New member, new handgun

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Hi, I'm new here. Thanks to Tallpine for referring me to this site.;)

Yesterday I just purchased a new Smith & Wesson .38 special +P for CCW and a box of Winchester centerfire hollow point ammo. It is my very first gun.:)

It is an alloy frame and rubber grips. Can I clean it with any gun oil? Or should I use something special/different?

I haven't shot it yet, so I need to know if I should expect alot of recoil.

Looking forward to meeting more members here.

Thanks,
Annie
 
Welcome aboard! Nice to have you among us.

If you use the "Search" function with keyword "cleaning", there will be a number of past threads on this subject that you can read. You can also search for product-specific terms such as "lube" or "lubricant", "oil", "Hoppe", etc.
 
Welcome fellow Buckeye. You did real well on your first handgun purchase. For a revolver, S&W is a wise choose. Get yourself a nice 12 or 20 guage shotgun and hunt some whitetails. As you know, Ohio has got too many roaming around.
 
Use hoppes number 9 solvent for the inside of the barrel and anyplace powder residue builds up.

Use any decent quality gun oil after using the hoppes. Hoppes also has a decent quality gun oil as well.

MAKE SURE TO RUN DRY PATCHES DOWN YOUR BARREL....after using solvent and oil. You want to make sure the barrel is dry. There will be oil that soaks into the pores of the metal so don't worry about it rusting. The reason to never have liquid in a barrel is it can cause pressures to rise beyond those that the gun was designed for. Make sure to always run a dry patch or two down your barrel when finished cleaning.

As for recoil. With +P ammo the recoil will be rather stout. Lean into the gun and try to absorb the recoil through your shoulders. Get professional training. Now don't be afraid that the gun is going to jump out of your hands and fly back several hundred feet or anything like that. Just be prepared for a bit of a snap and lots of noise and flash.

You picked a great great firearm now it will require lots of playtime (read practice). :D
 
Welcome, and congrats on the fine choice of pistol. Great choice, and don't worry about the recoil, you have nothing to worry about,it'll be so much fun that you won't probally feel a thing! Again welcome and good shooting!
 
OH25shooter said:
Get yourself a nice 12 or 20 guage shotgun and hunt some whitetails. As you know, Ohio has got too many roaming around.

Thanks, OH25. But this year we never even SAW any deer in our corner of the state. Though I did almost hit one the other day with my Escort, a month after gun season.:p

I'd have to go to the suburbs, where the people feeding corn chips to the deer keeps them there instead of the rural areas. But then, I'd have to register as a sharp-shooter.:(

I have short, stubby hands and fingers, which played a part in my decision. The automatics have grips that are unwieldy for me, even with two hands.

I do plan to get some training, along with "plinking" in the backyard.

Thanks!
 
Hallo, Annaidh na Coille :)
Fàilte gu An Rathad Ard


Hello, Annie! Welcome to The High Road.

(You all be nice to Annie, now - ya hear ;) )


Sounds like you already have gotten some good cleaning advice. Me, I just use Breakfree CLP for cleaning/oiling.

You don't need to fear recoil as long as you have a firm grip on your gun, and aren't holding it right it front of your nose.

One thing that you do have to be careful about revolvers is to keep your hands and fingers behind and below the cylinder. There is a small gap between the cylinder and the barrel (so that the cylinder can rotate) and some hot gases normally escape from that gap.
 
Woodland_Annie said:
Hi, I'm new here. Thanks to Tallpine for referring me to this site.;)

Yesterday I just purchased a new Smith & Wesson .38 special +P for CCW and a box of Winchester centerfire hollow point ammo. It is my very first gun.:)

It is an alloy frame and rubber grips. Can I clean it with any gun oil? Or should I use something special/different?

I haven't shot it yet, so I need to know if I should expect alot of recoil.

Looking forward to meeting more members here.

Thanks,
Annie
Welcome to "our" world Annie! First and foremost, if you've never shot pistols, get training!!! As Tallpine indicated, you do get flash between the cylinder and barrel, so there is nothing wrong with the pistol. For stance, imagine how you bend to pick up a baby, slightly bent forward, feet square and comfortably apart, then use both arms fully extended (called Isosceles traingle), wrists stiff and absorb the recoil with your shoulders and upper body. Also, get someone to determine which eye is dominant if you are not shooting with both eyes open.
 
Welcome, Annie! You've come to the right place - there are LOTS of knowledgeable folks here who'll be happy to answer any questions you might have.

You're a step or two ahead of me. I'm looking for a "no-lock" S&W 642 at the moment, but haven't found one that meets my skinflint price requirements yet. :rolleyes:

Glad to have you with us!
 
R-Tex12, I saw all the 6XX Smithies in the $350 range including the 642 new, though I don't know if it's "no lock." PM me if you want the names of two dealers.

I've shot revolvers before, but am more comfortable with rifles and shotguns. I would have a hard time fitting one of those into my pocket or purse, I reckon.:) And I'm left-handed and right-eyed, what a combo!

