Nearly shot my wife!

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I don't understand why people post stuff like this... It can potentially come back to haunt you and you just get flamed for it...
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Well, I have gotten several good suggestions for avoiding this situation in the future. Some of which I will gladly accept, and some of which I will not because they don't fit my philosophy, but for all of which I am happy to have.

As to haunting me, I would hope that this is a situation that could not be brought back to bite me in the rear, but who knows? Anything is possible. Life is not without risks. Besides, if you are ever in a situation where you do something that is contrary to what you read on a board like this you could be bitten because you should have known better. Just lurking doesn't really protect you.
 
In FoF training at the National Tactical Invitational, highly trained participants trying to clear a building by themselves almost always lose. That should tell us something!
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Curious: Just how representative of "average homewoner investigates bump-in-the-night, only to discover bad guy," are the FoF training sessions?

How do the outcomes of those FoF scenrios change, if any, when the "homeowner" is at least moderately trained, and the bump-in-the-night is a representative sample of your average night burglar, or burglars?
 
danprkr

Having heard others speak of the same, and having heard them relate results identical to your own, I imagine that it is the rarer thing for one spouse to remain in place while the other acts, as it seems perhaps rarer still for some to believe there may be actual danger. Happy that all turned out well.
 
I have no idea what he was trying to say. If he were to die at the hands of outlaws, would he not be a victim? How about being confined to a wheel chair, or otherwise permanently impaired, physically or mentally or both?
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To put it succinctly would you rather die on your feet or your knees? It's really all about the difference in those 2 mindsets. Of course some will say you're safer on your knees, but safety in this world is an illusion as far as I can tell. So you decide how you want to live and go from there.
 
Maybe it's not the OUTLAWS we need to worry about, but more the INLAWS!:eek:

On the serious side:
I agree, I'm glad all is safe. You can always learn, I just learned from reading your story!
Thanks!
 
I have no idea what he was trying to say. If he were to die at the hands of outlaws, would he not be a victim?
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What Lance is getting at is simple. Look at this 7-11 robbery video. The perp is pointing the gun, demands money, then cigarettes, muzzle on the clerks.

At any moment, for any reason, on nothing more than a whim, he might just pull the trigger. The victims don't know. Their lives belong to the thug and whether they survive the encounter or not is purely a matter of how he feels at the moment.

Lance is saying that he'd rather die than have to endure that level of victimization. In a similar way, I own firearms and a range of other weapons because I want the freedom to be able to go investigate odd noises on my property without having to call the cops every time I hear a bump in the night. I don't care if it's not recommended - there's no way I'm going to be so terrorized that I can't go check out something that needs checking out.

It would take a very clear threat before I'm dialing 911. Might be my generation or how I was raised, but if a man can't walk his own home and his own property then he doesn't really own it. In the case described in this thread, I probably wouldn't even grab a gun first off. Some noise in the garage? I'll go take a look. Could be a raccoon, or something fell off a shelf.

My suggestion for the OP is that if he did go armed to check out a noise and found it to be, as in this situation, some pipes that fell down, then he should call out to the wife "It's OK" as soon as the matter is under control. This was too close of a call.
 
+1. Great post, shockwave...

But I'm always armed, funny noises or not, and my wife would know better than to do what the OP's did.

Les
 
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Sounds like she has more to fear from you than the bad guys LOL. I am far more concerned with a CCW guy all jacked up than the bad guys. you do have to have control when you have a gun and being paranoid will not help. Thanks for sharing with us! We ALL can learn from this one as i hope you have.
 
You need to take a step too...toward not moving your finger toward that trigger until you have identified your target. I see a very distinct lack of you taking any responsibility for this incident, instead talking about getting your wife to learn a lesson. You both are to blame, and both of you have mistakes to correct.
 
Maybe the right plan doesn't involve clearing the house or at least not clearing the house solo? House clearing is best left to teams of trained competent folks.
 
You need to take a step too...toward not moving your finger toward that trigger until you have identified your target. I see a very distinct lack of you taking any responsibility for this incident, instead talking about getting your wife to learn a lesson. You both are to blame, and both of you have mistakes to correct.
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Sorry, I disagree. I am speaking legally, not necessarily practically...
That said, if you two have a plan, and she willfully fails to execute that plan, she is the problem.

Easy for me to say...I have four dogs to serve as an alarm system--you apparently do not. :)
 
What Lance is getting at is simple. Look at this 7-11 robbery video. The perp is pointing the gun, demands money, then cigarettes, muzzle on the clerks.

At any moment, for any reason, on nothing more than a whim, he might just pull the trigger. The victims don't know. Their lives belong to the thug and whether they survive the encounter or not is purely a matter of how he feels at the moment.

Lance is saying that he'd rather die than have to endure that level of victimization.
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That would seem to have little or nothing to do with the case at hand. Lance had the choice of dieing on his feet or on his knees. The OP had the choice of staying in a defensible position and defending himself and his family from there or putting himself and others at risk by going out looking for trouble.

