jerkface11
Member
If it needs to be sent in for repair you shouldn't be paying the price of a new gun.
"New" Springfield 1911 in poor condition?
- Thread starter BootBuckle
- Start date
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2ndAmendmentNut
Member
A gun's first impression is everything to me. If it was me I would get my money back ASAP. Once the transfer takes place it will be your problem.
george burns
Member
No way I accept a damaged gun. You don't know what else is wrong with it "yet". It's never a great idea to start with a problem that is visible. That gun needed to be sent back. Any responsible gun store would have told you that to start with.
Yeah, well, we tried telling the new guy that way back on post #16,
... but, apparently, "in the case of a hard-to-find firearm," he disagrees and is willing to accept plainly visible faults, plus whatever other defects might surface later on. 'Kay, ... we did the best we could to school the boy. Maybe the ownership experience with subpar crapola is the better teacher.
BootBuckle
Member
...I think you missed post #24.
This is a forum, where people come to get advice from others to better prepare themselves for a pending decision. Even if I do end up taking possession, there is no reason for you or anyone else to get butt hurt--there's no harm done to anyone but me, and if I have to learn a lesson a hard way, so be it.
Not too sure why rocks were thrown...
This is a forum, where people come to get advice from others to better prepare themselves for a pending decision. Even if I do end up taking possession, there is no reason for you or anyone else to get butt hurt--there's no harm done to anyone but me, and if I have to learn a lesson a hard way, so be it.
Not too sure why rocks were thrown...
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ljnowell
Member
...I think you missed post #24.
This is a forum, where people come to get advice from others to better prepare themselves for a pending decision. Even if I do end up taking possession, there is no reason for you or anyone else to get butt hurt--there's no harm done to anyone but me, and if I have to learn a lesson a hard way, so be it.
Not too sure why rocks were thrown...
Welcome to the forum! Normally discourse is pretty civil, though you will have some that like throw done rocks from time to time. Enjoy your stay, glad you're here!
Not too sure why rocks were thrown ...
No rocks thrown, Boot. Please enjoy your sort-of "new" pistol.
I'm sure many here would be interested in a range report when you have the time.
No doubt you'll have the satisfaction and peace of mind that comes with S.A.'s warranty service, reputedly one of the best in the industry.
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98Redline
Member
When it comes down to it, this is a matter of how much the OP "wants" this particular model vs. how long he is willing to wait for it.
Granted the beat up box is generally not a great indicator, however the box could have been easily beat up at the distributer, after it left Springfield.
With the ding on the trigger. I agree that a new gun should be pristine but with the rate that companies have been producing and selling guns, QC seems to be slipping a little across the board (I am not condoning it, merely observing). As long as the ding is only cosmetic and does not effect functionality, I would at least consider keeping it.
As for the gun not being new, that would be something that you would need to inspect closely. Rub marks on the hammer, the condition of the barrel and the condition of the frame slides will be the truest indicator as to whether or not this gun has been "run" vs. only test fired at the factory.
I will also throw my recommendation in for Springfield's customer service and warranty work. My stainless loaded champion had a bulged barrel from the previous owner. The gun was sent to Springfield and they had it back to me in 3 weeks. The fitting of the new barrel was spot on and was a much better specimen than the original barrel. Mind you this was during the time when all of the XDs pistols were back there getting the recall upgrade.
So to the OP, you have 2 choices. Refuse this gun and wait for another Lightweight Champion Operator, or take this one, return it to Springfield to fix the ding in the trigger. With that I will say that you will have long forgotten about the 2-3 week warranty time long before you stop enjoying the particular gun that you wanted.
Granted the beat up box is generally not a great indicator, however the box could have been easily beat up at the distributer, after it left Springfield.
With the ding on the trigger. I agree that a new gun should be pristine but with the rate that companies have been producing and selling guns, QC seems to be slipping a little across the board (I am not condoning it, merely observing). As long as the ding is only cosmetic and does not effect functionality, I would at least consider keeping it.
As for the gun not being new, that would be something that you would need to inspect closely. Rub marks on the hammer, the condition of the barrel and the condition of the frame slides will be the truest indicator as to whether or not this gun has been "run" vs. only test fired at the factory.
