My eyes have been opened, I want to go hunting.

[Hoplophile]

I like animals and I don't think I can keep buying meat from the store and feel good about it. I know very well those cattle are raised in horrendous conditions, slaughtered brutally, and fed unnatural things. It can't be more unethical to shoot an animal with a fair chance of escape, which has enjoyed his life, had offspring, and eaten a natural diet.

Plus, I'm a college student, and the prospect of cheap, plentiful meat is very attractive. So, I have a few questions about hunting.

1) ...uh, where do I learn about hunting?

2) Is hunting normally done in a still? I have this crazy primitive fantasy of walking out into the untouched wilderness with little more than my gun and my knapsack, to silently stalk a deer, etc etc etc. The idea of slithering around in the wilderness, watching my quarry is far more attractive than swilling beer in some excessively hot shack with like eight other people. I want to see and experience the stalk. Plus, using less gear means I can move more quickly, and it's less expensive. More "true hunt", I guess. And it's exercise. At the end of the day, when I come home without a deer, at least I'll have gone on an excellent day trip.

3) When is it legal to kill a deer? I'm in Florida.

4) Does 7.62x39mm work for deer?

Any other tips for someone who's never even shot at a deer-shaped target?

I'm actually more interested in buffalo, but there aren't any around here.

 

[Rolando]

1) ...uh, where do I learn about hunting? books, videos, magazines, forums. But the best is with a mentor.

2) Is hunting normally done in a still?
Many people use treestands or blinds but it is also common to stalk also. Last weekend I stalked my way up to two deer by just walking slowly upwind, using binoculars, being quiet and patient and If I had a gun and it was in season they would have easily been bagged. Still hunting is actually where you walk and stand hunting is where you sit. Weird huh? It is more active than hunting from a treestand or blind and you get to really use your senses. Walk slowly, listen.. watch your step to be quiet.. look for signs like tracks, rubs, bedding areas. Notice which way the wind is blowing. Where's the food source? Where's the deer trail. What's that noise?? It really puts you in a hunting mode that tickles a primitive instinct that most humans don't get in touch with.

3) When is it legal to kill a deer? I'm in Florida.

Google for your wildlife dept.'s website

4) Does 7.62x39mm work for deer?
Its adequate. I've used it. Took a little 4 point deer with one. Iron sights at 50 yards. Right in the bullseye and it ran about 50 more yards before dropping. Use a cartridge with a good softpoint bullet.
Many SKS have harvested a deer. Some will say its not good but don't believe'em. Shot placement is key. Put the time in at the range and place the shot well and you'll be fine.

Any other tips for someone who's never even shot at a deer-shaped target?
go shoot some deer shaped targets!! get a magic marker and some cardboard and make some deer shaped targets.
I'm actually more interested in buffalo, but there aren't any around here.
MMM Buffalo!!!

 

[ojibweindian]

The best way to learn how to hunt is to go with someone who has put lots of time in the woods. The second best way is to grab a book on the basics of deer hunting, then just get out there and do it.

I took the second best route.

 

[qajaq59]

Before you think about hunting with your rifle you want to take the hunter safety course. Then spend as much time as you can at the rifle range so that you are completely competent with it. Almost works OK for hand granades, but it isn't worth much with a rifle bullet.

And I've hunted for many, many years and never spent any time in a cabin with a bunch of guys drinking. That's strictly Hollywood crap. If you're going to put on some miles to harvest a deer, and then have to drag him back to the car, you're not likely to want to do it with a hangover.

Also keep in mind that the harvested deer is the result of the hunt, but not necessarily the reason for it. There are plenty of us who couldn't care less if we get one. We just like hunting them.

 

[C&R]

<Rant mode on>

You stated “I know very well those cattle are raised in horrendous conditions, slaughtered brutally, and fed unnatural things” Have you seen it first hand or rhetoric and distortions from a group like PETA the animal equivalent to the Brady bunch. Something to think about: If PETA is so concerned about people using animal products that they would throw red paint on women with fir coats, why don’t they use the same tactic on leather clad bikers?