In a similar way, I own firearms and a range of other weapons because I want the freedom to be able to go investigate odd noises on my property without having to call the cops every time I hear a bump in the night. I don't care if it's not recommended - there's no way I'm going to be so terrorized that I can't go check out something that needs checking out.
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I own firearms for several reasons, one of which is self protection. I do not see how that gives me the "freedom" to do anything unwise or overly risky. Terrorized? How about "wise"? One can go check out something that needs checking out, but if it should appear that that something may constitute a clear and present danger, it would not be the smartest thing to do, because you would be at an obvious disadvantage.

It would take a very clear threat before I'm dialing 911.
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The actions of the driver of the pickup truck that I discussed above certainly did not indicate a very clear threat to me, but I was roundly criticized by law enforcement officials for not having called 911. That was a real eye opener to me.

In the case described in this thread, I probably wouldn't even grab a gun first off. Some noise in the garage? I'll go take a look. Could be a raccoon, or something fell off a shelf.
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Makes sense, but I would likely stay put until I was reasonably confident that no threat existed. I should be able to tell that by listening.
 
This is a real 'face the facts thread' and definitely has motivated me to devise a couple plans. This thread also makes me want to give my wife a big sloppy kiss as she would do exactly what she was told in a tense situation and has proved it before. OP, it sounds like your wife needs a reality check, that kind of ignorance is unacceptable and potentially lethal, No disrespect. If she has no 'tactical awareness', that adds a whole new element of difficulty to you being able to keep you and your wife safe. Best of luck
 
I see too many ways to have done this to complain about the OP's case. The fact that he did not shoot makes the case that he did ID his wife in time. Good for that. My wife would have listened (our plan is for her to be in a hallway behind which are the doors to two of our kids' rooms with a 20ga). She leaves home defense to me as I have some training. The OP's would be well advised to keep with the plan.
We all know that when friendlies are in the area we must exercise extra caution and expect changes and surprises. It comes with the territory. I am glad it turned out well and bet both learned something they can retain. That is the most important thing.
 
it sounds like your wife needs a reality check, that kind of ignorance is unacceptable and potentially lethal, No disrespect. If she has no 'tactical awareness', that adds a whole new element of difficulty to you being able to keep you and your wife safe. Best of luck
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Can a statement of fact be disrespectful? Sadly your statement is a VERY accurate statement of the situation. Fortunately, between showing her some of the articles, and videos posted on this thread, and her discovering the show "I Survived" this evening (completely coincidental - when I recommended it she wasn't interested, but having discovered it on her own it's the best show on TV now. :what: ) she and I have had several very good conversations on this, and she is at least aware that there are plans we need to make. We've even begun discussing them.

This incident, and this thread have helped. For all of the evidence you other posters have made me aware of I thank you heartily.

Most importantly she has stated that she will not be raped or killed without a fight, and that she needs to know how to defend herself. Which is a huge admission from her. Not that I think she'd have gone down without a fight before, but at least now she is aware of her ignorance in the self defense arena. More importantly she is now willing to rectify said ignorance.

For now the plan is for her to go in a closet with her gun, and the phone. While I do what the scenario calls for. If it's a known intrusion I station myself in the bedroom door which no one can approach without being seen while she calls 911. If it's merely suspected like this incident, I do what I judge appropriate for the situation, and inform her when it's all clear or if the cops need to be called.

Our home range has a woman's firearms class coming up, and she's even agreed to take it. Who knows where it'll go from there. If I'm lucky she'll be wanting a CHL by the end of the year. Which is about a year earlier than I'd thought she'd get to that point.
 
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I do not see how that gives me the "freedom" to do anything unwise or overly risky.
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You have the freedom to do things unwise and risky...the firearm just makes it less so.

And Dan has not told you not to lock yourself in the bedroom and dial 911. He just said that it is not his choice.

Because some people do not share his view does not make it less worthy.

I think that generally speaking, doing something is better than not doing something ESPECIALLY when it is standing up to evil.

I have a three stage plan for my house. One is if there MIGHT be a threat inside the house. Another if the threat IS inside the house. A third if the threat is outside.

And yes, that includes the car alarm.

Just like I am not going to lock myself into the bedroom and wait for the police, I am not going to take digital pictures of someone stealing my car stereo.

So it you want to make fun of Dan for clearing his own house, you need to go medieval on me for being willing to leave a safe house to go face a threat over a 300 dollar stereo.

(slipping on my asbestos underwear)

Flame on!
 
You need to take a step too...toward not moving your finger toward that trigger until you have identified your target. I see a very distinct lack of you taking any responsibility for this incident
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You have a small point, but it's a very small point. As someone else pointed out, no one got shot. If you reread my original post you will note that I didn't have a finger on the trigger, nor did I have the safety off. Just that I was headed that way. The reality is that it wasn't my first rodeo, and my previous rides have made me MORE cautious not less. I have analyzed my actions as dispassionately as I am able. I do feel that I did nothing wrong. Especially in light of my past shoot/no shoot experiences. If there were video or a neutral observer then I might be convinced otherwise, but as it is I'm comfortable with my handling of the situation. This self introspection is why I waited nearly a week to post this. So that I could post it as accurately as possible, and have analyzed it as well as I could.