I will also throw my recommendation in for Springfield's customer service and warranty work. My stainless loaded champion had a bulged barrel from the previous owner. The gun was sent to Springfield and they had it back to me in 3 weeks. The fitting of the new barrel was spot on and was a much better specimen than the original barrel. Mind you this was during the time when all of the XDs pistols were back there getting the recall upgrade.
So to the OP, you have 2 choices. Refuse this gun and wait for another Lightweight Champion Operator, or take this one, return it to Springfield to fix the ding in the trigger. With that I will say that you will have long forgotten about the 2-3 week warranty time long before you stop enjoying the particular gun that you wanted.
bigfatdave
Member
There's a WHOLE LOT of speculation and assumption going on here.
Here's the "flaw" from the O.P.
There's a small round depression mark on the trigger, folks. You have to be in good light to see it. We don't even know if it is on the side, front, or corner.
Oh, and the case had a rough ride to the shop. Which is what a case is FOR, folks, to take dings so the gun inside doesn't.
That's what we know so far.
For all we know, the mark is a leftover from the casting process, doesn't Springfield use an aluminum trigger shoe in their 1911 pistols? Plastic in the lightweights? I honestly don't know, but a small circular mark the size of a pencil eraser isn't a sign the gun is borked, it is a sign that there is a small circular mark on the trigger.
... ... Heck, it could be the hole for a travel adjustment screw for all I know.
Boot, take an experienced 1911 user with you if it makes you feel better.
Or post pictures here.
Or price out replacement triggers, the entire planet is lousy with aftermarket 1911 parts and triggers are fairly easy to swap and inexpensive.
... ... (I like the Caspian Trik Trigger, myself - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/614895/caspian-trik-trigger-1911-aluminum-silver)
But this doesn't sound like something worth panicking over, and a lot of the posts are getting silly.
Without further actual information, maybe the speculation and guessing should slow down a bit?
Here's the "flaw" from the O.P.
There's a small round depression mark on the trigger, folks. You have to be in good light to see it. We don't even know if it is on the side, front, or corner.
Oh, and the case had a rough ride to the shop. Which is what a case is FOR, folks, to take dings so the gun inside doesn't.
That's what we know so far.
For all we know, the mark is a leftover from the casting process, doesn't Springfield use an aluminum trigger shoe in their 1911 pistols? Plastic in the lightweights? I honestly don't know, but a small circular mark the size of a pencil eraser isn't a sign the gun is borked, it is a sign that there is a small circular mark on the trigger.
... ... Heck, it could be the hole for a travel adjustment screw for all I know.
Boot, take an experienced 1911 user with you if it makes you feel better.
Or post pictures here.
Or price out replacement triggers, the entire planet is lousy with aftermarket 1911 parts and triggers are fairly easy to swap and inexpensive.
... ... (I like the Caspian Trik Trigger, myself - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/614895/caspian-trik-trigger-1911-aluminum-silver)
But this doesn't sound like something worth panicking over, and a lot of the posts are getting silly.
Without further actual information, maybe the speculation and guessing should slow down a bit?
BootBuckle
Member
The last two posts nailed it--there is only a small indentation on the side of the aluminum trigger, and no other noticeable flaws on the firearm itself. I'll be in the shop on Saturday morning for my HQL course, and will take a few pictures to upload Saturday evening. Thanks for the input all.
On another note--what's with the flat or square looking triggers as of late (from the trigger recommendation 1 or 2 posts from this one)? When did they become popular (last few years?), and is there any purpose to flat triggers beside aesthetics?
On another note--what's with the flat or square looking triggers as of late (from the trigger recommendation 1 or 2 posts from this one)? When did they become popular (last few years?), and is there any purpose to flat triggers beside aesthetics?
bigfatdave
Member
Flat trigger is in theory more consistent trigger pull regardless of exact finger position.
It also looks cool.
It also (in my case) is a solution for those that like a long trigger.
If you're swapping triggers, length and comfort come first, everything else is a distant second. Many people that insist on a particular trigger in a 1911 don't even know WHY styles changed or what the difference is. Decide if you're comfortable with the trigger it comes with for now unless it is damaged*, and come back with what you think is a bad fit about it if anything.
* (if it is, SA inc should send you a replacement, and you should request the one you like best, as they all cost about the same)
It also looks cool.