I have a small cattle operation. Good cattle producers do not do the things you suggest – they would loose money! If you treat the animals well they will gain weight faster and bring you more $$$$. In Florida the cattle are raised on natural green pastures, with their needs taken care of by the rancher. The defiantly enjoy their life, have offspring, and eat a natural diet. Unlike animals in the wild they are wormed to remove parasites that would cause them discomfort and provided salt with minerals to make up what the land is deficient in for a healthy life. When the natural food source is low we provide hay, molasses and cattle cubes to make sure they have enough to eat. We have a number of wild deer that enjoy the food as well.

The approximate firearm equivalent to what you describe is to shoot corrosive ammo and not clean afterwards, drag your firearms around in the dirt, and use them in place of a hammer or pry bar. I am sure that there are some people that treat their firearms that way, but I try to take care of mine.


Thanks for listing

<Rant mode off>

Now to try to be of assistance

Here is a link to hunting information at the Florida Fish and wildlife website:
http://myfwc.com/hunting/

Many hunters in Florida hunt from tree stands after scouting out where the deer travel. Read the books and watch the videos to get half a clue and then go out hunting with someone that is experienced. There is a lot to learn and everyone goes about it slightly different. By the time you add up all of your costs venison is probably more expensive the steak, but it sure tastes good! For most the value is in the fun of the hunt.

If I wanted to “harvest” a deer in season on our land I would drive to the east side on my tractor (deer are not afraid of the tractor) hop off and shoot the deer of my choosing and bring it back in the bucket of the tractor. I don’t consider that sporting enough so I would not hunt unless they were overpopulated in my area.

Please respect fences, No Trespassing signs, and mind the four rules.

 

[Son of Sam]

The approximate firearm equivalent to what you describe is to shoot corrosive ammo and not clean afterwards, drag your firearms around in the dirt, and use them in place of a hammer or pry bar. I am sure that there are some people that treat their firearms that way, but I try to take care of mine.

He never described a firearm, he asked about a round. The 7.62X39, to be specific. There are many different manufacturers of this ammo and only even a few of the old combloc milsurps are corrosive. Besides that, what makes you think people who own rifles which chamber this round "drag them around in the dirt, use them as a prybar/hammer, or don't clean their weapon"? Are you a Fudd or just genuinely biased against this round in general or any weapon that might chamber them?

If I wanted to “harvest” a deer in season on our land I would drive to the east side on my tractor (deer are not afraid of the tractor) hop off and shoot the deer of my choosing and bring it back in the bucket of the tractor. I don’t consider that sporting enough so I would not hunt unless they were overpopulated in my area.

Reread the OP. The gentleman would like to hunt for the experience of it all, not anything like you describe. Where are you going with this?

I watched a whole BUNCH of hunting videos before I ever even bought a rifle. After I bought a rifle I talked endlessly with a coworker who liked to talk about nothing BUT hunting. I finally convinced him to take me along and I've been hunting ever since. He still teaches me new things ever chance we get to chat or even when we go to the range. I have a great time no matter what every time I hunt (deer or no deer)...

 

[crebralfix]

Take a class! Nothing like having someone showing you how to scout, set up, and so forth.

 

[Art Eatman]

No argument with the above commentary, but let me add:

Spend as much time as you can "out in the boonies". Most critters do most of their moving in the late evening or in the early morning, insofar as when us daylight folks would see them.

In order to really be successful, you need to learn critter behavior. When they feed, where they feed and where they bed down. This means not only spending time sitting and watching, but learning to find tracks and become able to read them.

Even "just settin'" is a learning experience. You gotta learn how to do a really good imitation of a rock or stump, since critters key on motion just really instantly.

Camo is only needed for turkey hunting. Birds see colors; turkeys are fantastic about remembering what the country looked like, yesterday or the day before. It's called "pattern recognition". Otherwise, even for doves and ducks, dull earth-toned clothes work just fine. Mammals out there see in shades of gray, so again, the earth-tones are fine.

Walking, outdoors, is not like marching on a sidewalk. Animals do not walk with any sort of rhythm. So, you take a step or three and pause. Look down for your next two or four steps and look around as you take those steps. Repeat for hours.

You spend some weekends trying all this, even in a sorta-tame city park, and you'll find it gets easier...

Art

 

[H&Hhunter]

My eyes have been opened, I want to go hunting.
I like animals and I don't think I can keep buying meat from the store and feel good about it. I know very well those cattle are raised in horrendous conditions, slaughtered brutally, and fed unnatural things. It can't be more unethical to shoot an animal with a fair chance of escape, which has enjoyed his life, had offspring, and eaten a natural diet.

