no need to carry anymore...

[Bitmap]

Two carry submachine guns; the others, snub-nosed shotguns.

I'll bet the recoil is a killer.

 

[Master Blaster]

I FEEL SO MUCH SAFER NOW THAT I KNOW THE GESTAPO AND THE SECRET POLICE ARE PROTECTING THE RICH POWERFULL AND IMPORTANT PEOPLE AND BUILDINGS.

I'm just a little worried about who is going to protect me from getting stomped into mush, if I inadvertantly get in their way.

 

[BobbyQuickdraw]

Sign me up for the Tinfoil army.

The little boy in me goes "Cool Guns!"
The good little Republican in me goes "Yay fight terrorism!"
But the other 98% of me knows this isn't good.

Cameras on all the corners and heavily armed non-uniformed police patrolling in unmarked cars making "random" shows of force.

...

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

I am usually a firm supporter of the police in any of the cop threads on THR.

But this is too far. SWAT teams are supposed to be 100% reactionary. Keep the black SUVs in the motor pool and the black jumpsuits in the locker until a violent standoff is actually happening, then call them to end it if no other way exists. It's Special Weapon And Tactics. Meaning, not the norm. NY needs to cancel these teams and allocate the money hiring more detectives to actually find terrorist plots using research and intelligence, and hiring more normal cops in standard blue uniforms and marked cars. Beat cops are supposed to be people someone can go to for help. If you're lost or your car broke down, or you need to make a phone call, a normal cop is someone you should be unafraid of to go to for help. They are supposed to project a positive image in the community. No-nonsense SWAT teams should be kept back at the station and only deployed when needed.

How many hostage standoffs or violent bank robberies take place in NY in one day? Out of the 51,000 NYPD, I would be that they need maybe 50 SWAT officers at most. A few 8-man teams spread throughout the boroughs. NYPD doesn't need more SWAT guys, they need more smart detectives, and well-trained but courteous beat cops.


I am not sure that I would go as far as to say that this is a deliberate attempt to desensitize us to a police state, but that it may be that the higher-ups really think this is a good idea and have no clue about the civil rights violations inherent in this type of policing. And that is just as bad I think. And the effect is the same, deliberate or not. A few months/years of this and daily SWAT foot patrols all over the city won't seem that crazy to NY.

You just wait, overt patrols are next. Either on foot or more likely mounted in some military vehicle like a HMMWV. First these "Hercules" teams are in normal looking SUVs. Next they will be out in the open in HMMWVs, prolly with a 249 in the turret. "Just to scare the terrorists" of course.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

So all of us that think that 1984 wasn't a joke are now watching it come true. If Ron Paul is a kook, and these guys are normal, I think it's about time to declare myself a kook too.

 

[SoonerSP101]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,2064157,00.html

Naomi Wolf's 10 steps...

 

[politicalgeek]

amen...

reminds me to go read 1984 again

It rides that fine line of right and wrong, while it is great that someone is doing something about something we can't be so caught up drinking the kool aid we miss the moment it actually crosses that line.

The cops in New Orleans were just trying to protect the citizens and scare the right people too, I'm sure.

(For the record, I do fully support the police officers that are out there for us...this goes way too far IMHO)

 

[GTSteve03]

Look what the rest of the country gets to look forward to if Rudy (Mr. NYC) gets elected President!

I can't wait!

 

[.41Dave]

Hmmm... Ya know, a smart terrorist might wait until New Yorkers get acclimated to these SuperNinjaSquad runs, then just go buy some cool black ninja suits, body armor, guns, and a black SUV or two. Compliant, pre-conditioned citizens will not know it's a terrorist attack until too late, and when the real NYPD SuperNinjaSquad shows up in response, no one will know which group of thugs is which.

 

[v35]

I'm just a little worried about who is going to protect me from getting stomped into mush, if I inadvertantly get in their way.

The few shall be stomped into mush, for the good of the many.

USA-Land Über Alles!

 

[fast eddie]

there will always be someone claiming paranoia even as they are carrying us away...

Hmmm, I have noticed an unusually large number of black helicopters lately...

