Newbie here...need some opinions

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Brisk

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Castle Rock, CO
Howdy! Names Brent and im from Castle Rock, CO. My wife and I have been married about 18months or so and just had our first child (little girl). These milestones in my life have made me realize the importance of protecting myself and my family.

My 23rd birthday is in April and I have requested a shotgun as the gift. It will be my first gun. I have decided on an 870 Express Super Magnum 12ga in synthetic with a 26" barrel. I think that this will be a good all around firearm for hunting, skeet, and HD. Any opinions??

Secondly I am starting a new job driving a tow truck and will be doing the occasional Repo. This has givin me the desire to get my CCW and a handgun to carry with me. This is where I am lost.

What brand? (I've shot Glocks and XDs and like both) What caliber?? (I've shot .38, 9mm, .40, .45) I like the availability, lower ammo cost and high mag capacity of the 9mm, and the power of the .45, and the .40 seems like a good comprimise (duh). But how do I decide?? And then where is the best place to holster my CW?? I typically wear jeans and T-shirts.

I have been lurking for a few weeks and am really impressed with the attitudes of those on this board. Thanks for all input!!

-Brent
 
For handgun caliber, that is going to be your personal preference, I personally carry 9mm or .357 mag, but your choice should include reliability, comfort and concelability as well as power and # of rounds.
My vote would be the XD in .40 or .45 whichever one suits you, and you shoot accurately.

as for the 870 express magnum; also get the short barrel with cylinder choke for HD, so you can use any ammo.

my opinion
Jake
 
Go with the 2-3/4" for the 870. Save money on the ammo.

Caliber: What turns your crank? 9mm is the minimum. 40S&W can be in the middle, but it can also keep up with the .45 Biggest factor is what recoil can you shoot accurately and will your wife want to use it? I have all three but only use the 9mm for punching holes in paper and for the plate rack at the range.

Which gun: That is something you will hear as many different opinions on as there are people. I like Kimbers and Rugers. The Kimbers are more expensive but well worth the money. Rugers are the "Timex" of revolvers (take a licking and keep on ticking), but are less expensive than many other brands.

I'd just suggest you find someone that has several different ones and try them. You will find one that "just fits". That will be your gun. DON'T be surprised if you change your mind on what you want, either in a handgun or rifle or shotgun. Ah yes, Grasshopper, that is a fact of owning guns and enjoying shooting. :D
 
Others may disagree but, I recommend a 9mm for a first handgun. It offers a decent defensive round in a HP, practice ammo is cheaper than the others, has easily handled recoil, and they have good mag capacity. In 9mm you have a handgun that you can practice more with and still have effective means of self defense.

As for which handgun, just about all big name production handguns will be reliable, so it comes down to features and comfort. Do you want an external toggle safety? What grip angle points best in you hands? Polymer, alloy, or steel frame? Pick one that feels right and you'll be happy with it.

If your primary cover is a tee shirt, you might want to look at the handguns with shorter grips and find a decent IWB holster.
 
First of all, welcome to the High Road.

As it pertains to your question about caliber, I started out on a 9mm. As jpsimms pointed out, caliber for CCW really is a matter of preference more than anything. However, ammo costs are rising fast and 9mm offers more practice on a budget. The gentler recoil is also more conducive to learning good habits than say, .40 SW or .357 magnum. The last thing you want is to develop a flinching habit.

As far as holster selection and placement - again, a matter of preference. You will find, though, that a lot of people carry inside waistband around 3 o'clock to 4:30 (or 9 o'clock to 7:30 for lefties). My primary method of carry is an inside the waistband holster at 3:00 for smaller guns, and 4:30 for larger autos. This will all depend on your build. For example, I happen to have somewhat of a beer belly, so carrying "appendix" (that is, 1:00 or so) does not work for me.

Oh, and just as fchavis said, a shorter grip frame may not allow an overly comfortable grip, but it sure goes a LONG way for concealment. You will find that the most difficult part of a pistol to conceal is the grip frame.
 
I am a huge 870 fan and have found them to be excellent guns. Don't think you'll be dissapointed.

I disagree with the poster above who said save some money on the front end and get the 2 3/4" model. You indicated hunting as a use and you will find the 3" or 3 1/2" shells to be better suited for those purposes. You can always use 2 3/4" for fun or home defense.

If you weren't going to hunt with it I wouldn't spring for the Super Mag. I'd just get the regular 870 express Mag.
 