Plus, I'm a college student, and the prospect of cheap, plentiful meat is very attractive. So, I have a few questions about hunting.

1) ...uh, where do I learn about hunting?

2) Is hunting normally done in a still? I have this crazy primitive fantasy of walking out into the untouched wilderness with little more than my gun and my knapsack, to silently stalk a deer, etc etc etc. The idea of slithering around in the wilderness, watching my quarry is far more attractive than swilling beer in some excessively hot shack with like eight other people. I want to see and experience the stalk. Plus, using less gear means I can move more quickly, and it's less expensive. More "true hunt", I guess. And it's exercise. At the end of the day, when I come home without a deer, at least I'll have gone on an excellent day trip.

3) When is it legal to kill a deer? I'm in Florida.

4) Does 7.62x39mm work for deer?

Any other tips for someone who's never even shot at a deer-shaped target?

I'm actually more interested in buffalo, but there aren't any around here.

Hoplophile,

First off don't take any of this wrong I am not trying to trash you or insult you in any way.

But some of the things in your post I find extremely offensive and ignorant.

I am form the Western USA. The statement "I know very well those cattle are raised in horrendous conditions, slaughtered brutally, and fed unnatural things." is simply not correct and it sounds as though you've been indoctrinated into the PETA crowd here just a bit. I am not blaming you, as long as you claim to have opened your eyes I'd like you to start seeing the truth.

We raise our cattle out here on open range land. They are not "raised in horrendous conditions" they are raised in wide open beautiful spaces. If you don't want to eat cattle that have been fed unnatural things then buy grass fed cattle not feed lot cattle.

The way the commercial cattle market works for the most part is that cattle are born and raised on free range pasture. Some of them are rounded up and slaughter right off that pasture some are sent to a feed lot for fattening. But they are not raised in feed lots.

Secondly hunters do not sit in a hot shack with 8 other people and swill beer. The people you are referring to are called slobs. They are not hunters. The scenario you describe here is also a preconceived and much propagated image from the anti hunting movement.

Come and hunt with me and you'll see that nothing could be further from the truth for the majority of hunters.

Let me explain to you what the average day on one of my hunts looks and feels like.

I will wake up at about 2 to 3 hours before sunrise my camp will be just below treeline or as far up the mountain as I can get depending on the snow levels. My camp consists of a wall tent and an outfitter stove.

The temp is usually about -15f to -20f if it is a clear morning and on a snowy morning it will be warmer like in the 20's. After firing up the stove and cooking an all day breakfast I'll either saddle up a horse or depending on the circumstances I'll use a four wheeler to get up to area I want to hunt for the day.

My hunts will consist of climbing to a high vantage point usually a peak or a high ridge line over looking a large chute or some other area that elk like to travel. I'll watch that for the morning movement times. If I happen to see something that I want to go after I'll plan a stalk and try to get a shot.

If I don't have any luck in the morning I'll hike into thick timber and start still hunting for the day. Still does not men standing still it means that I'll get into thick cover and move very slowly until I find sign.I'll start tracking that sign until it gets fresh. After the sign freshens I go back into still hunter stealth mode and work the sign until I get onto elk. Hopefully I'll get a shot. If I do then the work begins with a pack out.

On average I climb several thousand vertical feet a day and cover between 5 and 15 miles on foot.

Can you see why I take a bit of offense at your beer swilling slob comment?
There is a right way and wrong way to do things whether it be hunting or any thing else in life.

I understand from your post that you want to do things the right way and I applaud you for that! Good on you! No matter where you hunt you can keep it real if you want to, Florida should not be an exception.

I am willing to help you any way that I can but it's pretty darn hard to do so on the net.

If you have any specific questions I'll be glad to try and answer them. Good luck and happy hunting.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

The other aspects to your question have been answered well - as to the ethics of raised meat thing - I'm the same way....I now, as of recently, refuse to eat any meat (except fish) that I didn't kill myself, due to the inhumane conditions that animals are raised in.*** Maybe not cattle, but chickens are, as I understand things.

