My Gun Range was Closed, Safety Issue!

[kcofohio]

In the 1st week of July, a bullet from a large caliber rifle left the range and struck a building. Fortunately, nobody was injured. I don't know whether it was carelessness, or recklessness. But the range for pistol and rifle have been closed since, until upgrades can be made.

Here these last couple of summers, our range has had some that abuse the rules. Shooting shotguns into the rubber target backings, that is forbidden. Shooting the target stands. Someone even shot holes in the port-a-john toilet lid.

The trustees had came out with a new rule earlier this year that guest were no longer welcomed. This was to try and curtail the abuses.

Now, along with a baffling system and higher berms, they will be installing a surveillance system. Wish it hadn't came to that, but I understand their position. Maybe it will make all follow the rules.

All the upgrades are being done by volunteers and contributions.

Another larger range nearby, closed earlier this year for upgrades and such. There too, a bullet left the range and struck a building off the property.
I think they had a lawsuit against them.

Big question. Is this a trend that is going on countrywide? Or has it been just in isolated places?

 

[243winxb]

Sorry to say, its all to common. New members should go thru a criminal background check, that they pay for.

 

[WestKentucky]

Rules on a range are there for a reason. Those reasons essentially boil down to safety, and safety boils down even further to skills and knowledge. Rules get you 99% of the way towards the goal of safety when they are followed. 99.9% is still not 100% and although risk is greatly diminished, it is not fully mitigated. Now you throw in design (and design limitations) and that gives you another 90% of that remaining .1%. Even at 99.99% mitigated risk bad things will still happen, and that's why lawyers are eating high on the hog. Policing the rules is a good thing, surveillance systems are a way to point fingers when the fecal matter splashes onto the air circulation device. Cameras are not the answer. Putting a dummy in his place when rules are broken is most of the answer. I would take a RSO or two any day over a camera. But even still, there is a chance something will escape the confines of the range. Where it goes, what it hits, what damage it does is out of control. Ricochet are typically what would go awry, and those usually don't pack much punch when leaving a range at a steep enough angle to jump a berm.

I do believe that the knuckleheads need to be policed and given the boot. I just hate to see this knee-jerk reaction that is sweeping the world to put cameras in everywhere to solve every problem of every kind. Cameras fix nothing, they just tell a story and affix blame.

 

[Hardtarget]

The local club, where I'm a member, had our 50 yd and 100 yd target stands shot down earlier this year. I don't know if it was disgruntled former member( that go booted), or a neighbor that moved in close to a range but doesn't like the noise...or just a stupid, idiotic punk member. Either way, short of a gillie suit and waiting to ambush from the woods...how can you stop it?

To stop stray bullets, tall berms, baffles, better backstops, and real safety mind-set is about all that can be done. If the shooters don't TRY to keep shots in the safe zone, then you must expect trouble.

Mark

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Most gun range at least in CA, are one safety incident away from being closed. There are many near by who can't stand the noise (even if the range was first) and others simply dislike all things related to guns. All of us who shoot have a responsibility to be extra careful and considerate in how and what we do at the range.

 

[SwaneeSR]

kcofohio - sorry to read your OP.

Some of that behavior is way over the line. Shooting up the toilet? If caught, I would expect the punishment should be severe. If a member did that act or guest of a member, than that member should get expelled from the club. No excuse.

I have seen ranges close for upgrades here in MN and Western WI for safety upgrades due to a bullet leaving the range.

The club versus the neighbors is a continual battle. Restricting hours of operation is the most common tactic to make peace with those who built or purchased a home next to the range and discovered that they could hear firearms being discharged. Ridiculous. One of my local ranges had a non-member day with free food and firearms to try for free to reach out to the community. They are also closed on Sunday's for quiet time.

I frequent an unattended public range in WI near my cabin. The volunteers had nice target stands out there last year. This year, not so much. They all got shot up. I do not know if regular wear and tear or if on purpose. My last trip, I put up a new target stand. I make sure I clean everything up and leave the place better than when I arrived. I have noticed some others bring a portable handmade target stands for their own use. I may need to go that route.

Maybe the influx of new shooters we have had in recent years need to mature? Maybe this has always been a problem. I recall seeing shot-up appliances and TV's at the range years ago. Why would you do that and leave the mess?

This is no different than hunters who throw beer cans all over the woods or ATVers who run off the trail and rip up crops in the field. A lack of respect for your sport/activity. Some people are sure to disappoint. I have tried to raise my kids to know better, my parents did that.

Swanee

 

[edmo01]

kcofohio - sorry to read your OP.

Some of that behavior is way over the line. Shooting up the toilet? If caught, I would expect the punishment should be severe. If a member did that act or guest of a member, than that member should get expelled from the club. No excuse.

I have seen ranges close for upgrades here in MN and Western WI for safety upgrades due to a bullet leaving the range.

The club versus the neighbors is a continual battle. Restricting hours of operation is the most common tactic to make peace with those who built or purchased a home next to the range and discovered that they could hear firearms being discharged. Ridiculous. One of my local ranges had a non-member day with free food and firearms to try for free to reach out to the community. They are also closed on Sunday's for quiet time.