With any weapon, the subjective is objective.

See what you like best--ask buddies, visit a rental range, handle guns at shops or shows. Buy one, shoot it a bunch, find something you like and then buy two more just like it. Buy a boxcar full of mags and lots of ammo.

Most of all, go to school. Sign up for a class; it will open your eyes to problems/concerns that you have not thought of. Software trumps hardware. Allow your software to select your hardware. The guns you see at gun school are vastly different that what is touted by stool-borne rangers and internet gabfests.

Remember:

It's cool to be in school.

It is the musician that matters, not the piano.:)
 
Hello, Brisk, and welcome to The High Road.


For a general purpose shotgun, Remington 870's are hard to beat. I don't have any experience with them personally, but the reputation is excellent, and I've heard many on this forum speak highly of them.

As for a pistol, I'm sure you're going to get a lot of replies indicating that a pistol is a very personal choice, and what fits one person's needs, and fits in one person's hand, may not work as well for another. Definitely I would suggest going with a gun that feels good in your hand, and shopping around at gun stores and renting guns at a range are good ways to get an idea of the feel and workings of a certain model. You mentioned Glocks and Springfield XDs, and both to my knowledge are excellent firearms (I've only used a Glock 17, no XDs).

As for caliber, that too is a personal choice. Some people feel undergunned with any caliber than doesn't begin with a "4". Others are quite happy with 9mm or .38spl. One piece of advice I've heard is to "carry the most gun that you can conceal". For some, that can be a full-sized automatic. For others, it's a small pocket pistol. It would probably help to consider your wardrobe options, not only what you currently wear, but what you would be willing to wear. Loose clothes, naturally, conceal better. Many people begin wearing their shirts untucked when they CCW.

There are other options besides belt-carry, though. Ankle holsters and pocket holsters come to mind. Neither is generally considered to be as effective as belt-carry, as they take longer to access (usually) and are inherently less stable carrying devices.


Good luck.
 
Best advice I can give for carrying comes from Clint Smith, remember:

Guns are not to be comfortable, but comforting. People go out and buy small guns to "conceal" (you conceal with the holster, not the pistol size) and then have problems shooting them from positions of duress (on your back) or have problems manipulating them because of smaller size or increased spring tension, especially manipulating them one handed (if you are in a fight you will be hurt).

Get a good holster AND a good belt. Many ignore the necessity of a good belt and wonder why their pistols flops about or moves on them. I like Milt Sparks but there are many other good makers.
 
See what you like best--ask buddies, visit a rental range, handle guns at shops or shows. Buy one, shoot it a bunch, find something you like and then buy two more just like it. Buy a boxcar full of mags and lots of ammo.
Click to expand...

+1 to this and everything else el tejon's said in this thread. There's an analogy I think that works.

You don't just go buy a car because your buddy or the internet says it's a good car, do you? No, of course not. You go test drive the thing. See how it handles. See how the fit is. You'll not just run out and buy a Ford Excursion just because it's a big powerful beast. Likewise, you probably won't run out and buy a Toyota Yaris because it fits well into parking spaces. Yeah, the excursion's big and beastly, and you'll find people everywhere talking about how that's the perfect ride for you. And the Yaris is tiny and efficient, and easy to park. And because it's a tiny little thing, and easy to park, they'll tell you that you're more likely to drive it. (compare this part of the analogy to a mousegun like a .22 derringer or something) But just running out and buying either would be kind of silly without test driving them.

So, find a range that does rentals or some friends with a lot of different guns, and go test drive them. I come from the school that the firearm that's most likely to save your life is the one that's available, and that you shoot best.

And as for the 870, that's a pretty darned good choice for home defense.
 
im 23 and have a 4 inch 9mm xd with night sights (and about 3000 rounds fired) and a xd-45c(probably close to 8,000 rounds). I have fired a xd in 40(borrowed but i estimate at the time it had about 500 rounds through it). I think they are all great guns but a little big to be comfortable(at least in the ways i have tried). I found something like a .380 or 38 snub to be better in size/weight on my waist or jacket pocket. With that said... i carry my xd-45c primarily and i practice with it ALOT... just wish it had night sights. Its, in my opinion, better for carry than the glock because of the grip safety and the fact that my 45 can carry between 11 and 14 rounds of 230 grain gold dots but still conceal on me(5' 5" and about 130 pounds).
 
enough said on the pistol question.