***I should say, that this is my goal and this is my thinking, and I've stuck to it for awhile on a couple of occasions, but have fallen off the wagon - I'm currently in a lapse state, but plan to get back on soon - sigh, I have virtually zero willpower when it comes to tacos, enchiladas, and various and sundry other meat dishes.

The idea of slithering around in the wilderness, watching my quarry is far more attractive than swilling beer in some excessively hot shack with like eight other people. I want to see and experience the stalk. Plus, using less gear means I can move more quickly, and it's less expensive. More "true hunt", I guess. And it's exercise. At the end of the day, when I come home without a deer, at least I'll have gone on an excellent day trip.

You have the EXACT right idea about what true hunting is, and what hunting should be. And many hunters start out the gear-obsessive way and end up the go-light way that you describe, ultimately. Better to be wise as you are and start off the right way (but always take enough gear to keep you alive - for example, lots of warm clothes and good food in cold weather). As explained by H&H, your ideal is very close or identical to most true hunters' ideal. I hunt alone, and though I often use a blind, I stalk hunt (aka "still hunt" as well). I cannot sit still for very long, so I'll sit on the ground or in a blind or stand for 1 or 1.5 hours tops early in the morning, then slowly stalk hunt to another location, and when it grabs my fancy - looks like a good spot, I'll sit for 45 minutes to 1 hour more. And so on. Then back to camp for lunch. Then repeat. Then setup again for 1 to 1.5 hours from setting sun to end of hunting hours. I really enjoy trying to identify trees, wildflowers, mushrooms, birds and wild animals as much as the hunt. I take binocs and take mental notes of all birds, etc. Then back in camp, I keep identification books for same and look them up. A bad day hunting is twice as a good as a good day working!

And alcohol and weapons do not mix (except AFTER the hunt is over, in the evenings) - yeah, methinks you've fallen victim to the PETA propoganda. I'm sure there's a certain percentage of guys in the woods who drink all day while waiting for animals, but I would call them slob hunters or just slobs. I'd guess this is a smallish minority.

 

[fivepaknh]

I got into hunting for the same reason. I saw a few PETA videos online and thought the way those animals are treated is horrible. I figured the same thing that at least game animals live a happier life. Reading here it looks like not all cattle or other critters are raise in terrible conditions, but the damage is done. I’m now hooked on hunting. I wonder how many other people PETA has turned into hunters? I’m sure that’s not exactly the intent of their videos.

 

[trickshot]

Hoplophile

You can't believe the propaganda that PETA puts out. All of it is a gross distortion of facts, and a lot of it is flat out lies. However I think a lot of the meat and fish sold in the supermarkets does not have much flavor. The best way to experience what old fashioned farm fresh meat tastes like, is to buy it from a small farmer, and I suppose that's impossible to do if you live in a city.

It's my opinion that most of the TV shows, videos, and magazines about hunting are primarily an infomercial and advertisement for a lot of stuff that you do not need or want. I grew up poor on a big farm and I started hunting at age twelve with a cheap single shot shotgun and cheap 22 rifle and wearing my farm work clothes; and I was just as successful as anyone today with all the latest fad in guns and accessories. My role models for hunting have always been the pioneers like Daniel Boone, and I like to read stories of how they hunted. When I hunt, I try to see how close I can sneak up on the animal before I shoot it.

Also keep in mind that there are many more kinds of wild animals and birds that you can eat besides deer. I love the taste of wild meat, and I enjoy hunting and eating them all; rabbit, squirrel, deer, turkey, pheasant, quail, duck, goose, etc.

There are some older more experienced hunters who would be glad to teach you, ask around, maybe on a Florida hunting forum. When your out hunting, take your time, slow way down, and enjoy the sights, sounds, and smells of the great outdoors.

 

[MCgunner]

Actually, my buddy's cows have it made. All they have to do all day is eat, defecate, and well, the bull really has it made.

 

[AntiqueCollector]

Can't really generalize about how meat is raised and apply it to every producer. The big factory farms are pretty bad, but there's a lot of farms and ranches that are quite good. Of course, if you shop at a big box store odds are you're getting stuff from the factory farms.

In any case, to your questions: learn by reading, from others (if they're good at it), and spend some time in the woods just observing things, practicing walking silently as possible, etc.

