Neck turning

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Captain*kirk

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Watched a very interesting video on neck turning last night. Enough to warrant giving it a try.
However, the lion's share of my 7mm mag cases are nickel plated...I can see that ending badly. So if I did it I'd have to start off with new unplated brass. Anyone familiar with neck turning on standard brass, and opinions? (Worth it/not worth it)
 
If it's a standard chamber, I wouldn't waste the time involved to do it.

If I had a rifle with a match or tight chamber, or if I shot matches, yes.

With a tight chamber, you'll probably have no choice and have to. Keeping your brass consistent for match shooting, is part of the overall game.
 
I have a couple of rifles with custom tight neck chambers that I have to neck turn for. There are a couple of good articles on the Accurateshooter site and also on a site called Varmintals discuss neck turning that are worth searching for.

As far as tools go, I have the little Forster tool that does a good job but its tricky to adjust. I also have tools from Sinclair/Brownells and PMA. 21 Century, K&M, Hart also make good tools. I like these semi-custom tools better than the Hornady, RCBS, ect tools.

I agree with Mk-211, I wouldn't bother with neck turning with a factory chamber. Some shooters make a very lite cut just to clean it up but if you remove very much material you will overwork the brass when resizing and shooting it.
 
When I first started reloading, I turned the necks. I couldn't have told you why back then. It just seemed another step in the right direction to accurate consistent ammo. Now, if I care, I'll just clean it up. I read somewhere that case necks of consistent thickness will have consistent neck tension and concentricity. That may or may not be complete nonsense. I do not participate in precision shooting, so I usually don't bother as it makes little or no difference. I do have a 7mm Rem Mag where neck tension made a difference. But that may just be a function of having chosen the right die bushing. Out of frustration (because I tried everything else I could think of), I cleaned up the necks and played with the sizing bushings. I finally got that rifle to shoot something well. YMMV
 
I used a Sinclair tool, way back in the day. It's not foolproof, but not rocket surgery either. In my benchrest rifle, it made a plain difference in accuracy. I tried it in a few of my hunting rifles and found that it either made no difference, or else the improvement was so slight as to be almost imaginary and completely irrelevant.

I never tried it on nickeled cases. I wouldn't be surprised if it worked - but I also wouldn't be surprised if it ruined cases and dulled the blade.
 
Let me start by saying I haven't shot any neck-turned brass yet. When I built my 7mm PRC, there was no brass to be had, so I bought a couple hundred rounds of Hornady ammo. After firing and cleaning the first 40 rounds, I checked the necks for concentricity. I'd have to check my notes to give you accurate measurements, but there was measurable difference in neck thickness around the circumference. So I turned them with a Sinclair tool to get them concentric. Will it make a significant difference in the accuracy of my hand loads? I don't know yet. But it seemed like a good thing to try.
 
.38 Special said:
I used a Sinclair tool, way back in the day. It's not foolproof, but not rocket surgery either. In my benchrest rifle, it made a plain difference in accuracy. I tried it in a few of my hunting rifles and found that it either made no difference, or else the improvement was so slight as to be almost imaginary and completely irrelevant.

I never tried it on nickeled cases. I wouldn't be surprised if it worked - but I also wouldn't be surprised if it ruined cases and dulled the blade.
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This was my experience as well. I shot a 6ppc LV back in the early 90s and then a 22ppc. At that level we were already using top tiered components like lapua brass and custom bullets, so the idea was to eliminate all the variables possible. I saw enough to convince me that there is a place for neck turning in that particular application. Hunting rifles? Not so much, really.

Today I prefer no turn cut chambers.
 
I turned necks once using the Sinclair tool thinking that it was in the right direction. I never compared unturned necks to the turned necks so I cannot say if it makes a difference. I also think neck turning has to do with neck tension. With your 7RM Nickel cases, I would suggest de-capping your cases without using the expander ball. The expander ball is claimed to resize the neck off center. To expand our case neck concentric from the inside, use a mandrel. From there you can turn your neck or not. I'm still testing this variable.
 
BJung said:
I turned necks once using the Sinclair tool thinking that it was in the right direction. I never compared unturned necks to the turned necks so I cannot say if it makes a difference. I also think neck turning has to do with neck tension. With your 7RM Nickel cases, I would suggest de-capping your cases without using the expander ball. The expander ball is claimed to resize the neck off center. To expand our case neck concentric from the inside, use a mandrel. From there you can turn your neck or not. I'm still testing this variable.
Click to expand...
Neck turning certainly does improve neck uniformity in the brass which translates into more consistent and uniform tension on the bullet. When I was shooting benchrest we had really good flat based bullets with pressure rings that made like a “snap” feeling when hand seated - something I don’t believe you could achieve without turning. Plus our chambers were tight, as that was the prevailing wisdom at the time. But we also weight sorted our brass and the quality at the time could be all over the place. And there was the dreaded neck donut …… there were theories on how to deal with that issue.

Today we have - IMO - much better quality (read:uniform) brass and probably better barrels, so the need to turn necks is not as serious as it once was.
I’ve shot both turn and no turn chambers in the same cartridge and not really been able to discern a difference - of course a lot of that may just be the Indian and not the arrow. I’m also not competitive anymore in benchrest so I’m not as up on the current trends (fads?). Most of the guys I shot with are long since retired from the obsession.
 
