flashlight, tritium night sights. No laser. I think that a laser may give away my position if I'm trying to surprise a burlar. The sure fire flashlight is not attached to my Glock because I don't want to point my gun at someone until after I identify the person with my flashlight. I don't want to shoot my drunk neighbors entering the wrong house at night, etc. With a 9mm, there's less danger of overpenetration, but still have good stopping power, and there's no "kick" to recover from so I can place multiple rapid fire controlled aimed shots easily.

MAK-90 (a semi-auto AK-47), attached flashlight, and attached laser. This is for hostage situations. I am a crack shot with rifles. Used to be on the high school rifle team. It is Texas, so, yes, there's actually a gun range and guns stored on campus at my old high school. I am risking overpenetration in exchange for accuracy here. I cannot place a head shot reliably under high stress with a pistol, but I never miss with rifle, no matter what the situation. Plus, if it is not a hostage situation, I could minimize overpenetration by aiming down with hip/groin shots. This will end up with the bullet hitting the ground instead of flying into my neighbor's house. However, if I am on the second floor of my house, even a shot aimed down at the groin might still end up in the neighbor's house.

ballistic clothing (normal looking bullet proof jacket), first aid kit.

Concealed Carry Kit;
Glock 19 with tritium night sights, Sure Fire flashlight, bullet resistant vest or tactical clothing (normal looking jacket made of kevlar threads), pepper spray. Pepper spray is for situations where the BG doesn't have a gun. I would like to try my best to defend myself without having to kill someone, if possible. However, if the BG is holding a gun, then I'm not messing around with pepper spray. He's gonna be swiss cheese.

Hot days, Kel-Tec P3AT 380 instead of the Glock 19.

Car Kit;
MAK-90 with light and laser for hostage situations, 1st aid kit.

Thoughts;
Tell me what you think of the following?

Should I add Crimson laser to my Kel-Tec P3AT? Would I be giving up size and weight for this laser? I mean, how much more will the gun weigh with this laser? Is it significant? Is the laser any good?

I am thinking about using a Charter Arms 38 special aluminum frame revolver with Crimson Trace laser for concealed carry instead of the Glock 19. It is more reliable than an auto, especially because shots from inside a car or close range may have me hold the gun at funny angles "limp wristed" therefore causing a jam with an auto pistol. The laser is O.K. for concealed carry because I am not trying to sneak up on a burlar at night.

What do you think of Glaser Safety Rounds? I would like to use them in my AK to prevent overpenetration, but I also heard that they are not reliable in semi-autos. Glaser rounds may not reliably cycle the next shot. I heard that they will turn my rifle into a single shot rifle in a shootout. Is this true? Are Glaser Safety Rounds kinda like shotgun shots with a dozen tiny shots per pull of the trigger?

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Jeff White]

I don't see any strategies mentioned in your post. I just see a bunch of equipment listed. Equipment is absolutely the last thing you should be worrying about. Without the proper mindset and training the equipment is useless.

Which low light course have you been to with your Glock 19 and SureFire? How often do you practice with it in low light? How many rounds a year do you put through it in training....Note I said training, not plinking.

Who is going to be taken hostage in your home? Have you thought of investing some of the money that you spent on your MAK90 with light and laser on deadbolt locks, reinforced doorjambs, exterior lighting and an alarm system? You do need some notice of an intrusion so you have time to pick up your hostage rescue rifle and respond. What carbine training have you had with your MAK90? Being a crack rifle shot on the high school rifle team does not make you a gunfighter. Marksmanship is the easiest leg of the combat triad to master. Mindset and manipulation are the toughest and you don't learn those things shooting bullseye on the high school rifle team.

Carrying you MAK90 in your car for hostage situations. I have to ask why. Are you a police officer on a tactical unit who is required to respond to those situations? We carry pistols because they are convenient, not because they are effective. It's not socially acceptable where most of us live to walk around with our carbines slung all the time. So I have to ask, do you really think you'll be able to say "Time out guys! Wait right here, I'll be back in a minute." and then go retrieve your rifle from your vehicle? Of course not. I carried my Colt LE Carbine in my squad car every shift, and it came out every time I responded to a call where it was likely I'd need a firearm. But private citizens don't respond to calls for service. The private citizen needs to head the other way if he thinks he's going to get into a gunfight.