Hunting can be done standing still or moving. I think there's more success in standing still for a time then moving around a bit too if the area isn't good. Up North here because of the leaves on the ground in the Fall, if it's dry, moving silently can be a big challenge (downright impossible at times). Don't drink while hunting, bad idea.

Check with your wildlife department for hunting seasons, regulations on firearms, etc. You may be required to take a hunter education course, I'm not sure (I did in VT). 7.62X39 is fine for deer, it's about equal to a 30-30. I wouldn't try it on a bear though, personally. If you're using a semi-auto (SKS or AK) many states restrict semi-autos, limit capacity while hunting, etc. Check the rules carefully.

Aim for the lung/heart area. Head's too small of a target unless you're a really good shot under all conditions.

 

[ljnowell]

I think it should also be pointed out that there isnt a cheap way to hunt big game. Between supplies, tags, and everything else that comes into it, its expensive. If venison were beef I would say most guys would be better off lb for lb buying some beef at the grocery store cost wise. If cost is your factor you need to get yourself a brick of 22lr shells and go squirrel hunting, thats cheap.

 

[22-rimfire]

Once you have your equipment, hunting might be considered "cheap" entertainment and that assumes you have a free place to hunt deer.

As was mentioned, the easiest way to learn to hunt is with a friend who hunts. You can learn "about" hunting from magazines, books, etc. The best way to learn to hunt is to start hunting small game and be observant of what is going on around you.

The 7.62x39 is marginal for deer hunting. But if that is all you have, I'd use it with good expandable bullets.

You need to practice some with your rifle of choice. Limit your range to the distance you can hit a 6" paper plate just about everytime.

You can hunt deer anyway you want to from stalking to sitting in a free standing stand. Each approach limits has some implications on firearm selection. I usually hunt deer now with a revolver, so I don't sit in a box stand in the middle of a field hoping that a deer will wander within 50 yds.

 

[Grizfire]

Step 1. Take a hunters education/safety course.
Step 2. Meet other like minded individuals (You will find people in your class..network)
Step 3. Find someone who will take you hunting. Learn from this person.
Step 4. Go hunting on your own and enjoy.

 

[Jst1mr]

Hollywood crap..., Slobs

???!!

There are many shacks up here in the North Central (MI,MN,WI) woods shared by several deer hunters (many have put their money together to buy the cabin/land) during season. Some sit up in the evening (remember, it gets dark early up here!), play cards, and *gasp* have a beer or two. It is an enjoyable man-retreat for a week or so, often a couple hundred miles from home. They are up early to cook breakfast and hit the woods - not inebriated, hung over, or slobs in any form or manner. If this "deer camp" is not to your liking, fine....but my guess is that these folks won't call you names for going about it your way. If tramping and tracking through the north woods snow is somehow less pristine than the "Marlboro man" in the mountains, just because they get together at a cabin at the end of the day - well, I don't see it. If a beer or two at the end of the day makes them slobs - I don't see that either. When the hunting is ethical and sporting, we all have the obligation to support each other and not wallow in elitist name-calling. There are slobs among us, to be sure, and we must do all we can to police our ranks, but there are as many ways to hunt deer as there is variety in the deer themselves.

 

[ChefJeff1]

I too started hunting only 3 years ago for a source of affordable organic lean meat. I"m not sure if i actually save any money with gear, time, etc. but it is still better than the store. Good luck.

 

[Rolando]

Trickshot is right about the clothes. I wear warm clothes and don't get decked out in full camo. Here in Oklahoma we're required to wear blaze orange hat and upper body covering. I was at Bassproshop and it was 95% camos. I thought it was kinda silly since you have to put the orange on over the camo.
Deer only see yellow and blue very well so If you avoid those colors you'll do better.
You can really get obsessed with the gear like camo underpants, scent blocking shoe inserts, doe urine, $1000 rifles, $500 scopes, skinning knife, ghillie boots, etc. Cool stuff to have if you think it gives you an edge or want to spend a bunch of $$ on gear. Nothing wrong with that. I think about my grandpa going deer hunting in 1938, wearing jeans, warm coat, Winchester 30-30, stalking up to a deer and shooting it. Using his regular pocketknife to field dress it. Throw it up on the horse and ride home. I tried to duplicate that hunt last year and it was a success. I wore regular clothes (all I had anyway), and used his old leveraction without a scope. I realized that you don't really need all the fancy gear to deer hunt. My advice to the hoplophile is to focus on the basics at first, stalking deer, finding were they are, practice shooting, and then if you wanna wear camo boxers and spray doe urine on your boots then.