It also (in my case) is a solution for those that like a long trigger.
If you're swapping triggers, length and comfort come first, everything else is a distant second. Many people that insist on a particular trigger in a 1911 don't even know WHY styles changed or what the difference is. Decide if you're comfortable with the trigger it comes with for now unless it is damaged*, and come back with what you think is a bad fit about it if anything.
* (if it is, SA inc should send you a replacement, and you should request the one you like best, as they all cost about the same)
Chocolate Bayou
Member
Call Springfield Customer Service. They will send you a prepaid Fed-Ex label and send it to them. I guarantee they will have it back in a week with new trigger. As for the case, you could send it back also, but I have never heard of scratched case affecting the performance of a gun. Also when you call customer service, give them the serial number and make sure when it was built. You don't really know where your LGS got the gun despite what they tell you.
Averageman
Member
I simply would not accept the firearm.
There is no way this gun was sent to you in this condition by Springfield as "acceptable".
In no way should any firearm be sold that needs an immeadiate trip back to any manufacturer to "make it right".
You're being taken advantage of, by whom it is yet to be determined.
If you take pictures and send them to Springfield and explain your issues and DO NOT accept the pistol, then it is up to your LGS and Springfield to make it right.
That would be the way I would handle it.
There is no way this gun was sent to you in this condition by Springfield as "acceptable".
In no way should any firearm be sold that needs an immeadiate trip back to any manufacturer to "make it right".
You're being taken advantage of, by whom it is yet to be determined.
If you take pictures and send them to Springfield and explain your issues and DO NOT accept the pistol, then it is up to your LGS and Springfield to make it right.
That would be the way I would handle it.
Magnumite
Member
"Flat trigger is in theory more consistent trigger pull regardless of exact finger position.
It also looks cool.
It also (in my case) is a solution for those that like a long trigger.
If you're swapping triggers, length and comfort come first, everything else is a distant second. Many people that insist on a particular trigger in a 1911 don't even know WHY styles changed or what the difference is. Decide if you're comfortable with the trigger it comes with for now unless it is damaged*, and come back with what you think is a bad fit about it if anything."
I hear that. That is how different people are with hand fit. I have never felt any consistency with the flat trigger. Except to drag my finger against the bottom of the trigger guard. Too long and there is no way to guide the finger where it needs to go. What I do like is starting with a flat trigger and putting the curve where and how I want it.
OP, Marylander here, too. HQL bites. I've been looking at a P89 Roger to replace this M&P Pro9. I just don't want to pop the $100 for the prints and license, exempted from the safety course. On the trigger issue, SA will probably want the pistol to replace the trigger. Bow length could cause lock work issues. Reading on the 1911 forum is very positive about SA's service. Call them, they will send a call tag so you are shipping cost free, send it to them. They will notify you when pistol will be returned since it has to be signed for. If the barrel lockup is loose, list that as well and you may get a fitted barrel/bushing.
It also looks cool.
It also (in my case) is a solution for those that like a long trigger.
If you're swapping triggers, length and comfort come first, everything else is a distant second. Many people that insist on a particular trigger in a 1911 don't even know WHY styles changed or what the difference is. Decide if you're comfortable with the trigger it comes with for now unless it is damaged*, and come back with what you think is a bad fit about it if anything."
I hear that. That is how different people are with hand fit. I have never felt any consistency with the flat trigger. Except to drag my finger against the bottom of the trigger guard. Too long and there is no way to guide the finger where it needs to go. What I do like is starting with a flat trigger and putting the curve where and how I want it.
OP, Marylander here, too. HQL bites. I've been looking at a P89 Roger to replace this M&P Pro9. I just don't want to pop the $100 for the prints and license, exempted from the safety course. On the trigger issue, SA will probably want the pistol to replace the trigger. Bow length could cause lock work issues. Reading on the 1911 forum is very positive about SA's service. Call them, they will send a call tag so you are shipping cost free, send it to them. They will notify you when pistol will be returned since it has to be signed for. If the barrel lockup is loose, list that as well and you may get a fitted barrel/bushing.
bigfatdave
Member
Magnumite said:
I know. I'm set up with a flat MSH, thin grips, and a long flat trigger
Not a very typical setup, but it works FOR ME
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