I frequent an unattended public range in WI near my cabin. The volunteers had nice target stands out there last year. This year, not so much. They all got shot up. I do not know if regular wear and tear or if on purpose. My last trip, I put up a new target stand. I make sure I clean everything up and leave the place better than when I arrived. I have noticed some others bring a portable handmade target stands for their own use. I may need to go that route.

Maybe the influx of new shooters we have had in recent years need to mature? Maybe this has always been a problem. I recall seeing shot-up appliances and TV's at the range years ago. Why would you do that and leave the mess?

This is no different than hunters who throw beer cans all over the woods or ATVers who run off the trail and rip up crops in the field. A lack of respect for your sport/activity. Some people are sure to disappoint. I have tried to raise my kids to know better, my parents did that.

Swanee

It is the same guy I saw yesterday who threw his fast food drink cup out of his window. It is the hundred drivers who throw lit cigarette butts out their window with me behind them on my motorcycle. Zero fox given...

There are a lot of people who don't care about anyone except themselves. It is their world and we are annoyingly in their way. It seems we've become the "it is all about me" society with little regard for how our actions affect others or the rules of society in general.

Maybe I've become that grumpy old guy who yells at the kids to get off his lawn.

Hope your range recovers soon.

Edmo

 

[jaholder1971]

There's a range in Missouri that lost the use of its 500 yard range and nearly shut down by court injunction over some BPCR shooters letting one of those big heavy lead pills fly over the berm and into an occupied mobile home. The offending shooters, miffed their favorite shooting range was closing, split off from the club and opened their own BPCR range 120 miles away in the middle of nowhere leaving the other club to pay for their transgressions.

Not containing the bullets within your club property should get you your peepee slapped. Not only is it unsafe but there are folks who will lie off their butts to shut a neighboring range down if they think they can sway some sympathetic .gov official.

 

[HoosierQ]

Mine burned down because, apparently, somebody fired a tracer into the rubber matrix backstop material and 10 tons of shredded tires were set on fire by a 5,000 degree magnesium bullet lodged in the pile. What a mess.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Safety wise one range I know of uses those modern gabion (Hesco) that are like wicker baskets that you fill with dirt. The abuses kcofohio mentioned are a combination of negligent and will disregard (shooting up stuff that aren't supposed to be shot up). It sucks to lose a range.

 

[Jim Watson]

Yes, careless, ignorant, and boorish shooters are a great risk to ranges.

Vandals that ruin range equipment are a constant burden, too. They shoot at target stands, shoot pistol gongs with rifles, etc. We came up with bullet holes in the chairs on our range. Heard about the member who said "Anytime I see anything new at the range, I like to see if my .270 will shoot through it. We didn't know who because his bud who related the story would not give up his name. He apparently did not renew at the higher dues made necessary by range relocation, good riddance.


And you have the nasty neighbors, too. Every once in a while you get the story of someone claiming to have bullets hit their house or car. The story would hold up better if they took the projectiles out of the cartridges. Had that happen here at a popular unimproved ravine shooting site.

 

[alsaqr]

Big question. Is this a trend that is going on countrywide?

Yes, it is a national trend.

There are millions of new shooters out there. Many, if not most, have little or no formal training in gun safety. Some shooters are slobs.

 

[tallpaul]

The really sad thing is that an anti or other miscreant can purposefully shoot at buildings and such and try to close a club or even a close by property owner or renter can shoot their own buildings n such to try to gain monetarily from such

 

[kcofohio]

Though my range doesn't have the best of facilities, it has worked out well. 15 mins. from my house. Most of the times, it has only a couple of the lanes being used. Sometimes, nobody is there. Which is probably what contributes to some of the shenanigans.

Our dues aren't high enough for them to have an RSO. It started out back in the '20s as a skeet/trap range with archery range. The skeet/trap shoots are still their core.

Though I don't like the idea of surveilliance, if it makes them mind their manners. So be it. I would really like for the range to be able to stay open.

I have wondered about with all the new shooters. Will this be a wake up call for some about the importance of responsibility. Time will tell, I guess. I agree, we are in a time that many are only about themselves. The golden rule of "Doing unto others as you would have them do unto you" is fading from memories.

Thanks for listen! May more gun owners become High Roaders!

 

[kcofohio]

The really sad thing is that an anti or other miscreant can purposefully shoot at buildings and such and try to close a club or even a close by property owner or renter can shoot their own buildings n such to try to gain monetarily from such

The range that has the lawsuit I mentioned in the OP, is widely thought to be that. Fotunately for them, the NRA is helping them out with a grant. Along with higher berms, they are requiring members to take a safety course before their badge will work.

 

[entropy]

The really sad thing is that an anti or other miscreant can purposefully shoot at buildings and such and try to close a club or even a close by property owner or renter can shoot their own buildings n such to try to gain monetarily from such

That happened to the gun club just south of town. They proved a round purported to have been fired from the range that struck a barn wasn't fired from the range, but they were shut down anyway.