 

[SamTuckerMTNMAN]

Actually, I learned long ago, you can trust anyone. There is no reason to doubt or be skeptical. It is a true Americans job to suspect other Americans, but never anyone in authority. They have our best interests at heart, it's for our safety. Just follow the rules, don't complain. And there have never been unmarked black helicopters, unmarked black SUV's, unmarked black clad police, intimidating civilians. Unless needed. It's for your good. Where's my medication?

 

[K9 PO]

As a law enforcement officer (not NYPD) working in New York City, the idea of Hercules teams roving the streets and if you have lived in NYC for the past few years, CRV (Critical Response) drills are a joke. Federal monies allocated for officer overtime for high profile visibility posts are misappropriated. The officer who is on overtime standing a foot post supposedly to deter terrorists is required to write a certain amount of summonses or lose out on the cash train. The average beat cop for any of the local agencies can tell how their respective departments are using smoke and mirrors to fool the public. That being said, I'd like to respond to some comments a few posters have made.

To the poster from Norway who stated it won't be too long before they jump out and arrest everybody (refering to the Hercules Teams), define everybody? New York City is de facto the most liberal city on the east coast. Believe me if "everyone" was being arrested, the ACLU and local political factions would be up in arms. Politicians in NYC want to deball police and make them play nice with criminals. Google Lt. Governor David Patterson's proposed bill after the Sean Bell shooting for clarification.

To the poster who kept refering to these teams as "SWAT". No such animal exists in New York City. We have an Emergency Service Unit (commonly known as ESU) who are not a reactionary unit. They are on proactive patrol and are more like a fire department rescue company. They are trained in extricating victims from vehicles, rescuing drowning victims, gaining entry into apartments if the victim is unable to open the door., etc. They do get the cool toys to play with though but once again are not REACTIONARY. The members assigned to Hercules Teams are not supercops or other derogatory terms used for law enforcement as I have seen members on this forum use. They are Emergency Service cops assigned to the teams following orders. I don't understand how civilian law enforcement officers are viewed with such contempt for following orders while military soldiers are praised for following orders as well.

I'm not here to flame anyone, just clarifying.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

However many of them, however well armed, they won't be around when you need them.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

Thank you for making our point k9. Police are not there to be a heavily armed patrols.

They are on proactive patrol and are more like a fire department rescue company.

Since when does a rescue company look like the brute squad?

They are Emergency Service cops assigned to the teams following orders.

The nazis said that too.

I don't understand how civilian law enforcement officers are viewed with such contempt for following orders while military soldiers are praised for following orders as well.

Because they are not the military. They may dress like some spec-ops team, but in reality they are just bullies with automatic weapons. When the point is to scare people, it becomes state sanctioned terror. Think about it.

 

[K9 PO]

Quote:

Since when does a rescue company look like the brute squad?

That's your opinion. We dress appropriately for our jobs.

Quote:

The nazis said that too.

The Nazis also killed millions of Jews indiscriminately. Are you saying anyone who follows orders are Nazis? ESU Cops do not go around targeting Johnny Public and executing him or her based on their race, religion, or creed. Comparing Cops or any other job where there is a chain of command even at a McDonalds to Nazis is absurd. By the same token you can compare Nazis to our brave soldiers in various theathers of operation.

Quote:

Because they are not the military. They may dress like some spec-ops team, but in reality they are just bullies with automatic weapons. When the point is to scare people, it becomes state sanctioned terror. Think about it.

What should they wear then? The purpose of a uniform is to make the individual wearing said uniform easily recognizable as a form of authority. You call them bullies with automatic weapons, once again your personal opinion.

The point of the Hercules teams were not to incite fear and panic in the general population. Original mission of the teams were to disuade potentional terrorists from committing their acts if there was the potential of an omnipresent team specifically created to target THEM. Good idea? Not in my opinion. The Detective making the remark about that's the type of reaction we want to see, could have chosen better words.

I'm not here to get into a measuring contest with you here. Terrorism is defined as acts of violence to induce fear or panic to the public in an attempt to coerce a government into accepting a set of beliefs or to further propaganda. I agreed with posters to the extent that this is a ridiculous show of force but to call the officers assigned to this unit bullies is the equivalent of Rosie O'Donnel calling our armed forces terrorists.

 

[ptmmatssc]

After reading the whole article , a few more things seemed to make me want to don ye 'ol metal hat .