I went plinking in the backyard this afternoon. Only shot off 30 rounds. It was sunny but temps were in the mid-30's, so my hands were red from the cold air. I emptied my cylinder and put the gun into my jacket pocket to warm my shooting hand for a few minutes before reloading and firing.:D

It beat up the webbing between my thumb and forefinger, though, and the muscles in that hand still hurt. Definitely a gripping problem (no pun intended). The recoil on the 9 mm FN I used to range-qualify for CCW was more severe than this. I hardly noticed it today except for the webbing.

Thanks, everyone for the welcomes and comments. Thanks again, Tallpine, for sending me here and for your welcome to Annie of the Woods.
 
If the alloy is aluminum, you might want to avoid Hoppe's No. 9 for cleaning: ammonia and aluminum don't play well together. Break Free should do a good job of cleaning and lubricating your gun.

Welcome, eh?
 
Hoppes sometimes does not agree with the alloy frame... what model did you end up buying? If you're shooting a J or K frame S&W, it's often worthwile to consider a .22 of the same frame size for your second handgun purchase, just because it's so much cheaper to practice with. Barrel length, frame size, grips, and overall weight have a direct relationship to that beating on the web of your shooting hand.
 
Hi Annie!

As others have noted, steel frame versus alloy will make a big difference. If this is the "superlight" critter in the 10.5 ounce range (fairly pricey!) the recoil may be pretty nasty. That seems unlikely as it's your first gun and they're a bit hard to find.

If steel, even if it's a 5-shot it'll be pretty easy to control.

Another factor is the grips. Wood or other firm grip will be the worst, although not bad in a steel gun. Rubber that still leaves a strip of metal up the back will be better, while rubber that covers the rear of the grip frame will be the least harsh - but might lead to a grip size bigger than you're comfortable with due to trigger reach and easy concealment.

Finally, my opinion is that your initial learning with the gun should be with the mildest ammo you can get. That will be any of the 148grain "target wadcutter" loads. They're easy to spot as the nose is very flat with no "rise" up out of the shell. Shoot at least 100 rounds of these first, 200 would be better, they'll let you get used to the gun with no fear whatsoever.

Remember that if you're doing things right, each stroke of the trigger should lead to a bang that is unexpected, so it's critical you don't flinch in anticipation of the shot. Worst case, if the gun is light for the loads, there will be a bit of pain on each shot. You have to get to a point where you know it's coming but you competely "don't care" about what's coming. You only care about sight alignment and a smooth trigger stroke. That degree of self control is what makes the experience of target shooting a "Zen-like experience".

For defensive carry, I'd consider one of these four loads:

* 158grain plain un-jacketed lead hollowpoint +P by Winchester or Remington, with a slight preference for Remington but they're hard to find.

* Winchester's 130grain +P jacketed hollowpoint. Nice BIG hollowpoint, expands well out of 2" barrels.

(You probably have one of these above...if not you've got "Silvertips" which are really aluminum jacketed. Not optimal but will do more harm than harsh words :D.)

* The "Gold Dot" 125grain +P as loaded by Speer (easiest to find), Black Hills, Georgia Arms or any number of others. The projectile is made by Speer and sold to smaller ammo houses.

* The Gold Dot 135grain +P, which is thus far a "Speer only" item and very, very hard to find. It may be the very best snubbie 38Spl+P load ever developed.

There's a fifth and sixth but they're real rockets and only for experienced shooters in steel guns: the Buffalo Bore 158grain lead hollowpoint and Gold Dot 125grain loaded hotter than any others. Available mailorder only, 'cept for a few large gun shops stocking it. See also their website at:

http://buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#38spl

This stuff is "king of the hill" in terms of 38+P...only by using recently developed gunpowders have they been able to hit these performance levels.

Not for beginners. Not for aluminum alloy guns. I have a really nice specimen of Charter Arms from the late '70s, mixed steel and aluminum construction, I won't run those BufBores.
 
Thanks for the heads-up about aluminum and ammonia. Sometimes I forget about things like that.

The revolver is a J-frame, aluminum alloy, with rubber grips and weighs 15 oz. It has the space for the metal up the back but any more rubber would result in less-than-secure grip in short stubby hands.:)

The ammo we thought we purchased was Winchester 147 grain, J hollow point, .38 caliber. It turned out to be .38 +P when we opened the case. What was a good bargain, pricewise, became a great bargain.

I felt it in the webbing more because I think I was gripping it wrong. That metal strip was against the base of my thumb, rather than the meaty part of my hand.

Don't anticipate the recoil. It's sort of like saying, "Ignore the elephant in front of you.":D I know it takes time and lots of practice. Actually practicing is something I look forward to.
 
Annie, three things: I know it seems like an elephant now, but you CAN get past that and you'll do so better if you start out with "wimp stuff" :).

Others have advised you to start with 22LR in another similar gun. This is good advice, but the target wadcutter loads will be much milder than the 147s you've got.

Two, a 15oz gun will be a handful but not TOO bad. It's the 10.5 that's a real killer :).

Three, those 147s are not a great choice for snubbies as defensive fodder. They need more barrel length (which adds velocity) to expand properly yet the recoil will be stout. I hope you didn't buy like a whole case (1,000rds) or something :).