I agree a 870 is a good home defense weapon, I would recommend against a 26" barrel for that purpose, I don't know the setup in your home, but it would be tough to maneuver in mine.
 
Brisk, congratulations on your enlightenment. Addiction may soon follow.

870s are a great gun and boast a TON of accessories to customize as you see fit.

I think everyone else has said enough about handguns, but personal advice is there's nothing wrong with used. Especially certified (by the manufacture like SigSauer). Some people don't like them but if you buy from a reputable company most guns will outlast you and their last owner.

+1 for your wife learning and being comfortable using everything you buy. My GF is 5'4" and barely breaking 100lb and she has access to .410, 20 gauge, and 12 gauge shotguns. She prefers my Mossberg 500 12 gauge above all others so don't assume what she'll like.

Welcome to the High Road.

-Russ
 
870 Express. Just a few minutes (and cash of course) will change it from a hunting gun to a tacticool HD scattergun. Then a few minutes will change it right back.

Not to mention they are inexpensive and common enough that if you trash the thing hunting (get in some rough chukar country and it WILL get trashed) you can easily get replacement parts.
 
Wow thanks for the responses!! I have shot a Browning Hi-power 9mm, Glock 23 .40, XD40, 1911 .45, colt single action .357 (and .38spl rounds) and a walther ppk .380. I am comfortable shooting all of the above. I think that I would prefer a .45 but I think my wife would have trouble holding on to that.

Kimbers and Sigs are nice but out of my price range. 1911s are not an option because I want to be able to shoot more than 8 rounds before reloading.

I typically wear t-shirts untucked so I think that that would work to my advantage in the CCW dept. I am 6' @195lbs and an average build. would I be able to conceal a full frame semi-auto with an iwb holster??

I do plan on taking a class or 2 and making my wife take them too.

Thanks for all the help...sorry for all the questions:eek:
 
Hello Brent welcome to the game .

Lots of good advice so far but everyone including you seem to have forgotten a very important aspect of your Home Defense .

Your Wife .

You can't be home or with her 24/7 and she needs to be brought into this entire process , from firearms selection , to storage of said guns and planning on how to deal with a break in etc. etc . .

Many folks just starting out are also in the process of buying a home more suited to raising a family "single men for example don't care what the quality of education the local schools provide or if there are any family parks with kiddie swings nearby" if you are looking keep HD in mind and try to purchase one that has a tactical setup making it easy to protect the children/s room/s in the middle of the night .

Remember basic things also like sturdy doors with solid locks and to use them , storage sheds that are kept locked to prevent a criminal from using a yard rake or snow shovel to break a window and enter the home and ladders locked down so they can't climb to a second story .

With a new baby come the opportunity to also raise a good protective dog from a puppy with your daughter , a good Germen Sheppard would be an excellent choice , when raised in a loving family and as a child's companion the breed is naturally protective without expensive training and would more than likely give it's life to protect the people in the home .

A gun is honestly the last line of defense and can be avoided with the correct measures taken in most cases .

I suggest you speak to your wife and get her on board with all of this including the firearm safety and proficiency training , a good 4 inch barrel 357 with either hot 38's or mild 357 loads would make an excellent HD weapon to be kept close should the need arise .
 
I'll stay out of the handgun discussion, but I will definitelly second the 870 as an outstanding all-purpose gun. my personal HD gun is an 870 Express magnum with a 26" barrel. 26" is a great length for many different types of hunting, and if I ever get more serious about HD use I will go out and get an 18 or 20" barrel for it-870 barrels are relatively inexpensive and can be changed without tools in 30 seconds. I would personally go with the 3" chamber as well-3" magnum shells are plenty in pretty any situation I can think of, and have much less recoil than 3 1/2" shells. Also, don't forget that a 3" or 3 1/2" gun can shoot shorter shells just fine :)
 
Brisk,

forget about the idea that your wife cant handle the 45. My girlfriend is about 5' 3" and to be safe i wont say her weight but she is small... has a hard time finding pants small enough in the waist. She will eat a 5" hole(with almost no misses) with 100 rounds at 7 yards with my 45 loaded with 230 grain bullets... how? because she wants to.
 
Women can shoot a .45 just fine. I am an instructor, and I have seen women do just dandy with a .45. If ammo cost is a factor, the 9mm is a good choice. If you can't afford to practice the extra power won't help you. A COM hit with a 9X19 beats a miss with .45 any time. With the new generation of expanding bullets the 9mm isn't all that much behind a .45. It got the rep as poor stopper with military ball ammo.