For the Aviation Unit's airborne patrol, the department last year purchased a helicopter equipped with a high-powered camera that can read a license plate from 2000 ft. Unlike the unit's other six choppers, which are emblazoned with the NYPD logo, this one is unmarked. It regularly monitors crowds at high-profile events, such as the Republican National Convention and New Year's Eve in Times Square.

Lol , so maybe the "black choppers" thing has some credibility .

"If you see [a heavy flashlight], we need to treat it as a suspicious package," Walsh says

Walsh checks with his commanders over the radio to see if there are any questions. When he is done, a woman in a navy blue overcoat and knit cap approaches.

"What's going on?" she asks, clearly alarmed.

"It's a counterterrorism exercise, ma'am," Walsh says. "Nothing's wrong."

The woman's face slackens with relief. "Nothing's wrong? Great!"

Yup , nothing to see here , just move along . Btw , do you have your papers ?

 

[yesit'sloaded]

A stone's throw down the sidewalk, Abad Nieves watches the scene unfold. Nieves is a detective with the Intelligence Division of the New York Police Department (NYPD). Casually clad in slacks and a black leather jacket, he monitors the response of people loitering in the area. Is anyone making notes or videotaping? Does anyone seem especially startled by the out-of-the-blue appearance of a heavily armed NYPD squad?QUOTE]
So if I get startled by the out-of-the-blue appearance of a heavily armed squad of guys I must be up to no good? ***?

"The response we usually get is, 'Holy s---!'" Nieves says. "That's the reaction we want. We are in the business of scaring people"[/

Lets see what old Webster has to say:
ter·ror
Pronunciation:
\ˈter-ər, ˈte-rər\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English, from Anglo-French terrour, from Latin terror, from terrēre to frighten; akin to Greek trein to be afraid, flee, tremein to tremble — more at tremble
Date:
14th century

1: a state of intense fear2 a: one that inspires fear : scourge b: a frightening aspect <the terrors of invasion> c: a cause of anxiety : worry

So it is terror, and it is state sanctioned. I rest my case.

 

[Nomad101bc]

Thinks of a few scenes from the movie "Equalibrium".

 

[K9 PO]

Quote:

So it is terror, and it is state sanctioned. I rest my case.

So definitive and concise. Once again, your opinion. I haven't seen any of these terroristic cops execute someone like the Nazis you compared them to.

 

[ptmmatssc]

Terrorism is defined as acts of violence to induce fear or panic

ter·ror·ism /ˈtɛrəˌrɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ter-uh-riz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.

threat (thrět) Pronunciation Key
n.

1. An expression of an intention to inflict pain, injury, evil, or punishment.
2. An indication of impending danger or harm.
3. One that is regarded as a possible danger; a menace.

What should they wear then? The purpose of a uniform is to make the individual wearing said uniform easily recognizable as a form of authority.

So , was the standard police uniform not being recognized any more? People mistaking nypd with the milk man ?

 

[dasmi]

 

[dasmi]

So definitive and concise. Once again, your opinion. I haven't seen any of these terroristic cops execute someone like the Nazis you compared them to.

Give it time.


www.cato.org/raidmap.

 

[K9 PO]

Not to be rude but are you from NYC? There are security guards whose uniforms AND vehicles look identical to NYPD in NYC. The only difference of what these cops are wearing and the regular patrol cop is body armor over standard shirt, and a helmet instead of an 8 point hat. Each unit in NYPD has a specific duty uniform and that has been around since the formation of the PD. Let me tell you how politically sensitive NY is. Years ago when patrol cops were issued leather duty jackets, certain groups voiced their opinions about the resemblence of these cops to the Gestapo and the jackets were no longer allowed.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

Let me tell you how politically sensitive NY is. Years ago when patrol cops were issued leather duty jackets, certain groups voiced their opinions about the resemblence of these cops to the Gestapo and the jackets were no longer allowed.

It obviously isn't that way now.

There are security guards whose uniforms AND vehicles look identical to NYPD in NYC.

Then pass a law restricting them to not impersonate the PD.

Each unit in NYPD has a specific duty uniform and that has been around since the formation of the PD.

So which one got the brute squad uniform in the beginning.

The point of the Hercules teams were not to incite fear and panic in the general population.

Lying to yourself is not going to make it better. Don't believe everything you are told or hear.