Oh, and I would agree you've probably got the right grips. My gun weighs just under 18oz so I know pretty much what you're dealing with.
 
Thanks Jim. But doesn't the +P allow the gun to hold higher velocity ammo than it otherwise would? BTW we have 500 rds of the 147. I don't know if that's good or bad.

I was so impressed with the dealer that I will go back to her shop for accessories and other gun purchases whenever possible. She was friendly, and informative. I'll see what kind of ammo she has. At least until I become more comfortable with the gun's operation.
 
Woodland_Annie said:
R-Tex12, I saw all the 6XX Smithies in the $350 range including the 642 new, though I don't know if it's "no lock." PM me if you want the names of two dealers. ...

Many thanks, Annie. Actually, I'm looking for an older, used 642 that doesn't have the locking device (which is located just above the cylinder release "button") that the new revolvers have. Not terribly easy to find, but one will come along sooner or later. Hope I can remain patient! ;)

Hang in there with your practice and pay no attention to the "elephant" - it really will get easier to ignore him. :) My limited experience has shown that an added benefit from shooting double action revolvers is that it seems to help the shooter in developing superior trigger control. Should you ever decide to shoot a semi-auto with a single action style trigger, you'll have a bit of an edge over someone who's shot only semi-autos. You won't tend to "anticipate" the recoil as much as they might because you will have developed a smooth, consistent trigger pull.

Thanks again for your very kind offer.

Rick
 
Annie, the reality is this: +P or not, very few rounds expand reliably out of a 2" barrel.

A lot of the test data at places like Ammolabs is currently offline, unfortunately. We lost a lot of data when they went down...photographs of rounds after they'd gone through a layer or two of denim and a block of gelatin from a specific model gun.

They had a lot of data up on 2" barrel 38+Ps.

Some magazines have also published test data of this sort.

Hmmm.

Look, I did a post over on General describing how bullet expansion is linked to barrel length, velocity, bullet weight and bullet design:

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=174834

The deal is this: jacketed ammo expands slower than plain lead. Call it an "expansion penalty". The upside is that jacketed rounds won't have the nose unglued if they go too fast. But "too fast" ain't gonna happen in a 2" barrel 38. So in this one case and a couple other low-speed calibers, plain lead fairly heavy hollowpoints work.

But a heavyweight jacketed in a 2" snubbie?

Sorry, but that gun shop wasn't up on the latest news, or had a ton of that stuff cheap because nobody wants it.

From a barrel up past 4" I'd consider your 147s. From a 4" they'd be iffy.

From a 2"? The good news is they'll drill a nice .357" hole in somebody...but expansion would require a minor miracle.

---------------

Part of what's going on here is something I've complained about for years: the gun makers aren't providing "turn key solutions". They're not testing specific rounds in their guns. They're just "making guns", not making "self defense solutions". If the computer biz was run this way we'd all be using MS-DOS and Apple ||s about now. Instead they test specific combinations of hardware and software, certify the combinations, so the buyer doesn't have "fear, uncertainty and doubt" going in.

The gun biz appears to be BUILT on fear, uncertainty and doubt. Newbies are given no clue as to what works best with what. It's madness.

How easy would it be for S&W to test ammo in specific guns?

How easy would it be for a gunmaker to get into an agreement with a major ammo house to provide ammo tuned for a specific gun, and then do joint marketing? Every ad for that gun, they mention the ammo that goes best with it, and then make sure the dealers have that ammo with every gun?

Holsters too.

The computer biz does this stuff all the time. "Powered by Intel" on the computer's box - "Compatible with WinXP" there too.

The gunmakers are doing 19th century marketing in the 21st century. It's idiocy.
 
Food for thought

You've given me much to think about Jim. We bought the guns, then went to another table where my husband told the ammo dealer, "We want..." and the guy sold it to us. As I mentioned before the ammo was marked incorrectly, and we ended up with more velocity than we had purchased.

Perhaps we both operate under the presumption that bigger is better when it comes to ammo? I'm sure my husband with his SIG 45 thinks so.

I bought it purely for self-defense purposes, basically anything that would put a hole in a person in 25 feet or less. The CCW instructor suggested .38 caliber as the lowest caliber, not even to consider the .22. Yet many here suggest the .22 as a good starter gun. My questions were more about the accuracy of a snub-nose than how velocity or expansion were affected. In fact I had zero questions about that.:uhoh:

Rick, I don't understand the internal lock thing either. I do remember seeing that it was on all models after a specific year (1999, I think offhand). Good luck in finding the model you want. Basically until I get my permit, it is kept under lock and key in a safe when we're not using it. And the dogs don't have opposable thumbs to handle the gun, so I don't worry about it.:p
 
"I felt it in the webbing more because I think I was gripping it wrong. ..."


The way you described holding the gun WILL have some bearing on that, but, shooting may give some tenderness in your hand until you get in shape for it. Doing anything new can give some discomfort until you get used to whatever new thing you are doing, and you toughen up to it. If the soreness, or anticipating it, becomes a problem with holding steady when shooting, take a few days off, then try again. You'll get used to it in time.
 
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