I think you should sell everything but one pistol (doesn't matter which one you keep, whichever you shoot better and fits your lifestyle best in caliber .38 special or larger) your rifle (sell the laser sight) and your hand held SureFire flashlight. Take the money you just received for your toys and invest it in good training.

Don't worry at all about ammunition selection. Plenty of bad guys have met their maker at the hands of plain old ball ammunition. There are no magic bullets. Spend the money you were going to spend on exotic ammunition on practice ammo. After you've got oh, 10K or so rounds fired in training then start researching ammo. By then you'll have enough experience under your belt that you probably won't worry so much about ammo selection.

It's all about software, not hardware. The guy who knows how to fight and has a police trade in Model 10 S&W and a single shot shotgun is better aprepared then the guy who has the latest in gadgets and modern arms but has little training or experience.

 

[Rockwell1]

To promote responsible gun ownership?

I admit that the OP here might be a little excessive but, no more so than this post

Originally posted by SM
Yep, even as a kid, I had a loaded revolver and it was not often in a nightstand, instead where I could access in a manner consistent with how one sleeps, and wakes up, and how one wakes up "startled".

Not many kids I suspect had lessons actually shooting from a real bed, with linens, covers, and pillows on a private range/ in a shoot house but I did.

(as an aside I doubt very seriously that even Barak Hussien Obama's children live under the above level of duress)

My point is that this could be a teachable moment as in;

Dr. Joker ( the name alone is making me rethink my tack here) The first thing that I would reccomend is a realistic threat accessment. What are the actual odds that you will be involved in a hostage situation? What are the actual threats you might face?
If you truly deem your personal threat level to be that high I would recommend some professional training in both tactics AND self defense legalitied in your area.

I'd say the answers to the above questions would dictate my equipment.

I would also reccomend that you engage the services of a professional bodyguard. I would also offer this counsel to anyone who's threat level is so high that their children are required to learn how shoot from a real bed in
a shutzhause.

Or I could just run out the guns, turn broadside and let a new member have it.

 

[sm]

Me?

-Next to my bed, I had a simple wooden chair, that I put my clothes on. I basically undress for bed, and leave clothes, shoes, socks handy where I can put them on in a hurry in case of an emergency, such as a fire.

-Rayovac, one AAA LED Penlight is on that chair, within arms reach.

-Garrity disposable flashlight is the room, where I keep a watch I sometimes wear, ink pen, and other stuff.

-Landline telephone stays in the bedroom.
Sometimes I have my portable phone in the bedroom.

No cell phone. Truth is, I am in a "dead zone" so cell phones are not that reliable where I reside.

-I have a cut off mop handle about 44" in length.

My concern is fire. So if the smoke alarm goes off, I have options.
I can use that stick, or chair, to bust out a bedroom window and exit that way.

I have another exit, just a short distance from my bedroom door, that I can access.
So my handkerchief kept in jeans , will assist me with smoke as I crawl to this other exit, which will allow me exit outside two different ways- a door, or going out a window.

-Non fire.

If evil shows up, I have options, including evading the same way I would with a fire.

I stay put in bedroom, or where I choose to stay put until help arrives.

IF matters were to dictate otherwise, say an event puts me in the kitchen, I have a 8" cast iron skillet on the stove, a lamp, broom, box of baking soda...handy.

All I have to do is stop that threat.
Lady Luck might allow the baking soda I throw in a face the distance I need to haul butt out the door.
Lady Luck might assist me if I use that cast iron skillet, which is harder than edged weapon steel, and might even deflect a bullet...

Yes, I have shot cast iron cook ware.

First Responders are going to see I was in fear of my life and I either stayed put, or had to fight my way to haul butt.

I have run these drills, and did so without my glasses. There is no guarantee I will have time to put them on, or I will not lose them in evading a serious situation.


So there is my S&T.

 

[bdickens]

Wow. You sure have a lot of stuff. What do you plan on doing with all that?

As the man said:

It's all about software, not hardware. The guy who knows how to fight and has a police trade in Model 10 S&W and a single shot shotgun is better prepared then the guy who has the latest in gadgets and modern arms but has little training or experience.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

Don't worry at all about ammunition selection.