I have four dogs to serve as an alarm system--you apparently do not.
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Actually I have 2 dogs. Just worthless. Unless the BG happens to step on them while coming in through the back yard, or smells like milk bones. :p

And Dan has not told you not to lock yourself in the bedroom and dial 911. He just said that it is not his choice.
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Actually I've even mentioned that in other life circumstance that might be my choice, and that I don't blame others for making it.

I think that generally speaking, doing something is better than not doing something ESPECIALLY when it is standing up to evil.
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Damned if you do, and damned if you don't. That seems to be life in the big city. Well given the choice I'd rather be damned for something I did than something I didn't do.
 
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I in no way mean to critisize or judge the poster here - I think we can all learn by considering this situation and putting ourselves in his place. Lets take it a step further...I think one needs to take into consideration tactics on how to calm oneself down to the point of being able to keep a clear head and make that positive target ID before the trigger is pulled. How many gun owners have actually been in a situation where they have pulled a gun on someone (loved one or BG)?? Not many. Its really hard to describe the feeling when you hold someones life in your hands. The adrenaline rush...the tunnel vision...the feeling of sheer and utter terror...and the fear...There are no ways to get around the emotions a person feels, especially if its the first time. I personally make it a practice to use combat breathing(also known as square breathing) any time i am put in a situation where I may or may not need to use a weapon. I use it for alot of other stressful situation. Heck...it even works when your fighting with your lovely bride over the color of paint to use on the kitchen wall. Anyway- thats one way I like to keep a clear head... I'd like to hear from other posters who have had some experience or training in this type of situation. How did you keep a level head??

On a side note...I read this article with some interest...Due to circumstances beyond my control I ended up in shoot/dont shoot situation earlier today(due to my chosen profession of course...yes... i know..what was i thinking) I am very lucky that I was not forced to use the shoot option...but it was close...and like always the combat breathing helped out...but thats a story for another post
 
I'd rather be damned for something I did than something I didn't do.
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Most people don't have the patience to actively wait and listen and observe any more than some BG does. For less money than you might spend on a weekend out, a simple interior security system with cameras could be installed that would allow you to avoid having to check out the house on foot. On one level it's not as satisfying as going and looking around the house with gun in hand, but it's certainly safer and in many ways surer.
 
Wow. First time I've been able to actually smell testosterone over the net. :rolleyes:
Clearing a house on your own is foolish. That's not my opinion. That's a stone cold fact known by almost everyone (I'd say everyone, but exceptions prove the rule) who's been trained to do clearings - on a team - for a paycheck.

BG could have been anywhere in your garage. Behind a car, crouched in the corner, by the workbench, under the car, in the car, 10 feet to the right of his buddy, over by the ladder, etc. He has to do one thing - shoot you. You have to do the following: 1) locate source, 2) determine threat level (is it a neighbor borrowing a saw?), 3) aim, 4) shoot, 5) scan for another (are home invasions EVER a one-man deal?). You have an OODA loop, he has a job - shoot anybody who comes through THAT ONE DOOR!

If I hear a noise that's suspicious enough to send the wife and kids to the upstairs master bedroom, then it's suspicious enough for 5-0.

Here's my two choices: 1) huddle-up behind the bed with my family and wait for a BG to come through THAT ONE DOOR, or 2) enter the garage with weapon at low ready, get shot in the guts, blow my shot cuz the shock took me off my game, get disarmed, listen to two BG's party with my wife for the next hour while I bleed out, then explain things to St. Peter. I'll take door #1 thanks.
 
Well done, Dan. A man should protect his family and home. I will do the same as you, time and again.

Next time just issue her with a cow bell instead of a firemarm, just in case. ;-) Or cuff her to the bed... On a more serious note, you could always lock her in the bedroom. (pretend I did not say that, some will just over react to the suggestion)

I'm lucky enough to have a staffy that helps really well with house-clearing. She seems to sense when I go into defensive/aggresive mode and becomes as alert as I am and lead into any room I direct her.

I believe that if you practice this type of house-clearing you can prevail over intruders. You know the angles, hiding places and effective cover areas in your house much better than they do.

If you want to take it one step further, rig the lighting in your house so you can control most lights individually from more than one switch/ area in your house. But that borders on paranioa again. ;-)

Anyway, may none of you ever have to put your emergency plans into actions for real...
 
In FoF training at the National Tactical Invitational, highly trained participants trying to clear a building by themselves almost always lose. That should tell us something!
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Clearing rooms solo is a crap shoot at best. One man can't clear opposing corners in a center fed room at the same time. Even if you pie off most of a center fed room, you will still have 2 blind corners to clear, which gives you a 50/50 chance of picking the one with a potential threat, and a 50/50 chance of being wrong and exposed to a free shot from a threat. Even if you are correct, you could be outnumbered...which sucks. Most of us don't have high speed tools like cameras / mirrors / night vision / high explosives to use either.

The preferred technique to clear a room is with blast over pressure from a high explosive charge. :)

On the other hand...

Homeowners DO have a possible advantage in that they are familiar with the lay out of their home, and that, combined with surprise and aggressiveness, could be enough in and of itself, and if not, than to at least lay a good ambush.

Do what you think is best.
 
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