Captain*kirk said:
Anyone familiar with neck turning on standard brass, and opinions?
Click to expand...
yes, i neck turn for some standard chambers.

Lets start here first-

Check current fl die for over working the necks. Measure OD of loaded rounds. Remove expander, size 3 brass. More then .004" smaller or more? Buy a fl bushing die like Redding type S.

Dont want to buy another die? Neck turn and use standard fl die.

Benchrest prep of 100 brass- uniform flash hole, turn brass, trim all to same length. Sort by weight in to groups of 3/10 grs. This will reduce fliers that kill good groups.

Will all this improve accuracy? Testing is the only way to know.

Using a bushing to size brass necks has increased brass life for me. 223,243, 6.5CM
 
Captain*kirk said:
Anyone familiar with neck turning on standard brass, and opinions? (Worth it/not worth it)
Click to expand...

I used to neck turn, won’t any more for anything I shoot, and would only do so again if I were shooting tight neck spec’d chamber and custom dies which precluded brass movement during firing and minimal movement during sizing.

Not a chance in hell I would waste time turning 7RM brass for anything I could be doing with my 7RM’s, especially not in a factory chamber and especially not with nickel plated brass.
 
I'm also in the no neck turning except for tight necked chambers crowd. I tried it many years ago in my first adventure into
fine accuracy with a heavy barreled Sako in .222 Mag (Yep, been a while). Yep, tried neck sizing, neck turning, burned up 1K
primers and barrel life playing with things. What came out of that for me was no more neck sizing, no neck turning. Of course
when I got into Benchrest and tight necked chambers, I neck turned using a K&M tool.
 

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I’m also a member of the no neck turn gang.

Sometimes we think doing something reduces variation when in fact it’s actually creating more. I think neck turning has the potential to do this.
 
I think neck turning will help if you shoot at longer distance.

I developed a load for a stock Savage varmint chambered in 223 with FC brass that is capable of sub MOA. Often time sub 1/2 MOA. Chrono results typically have an extreme spread of around 45fps, with SD at about 18fps (10 shots).

After neck turning the same FC brass, same load chrono results indicate an improvement in velocity consistency. ES dropped to about 18fps, and SD dropped to 8fps (10 shots).

I will say that I didn't notice a drastic change in group size at 100 yards.

Edit to add: Lesson here is to use better premium brass and skip the neck turning ;)
 
Last edited:
peels said:
I think neck turning will help if you shoot at longer distance.
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I took a class last weekend which had 2 of the 4 instructors, plus two other personal friends, all 4 of which I've known for years, and all 4 of which have held records for Longest Shot in Competition and Longest Cold Bore (+2) Shot in Competition, folks shooting regularly over 4,000 yards.... ALL of them confirm, do NOT neck turn brass for Extreme Long Range shooting. I'm not neck turning my brass, and I connected twice out of seven shots on the clock at 2913yrds.

I shoot out past 1,000 regularly with much smaller cartridges, and don't neck turn any of it. @Walkalong and @Nature Boy have commented here that they're not neck turning and they're regularly shooting long range also. No speculation for these folks.
 
I'm about to embark on my first neck turning experience. I've neck reamed before and had moderate results, but as a retired machinist/machine shop supervisor, know that a dealer follows the existing hole and doesn't "true" the neck to the bore.
My project is cast bullets from a pristine 788 Remington 30-30. Thin necks to begin with so I'm aiming for minimal or partial cleanup.
I've done two such projects years ago, A M70 30-06 and a 788 308 and had great success with both (MOA at 100).
My 311291 mould casts round, dropping at .310-311 with wheel weights or linotype. I have 308, 309, 310 and 311 sizing dies.
Forster neck turner.
Plan, with new Hornaday and Star line brass: full length size, trim to length, neck turn, neck size, load fire form, neck size and load for test.
 
@PapaG - annealing and sizing again after turning tends to pay back in spades. You introduce a lot of work hardening when turning, and we really should be sizing the brass prior to turning to mate with the turning mandrel, so we benefit to stress relieve and resize.

I’d be hard pressed to believe that neck turning truly contributed to simply achieving MOA with those other rifles, but I can concede that there really isn’t much good brass floating around for 30-30. You mentioned your bullet diameters, what is your chamber neck dia for this rifle? How does the bore slug come out?
 
Varminterror said:
@PapaG - annealing and sizing again after turning tends to pay back in spades. You introduce a lot of work hardening when turning, and we really should be sizing the brass prior to turning to mate with the turning mandrel, so we benefit to stress relieve and resize.

I’d be hard pressed to believe that neck turning truly contributed to simply achieving MOA with those other rifles, but I can concede that there really isn’t much good brass floating around for 30-30. You mentioned your bullet diameters, what is your chamber neck dia for this rifle? How does the bore slug come out?
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The 30-06 and 308s were loaded with match brass, sorted by weight, trimmed, neck reamed and loaded v with heat treated, bore sized matched weight bullets, weighed powder charges and weighed Japan fillers.
All weights to .1 grain. Seated to touch lands. Lengthy process but fun for a third shift foreman with the range on the way home from work.
I still have a box or two of the '06s. And the 1953 M70.
 
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