I respectfully disagree. Some ammunition, like 9mm FMJ, has very poor stopping power, and endangers your neighbors. For either of the calibers this guy owns, he could get self-defense ammo and make sure it's reliable for probably less than $100 a caliber.

 

[Duke of Doubt]

Jimbo: "Some ammunition, like 9mm FMJ, has very poor stopping power, and endangers your neighbors."

I know what you mean to say, but this comment made me laugh. No offense, but it's like, "Nobody goes to that restaurant any more. It's too crowded."

 

[shiftyer1]

Ok I gotta know where in texas there are h.s. rifle teams. I may move so my kids can be exposed to this.

 

[mr.trooper]

I think you forgot the tin foil hat. It will protect your brains from the alien mind control rays.

I wouldn't put a cheap revolver above a glock in reliability either. just because something has a cylinder doesn't make it stone cold reliable.

I'm going to echo training over equipment. You say your a CRACK SHOT. I can nail clay pigeons at 30 yards with the factory irons on my standard model Ruger MKIII, but that doesnt make me a gun fighter; it makes me a target shooter.

 

[gladi8tr]

Get some good training and after that get some more. Lose the mak 90 and get a shotgun for your home. As for ammo shot placement is key so that goes back to training. Get alot of it. Also everyday life is not a Bruce Willis movie there is no reason for a civilian to be driving around my state with a mak 90 in the trunk. Yes the some of the rural schools in Texas have shooting teams but not to many with larger caliber than 22 so being a snap shot with a 22 is alot diffrent than a semi auto 30 caliber weapon.

 

[sm]

I did not mention "gun" in my first post on purpose.

I have been fed up with folks trying to buy skill and targets, since before The Great Equipment Race actually come to be. I was fed up as it was getting a head of steam built up.
My "fed-up-ness" has grown exponentially over the years.

There is a helluva lot of truth in regard to quote above and the Model 10 and Single shot.

I do have a Youth single shot shotgun in 20 ga.
For the first time in over 50 years of living, I do not have a Model 10 , or S&W K frame in dedicated 38spl. I had one left, from all the ones I had, all the Police Trade-ins and...
I had one Model 64, 3" RB HB. left.
I am liable to break down in tears thinking about that gun being gone now.

I will never have another Model 64 like that one, even I should ever buy another one.

WE have BTDT.
I used it bone stock. It has worn genuine Ivory stocks, and some other wood...
It was used most with the original stocks and loaded with Standard Pressure 158 gr LSWC.

That Model 64 was like a body part to me, heck, with lessons (ya'll call it training today) in no light, low light, I could hit better with it that I could the toilet taking a leak at 2am.

I am that way with the youth single shot 20 bore, I was raised, mentored and had lessons with youth single shots since I was no taller than a kitchen table.

If you are a criminal, and come in on me and announce evil intent and RACK YOUR Slide I own you. No brag, just a fact and promise.
Go ahead and use that door for cover, because I am running slugs and have lessons in "punching on thru".

Lights.
I started out with Chrome Flashlights, with glass lens, and besides On/Off, these had Intermittent Buttons.

I wish like heck I still had some of these, and I wish like heck Rayovac , or someone would make flashlights with Intermittent Buttons.

I am ashamed to admit I have forgotten Morse Code, still part of my defensive plan did include using the Intermit feature to signal Cops, or Others where I was.

Another advantage, and how my lessons were, was to not use the friggin' light to get myself shot.

-You don't give evil a target with light, or racking your shotgun.
I don't give a rip what the Internets says.

Re: FMJ / Ball Ammo.

Horsepucky and Bull Chips!

I want 9mm FMJ, and I want 45ACP Hardball.

Having come up, and spent a life in hi-risk , being a target for kidnapping and other fun and wonderful stuff.

I want FMJ/ Hardball.

My defensive plan included shooting lanes, tested back stops and all sorts of things.

Glass Deflects. Slugs, FMJ, and Hardball deflect less.
One way mirrors, decorative room dividers, glass doors, and other things were thought out, tested and implemented as part of my/our defensive plans.

My lessons included a lady ( friend, partner, gf, wife- whatever) , being kidnapped, and me having to take the shot through glass.
My lessons included hearing a recording of ladies being attacked raped, and having to take shots in low light.