Another thing, I was talking to my dad about going hunting and told him I was looking for a meat processing place he said, "AAAh we never used one. everyone just cut their own meat up". Duh, Even if you're gonna use a processer I think you should try it yourself the first time. I did some research, sharpened my knives, got some ice chests ready and after field dressing, checking with the checkstation, skinning and quartering, I took a shower went town for lunch and bought some ziplock bags. Came home and spend the afternoon butchering the deer. didn't have to pay anyone and now I know how to do it myself. And I know it was 100% the deer I shot, handled with care, and processed exactly like I wanted.

 

[Jst1mr]

Rolando -

Thanks for the memories...I tagged along with my grandad once or twice way back when I was way too small to deer hunt on my own. He wore the overalls he came out of the barn in, along with the classic old red and black wool coat. He would pick his spot, lean the old Savage against a tree, and start a small fire (loudly breaking up small twigs) to keep warm, and even to warm the sandwich grandma sent along (in waxed paper). Can't remember him ever gettin' skunked....

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Step 1. Take a hunters education/safety course.
Step 2. Meet other like minded individuals (You will find people in your class..network)
Step 3. Find someone who will take you hunting. Learn from this person.
Step 4. Go hunting on your own and enjoy.

I want to add a big "second" to this, esp. the bolded part.

 

[IndianaBoy]

I feel the need to point something out here.....

Regarding your initial post.


I grew up on a farm, and now I work in the agriculture industry. It is an absolute fabrication that livestock animals are being force fed massive quantities of hormones and steroids before they are brought to market.


Hogs are fed ground corn, soybean meal and mineral supplement mixtures.

Cattle are fed a lot of hay, and finished on corn and distillers grain.

Go out to a cattle farm in the country. Talk to the farmer who is standing out by the silo or grain bin. Ask him where he keeps the steroids. He will look at you like you are absolutely crazy.


Myth perpetuated by the media who has to fabricate a story every night at 11.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

Wear hunter orange!

I will wake up at about 2 to 3 hours before sunrise my camp will be just below treeline or as far up the mountain as I can get depending on the snow levels. My camp consists of a wall tent and an outfitter stove.

The temp is usually about -15f to -20f if it is a clear morning and on a snowy morning it will be warmer like in the 20's. After firing up the stove and cooking an all day breakfast I'll either saddle up a horse or depending on the circumstances I'll use a four wheeler to get up to area I want to hunt for the day.

My hunts will consist of climbing to a high vantage point usually a peak or a high ridge line over looking a large chute or some other area that elk like to travel. I'll watch that for the morning movement times. If I happen to see something that I want to go after I'll plan a stalk and try to get a shot.

If I don't have any luck in the morning I'll hike into thick timber and start still hunting for the day. Still does not men standing still it means that I'll get into thick cover and move very slowly until I find sign.I'll start tracking that sign until it gets fresh. After the sign freshens I go back into still hunter stealth mode and work the sign until I get onto elk. Hopefully I'll get a shot. If I do then the work begins with a pack out.

On average I climb several thousand vertical feet a day and cover between 5 and 15 miles on foot

Man, that sounds just awesome!

Remember, wear your hunter orange!

Remember, wear hunter Orange.
Oh, and did I mention to wear hunter orange?

 

[CRAZY-G]

As somebody who's family has owned a slaughterhouse for 38 years I thank all of you that stood up for the cattle producers.

Now to defend the slaughter side of things. With 35 million or so cattle slaughtered every year and PETA can only come up with something every so often it is only very few slaughterhouses that have humane problems and most often one employee. Others pointed out how unhappy animals do not do as well , the same is true at the slaughterhouse, unhappy animals are harder to handle and stress causes meat quality to degrade as does being "brutally slaughtered".

In regards to your questions on how to get started in hunting
Quote:
Step 1. Take a hunters education/safety course.
Step 2. Meet other like minded individuals (You will find people in your class..network)
Step 3. Find someone who will take you hunting. Learn from this person.
Step 4. Go hunting on your own and enjoy.