At the club I'm a member of, a guest of a member put a round through the roof over the line; the guest was permanently banned, the member placed on 'double secret probation."

 

[exbrit49]

amen to that

Read the post by kcofohio and, yes we have the same situation, Holes shot through the roof of the target shelter. It's a big structure built around our 30 foot high earthen backstop. No way can you shoot through the roof from the firing lines accidently. Unfortunately there is a small business park less than couple hundred yards away. Its just a matter of time!!!! The shelter support posts shot out by idiots sticking their targets on them, this despite signs prohibiting this. Second time we have had to replace them.
for over 50 years the range was spotless, and safe. Not anymore! Trash everywhere, which the more conscientious members clean up.
Luckily the club officers have advised all members that if they see any safety issues or irresponsible behavior we can politely ask for it to cease, and if that fails, to call the local police. The local LEOs use the range for their periodic qualification and are only too glad to help out.
Hopefully with better education we can prevent some of the safety issues. THere is a consideration on the table to put CCTV on the range, the fear is that some moron would shoot it out!

 

[Sniper66]

We had some vandalism at our entrance gate so installed security cameras. Also upgraded our entrance gate to a sensor-activated gate and built several new berms. Besides obvious safety issues, we want to preserve our range for many years to come. So far, so good. Our biggest threat is from local politicians who try annually to rezone our location so they can tax us out of existence or simply close us down. Most irritating is that we have to dedicate a considerable percentage of our treasury for legal fees to stop them.

 

[azrocks]

I refuse to go to public ranges that aren't well-staffed and well-run. I've never been to a non-supervised range where I wasn't shaking my head from beginning to end, whether in regards to other shooters actions or the disasters they left behind. Hate to say it, but guns really bring out the stupid in people sometimes.

We've got Ben Avery out here, and it's an example of exactly what's right in a range. It's staffed, supervised, & controlled. You're required to watch a safety video before your first visit. 15 minutes of fire then a few minutes to attend to your targets. At the end of each live-fire session range officers verify all weapons unloaded, and for the entirety of the time period between live-fire, shooters are required to not come anywhere near their weapons. These rules are strictly, but courteously, enforced.

I'm not usually one to look for well-supervised environments to play in, but when it comes to gun ranges, there's a reason you don't read about drama at Ben Avery very often. And I like my shooting sessions drama-free.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

A few years ago the Shawnee County law enforcement range had a stray bullet hit a structure down range. They had to shut the range down for a long time.

 

[Crunchy Frog]

My members only club installed cameras last year after numerous instances of people shooting support posts and the like. It is amazing to me that dues paying members would destroy club property.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[desidog]

There too, a bullet left the range and struck a building off the property.
I think they had a lawsuit against them.

Big question. Is this a trend that is going on countrywide? Or has it been just in isolated places?

Blue Trail range in Wallingford CT had a similar issue that closed down their 200 yard range. Seems some distant neighbor found a .50BMG slug on their lawn (that didn't have rifling marks on it, rumor was)...

 

[gspn]

Big question. Is this a trend that is going on countrywide? Or has it been just in isolated places?

My range (big private club) did some modifications a few years ago. I was told the insurance company required higher berm and baffles among other things.

We also have live video surveillance of the more popular firing lines.

Next time you go to a public range look up at the ceiling. Every indoor range I've ever been to has bullet holes in the ceilings and walls. It makes it very easy to tell how many bullets have gone astray. I saw one guy put two holes in the ceiling in a single range session once.

There's lots of reasons bullets go astray, none of them good. Some people don't know the rules, some can follow rules, some don't care about the rules, some can't pay enough attention to know what they're doing...you could make a long list of reasons.

I feel a little better at the private range...but I'm not under any illusions that it's safe by any means. I've seen plenty of safety violations there as well...and I've not seen any baffles that are free of bullet holes. :banghead:

 

[dwjwin50]

Odd, but where I live one can go the a range or into the hills. The ranges charge and the rifle range is so heavily baffled that a shooter only has a few inches up and down to shoot from the bench. There are informal "shooting ranges" in the hills where you can shoot anyway you like but it gets very crowded on the weekends.

 

[cologuy]

Looking at this thread, it looks like a nationwide trend. Locally, we have an older, indoor range that's been really well maintained over the years. The last 7-8 years, there has been an increase in problems relating to non-authorized ammo, shooting at target return mechanisms (you've got to really be trying, so we know it's not an accident), stealing brass that we use to support our junior shooting organization, etc. It's to the point where members have an electronic badge to unlock the door, there are cameras everywhere except the bathrooms, and new members have to attend a mandatory safety class before they get their badges. An intrusive pain? Yes, but it's really turned things around, and fortunately the place is popular enough that it hasn't hurt membership levels. I see a lot of ranges going to this model in the future if they really want to stay open, which will really hurt the low-cost operations. Sad but true, a lot of people just really don't care about their ranges unless you force them to take some responsibility (meaning dollars) for them.