Other neat defensive plans included light switches, that might turn on a light behind a BG, or turn on a light on my roof top, or turn on a signal in the apt/condo next to mine, or a trusted neighbor next door.

Practiced plans, and Communications.
Little things, like lights viewed from outside. If "that" light was off, either trouble showed up, or the bulb went out. Either way, practiced plans and steps to find out if I was okay.
Even if just a bulb going out.

Ditto for defensive plans and "that" light being on.

How many of you have lessons in being in a shoot house, with it arranged to replicate your bedroom?
Then you go to bed.
You do exactly what you do at home, sleep in jammies, birthday suit, briefs, or briefs and T shirt.

I have, and WE don't do Pact timers for a start. In the real world BGs do not use Pact Timers when they begin evil.

How many of you have fallen asleep in a recliner, or on the sofa reading?
How many of you have replicated this in a shoot house, or on the range?

Why not?

Ladies, I concede you gals know how to arrange furniture, and decorate a home.
I do suggest you also do these replications of your settings on a range or shoot house.
Cardboard boxes are easy to come by and are arranged as dressers, night stands, book shelves, ...etc.
I assure you I will not ask why a piece of furniture is where it is , because I know you have taken the defensive measures by shooting /defending yourself in a setting just like the one you live in.
You have shooting lanes, cover, and backstops.

I don't need to know what guns and ammo you use, none of my business.
I figure if you have Investigated & Verified your setting, spent time with lessons and practiced plans, then you have the guns, ammo and whatever else figured out for you as well.

I will find a old chrome flashlight with glass lens and intermittent button someday, and it will again be part of MY toolbox for MY defensive plans.

I miss my Model 64 3" RB HB
*tears plop*

 

[Jeff White]

I respectfully disagree. Some ammunition, like 9mm FMJ, has very poor stopping power, and endangers your neighbors. For either of the calibers this guy owns, he could get self-defense ammo and make sure it's reliable for probably less than $100 a caliber.

Ammunition selection is absolutely the last thing that anyone needs to worry about. You need to spend your money on training and practice ammunition. When you are proficient and have a continuing training regimen in place, then and only then should you start your search for the mythical magic bullet. Until then you are just wasting your money. Having your weapons loaded with the most high tech devastating ammo ever made is a big waste of you can't bring the weapon itself into play. Most people never buy enough duty or carry ammo to even make certain that it is reliable in their weapon. Why, because it's too expensive. Where can you buy 500 rounds of any duty/carry type 9mm for $100? Just because your semi auto functions with one magazine full doesn't mean it's reliable. I wouldn't recommend carrying any ammunition for duty/carry use in any semi auto unless the weapon you are carrying has digested a minimum of 500 rounds of it without any malfunctions.

 

[shootistpd27]

Thank heavens for folks like drjoker. I was afraid that I spent too much time wondering "what if"? Everyone wants to be protected and have the ability to make an efficient defense but your concealed carry kit sounds logical only in Iraq, Somalia(in the really hungry parts), or Beirut. Save the money for a vest and invest it in a class in verbal judo. If you are carrying a firearm for personal civilian protection then you dont need the pepper spray. Cops have to worry about defending themselves and making sure the bad guy lives or doesnt get hurt. If you have a firearm and you are in a hand to hand combat situation. If you level of force used against you does not meet the criteria for a return of deadly force, then you must protect yourself and your weapon and run. I am a cop but if I am off duty I will run if a fist fight was imminent for with a gun I cannot run the risk of losing the fight and my gun, I cant shoot someone for taking a swing at me, so retreat is my only option.

 

[Claude Clay]

planing, practice and contingencies are up to date.
house has selected lights on each level controlled from master BR so that BG's can be back lite. next to my bed are e-muffs [so i can hear them whispering anywhere in the house] and they wont even know. also protects my hearing if i have to shoot my sw40ve [14+1 of 40]. my flash is in my weak hand and main use is to blind them, not find them. sks or m1 carbine stays with the wife in the bedroom until i, if necessary, call her to me.
the dogs can do whatever they want to--bark, bite or chew.

 

[drjoker]

Thanks for the Advice.