BTW- look at the Steyr pistols- I love my S9. CDNN may still have them, or you might find one at a gun show.
 
+1 on the shottie! But if you are intent on "clearing" your home when you hear that bump in the night, then I wouldn't go with a 26 inch barrel. However that is clearly not a great idea anyway and we've already had a recent thread here wherein this was discussed. If you make the BGs (Bad Guys) come to you, then the length of the barrel is going to be a nonissue.

As far as handguns, speaking as an instructor for these last 20 yrs, I'd say nothing smaller in caliber than a 9mm and nothing bigger than what you can comfortably shoot over long periods of time and very accurately. That's the key. Nobody ever died from a loud noise and so only HITS count. Get trained in tactics. I can teach you to punch holes in paper in a few hours but that's not self defense. You need professional training and constant practice. The best way to get fairly realistic practice is to join the IDPA (International Defensive Pistol Assoc) http://www.idpa.com and locate a club near you. Join them and actually participate in the matches! They're a really friendly group and usually welcome newcomers with open arms. Lots of real world experience to be had as references there too. IDPA attracts police officers, doctors, teachers, housewives (dangerous job, that) and grannies. In the end, it's not WHAT you shoot. It's how WELL you shoot it!
 
Send me an e-mail and I'll send you a long document that I use in recommending firearms to my ccw students. It's about 12 pages long and all of it is useful so being forced to truncate it here is not the best idea.
 
Welcome to The High Road, Brisk!

Do you plan to hunt waterfowl with steel shot? You might do a search here at THR on the words 870 Express Super Magnum . I'm not a goose hunter; I like 2 3/4" chambered guns. 3" chambers are fine, too. Gun fit is important; it's a good idea to be sure that you and your wife can both operate the gun comfortably.

Then, in the words of our own Dave McCracken, BA/UU/R.

I'll echo the advice others have given about handguns: try a bunch, then pick the one(s) that you and your wife shoot the best.

In addition, you'll probably get .22s sooner or later. There's a lot to be said for inexpensive practice, and you're going to want to teach your daughter, too. ;)
 
Welcome to THR!

The simple thing to remember is that a gun I recommend to you may not be the best gun for you as an individual because it may fit me, but not you.

The best advice is to find out what fits your hand, what points for you. Take a look at corneredcat.com for good instructions for fitting a handgun. You could also just search for any thread referring to corneredcat.com and you'll almost certainly find other good advice on fit and choices (as well as silly "XYZ is the best gun, period!" opinions).

If the gun points naturally for you, points to point of aim without having to adjust your grip or wrist angle when you pick it up, and the reach to the trigger is comfortable for you, you'll be able to learn to hit accurately and quickly with the weapon as well as handling heavier recoil with less discomfort.

Then practice, practice, practice. And get some quality training. And practice some more.

When you've done all that never forget that some idget and his ride are not worth you not making it home to your wife and child. If they come storming out over a piece of property you're under no obligation to defend that piece of property. Your job is to pick up cars, not get into fights (that might turn deadly) over them. Just drop the car back onto the street and tell'm, "Sorry dude it's just a job. It's not my car. Enjoy the ride.". When it's over just come back when they're asleep and take it to the yard.
 
Thinking back to my car-garage days, I was crawling under cars, scooting on concrete, and laying on my back a lot. I don't think there would be a good place to put a large or even medium frame gun w/out it gettting torn up somewhere, or me getting pinched by it.

You'll have to do this in a VERY safe location, but borrow someone's XD, Glock, or 1911. Holster it as you might (IWB/OWB, whatever) and then practice crawling around cars and in & out of your rig. See what you think.

I know many disagree, but if you'll be doing repo work - that is, in and out of the truck, scooting under a car to hook it up, etc. - having something small and inconspicuous might be the ticket. Check out the Ruger LCP. It's only the .380, so not a real powerhouse. But with its size, you can get a small pocket holster and let it sit there just fine until you need it.

hso is 100% right - your job is repo, not counterattack. Drop the car and boogie. If - and only if - your life is threatened and you cannot retreat (that's the law in Texas) can you pull iron, and then may God have mercy on your soul, because most DAs won't if it gets nasty. A .380 won't stop a bad guy from 50 yards away, but it might very well save your life at 10 or 15 feet.

Q
 
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