Thanks,

I'll look into taking a course of some sort. Plinking and readiness are two different things. I assumed that they were the same. I am wrong.

No, I dont' need a tin foil hat. I'm sure many of you have SHTF kits, too.

Yea, you're right, I probably need to replace my fire extinguisher. It is past expiration date.

I am born and raised in Texas. I went to Plano High School. They have a ROTC gun range on campus. I live in a small town now in North Texas so I no longer live in Plano. So, I don't know if they still have a gun range on campus.

Thanks, guys. I knew I would get some good advice here. Now, I'm going to call my local range and see if they offer a course of some sort. Next, I'm going to buy a new fire extinguisher. The probability of fire is a lot greater than a SHTF scenario.

Se y'all later and thanks again,
Drjoker.

BTW, will someone tell me if Glaser safety rounds are frangible bullets or shotgun type rounds that shoot a bunch of little shots at the same time. Thanks.

P.S. Yes, it is socially acceptable in small town Texas to have a gun rack with a rifle in your car. I see it all the time, especially during hunting season. You may think that 9mm is an ineffective round, but I use 9mm as my main gun because the rounds are cheap so I could afford to practice, practice, and practice. You asked, "why do you need all this stuff?" Instead, I invite you to ask, "why don't you need all this stuff?" It is our patriotic duty to exercise our right to bear arms. You know why the Japanese didn't invade us during WWII while our boys were away in Deutschland? Because we are armed citizens, that's why. You know why the terrorist attacks in India don't happen in Texas, because Texans are armed, that's why. Years ago, I remember there was a crazy gunman at UT Austin. Private citizens pinned him down with rifle fire from hunting rifles, preventing further casualties. A private citizen accompanied 2 policemen when charging up the tower to stop the killer. You had to cross a big open area to get to the tower and these three gentlemen were the only ones in the immediate area brave enough run through an expanse with no cover to stop the killer. For national security, patriotism, and defense from terrorism, we should all be well armed. ALL citizens should be armed and trained in civilian marksmanship so that if our liberty were ever threatened, we would be able to enlist and defend our country at a moment's notice. How can you expect the police and military to give their lives to defend you if you will not even defend yourself? You know what happened after Great Britain banned their guns? The gun homicide rate went up 300%!!! Criminals had guns, but law-abiding citizens were left defenseless.

You know what gets me mad? I just found out that gun banner Senator Feinstein, has a CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT in California! So, our lives are less valuable than hers? She can defend herself but we cannot? Here's the link: http://www.thegunsite.us/feinstein.html . What a crock of sh*t ! The rich have their concealed carry permits, secret service, and bodyguards. We are not allowed to protect ourselves. Our lives, our money, our livelihoods are not as important as theirs. Write your legislators! Vote! Organize peaceful protests! I invite you to get serious, NOW.

 

[Jeff White]

BTW, will someone tell me if Glaser safety rounds are frangible bullets or shotgun type rounds that shoot a bunch of little shots at the same time. Thanks.

They aren't exactly frangible bullets, they are shot suspended in some kind of medium encased in a capsule. They do penetrate enough to be seriously considered for defensive use. They were all the rage 20+ years ago, but now they are pretty much a novelty item. I didn't even know they were still in production.

http://www.dakotaammo.net/products/glaser/glaser.htm

For over 30 years, Glaser Safety Slug has been the perfect choice for use in populated, urban areas. Glaser's composite design uses a special thin-wall jacket, and precision compressed lead shot core with a soft polymer tip. This construction provides optimum balance between penetration and fragmentation. These round nose profile guarantees feeding reliability. Stopping power is maximized by the complete dispersal of the bullet energy into the intended target with immediate shock and trauma.

This rapid fragmentation delivers the energy to a large area. Reduced recoil allows a fast recovery for follow up shots if necessary. This makes Glaser the best choice for defensive situations.
Glaser Blue penetrates five to seven inches in International Ballistic Wound Association protocol testing, while silver penetrates eight to ten inches in the IWBA testing protocol.

Blue is suggested for warmer climates where apparel is lighter making penetration easier.

You want at least 13 inches of penetration to make sure you get to the vital organs and glasers don't give you that.

 

[SIRVEYR666]

WOW! No strategies, no tactics, but a nice EDC kit for a war zone.