NORWAY: Heat style robbery, cop killed

[Kobun]

cordex,
cops use Magtec FMJ in both 9mm and .38
Even use FMJ for the few .308s that are out there.
Guess it is better for the politicians to be PC than conserned about overpenetration.

T.Stahl,
yes it is peacefull. Farily...
But then a bunch of foreign criminals figured crime pays here, and if they plan well, they can get away with alot of cash.

There has been 6 or 7 high profile robberies in the last 5 or so years.
All together they have gotten away with somewhere around NOK 100 million, $15 million.

During these last two, they have started to shoot, alot.
And today they did it in the senter of town, during morning rushour and with people walking right by them.

(Most people thought it was an exercise untill they started shooting). :banghead:

Oh, and the shooting lasted for 15-20 minutes...
Not a small scale operation, as they had atleast 8 men, in the bank sentral alone, and then guards, drivers etc.

 

[Cosmoline]

Just like our cops, they needed some proper rifles to go along with subguns and handguns. Hope they catch these criminals! The sheet draped over the side of the cop van needs no translation.

 

[wasrjoe]

I want to admire what they did because it was an impressive feet, but they are evil men who killed indiscriminately for money. It's like seeing a really nice painting... that Hitler painted. Bad stuff, I hope they get caught.

 

[papercut]

Most U.S. bank robbers are stupid. It seems Norway has smarter robbers.

We had a series of bank robberies in the Atlanta, Georgia, area recently. (For those not familiar, the metropolitan Atlanta area consists of the city of Atlanta, Fulton county (in which Atlanta is), as well as 13 or 14 other counties and the cities in those counties, with a total of over 4.5 million people. The "perimeter" is I-285, a federal interstate highway that really isn't an interstate--it circles Atlanta and weaves in and out of some of the surrounding counties.) The "perimeter bandit," as he came to be called, seemed to have developed a pattern, which local police agencies guessed, and caught him in a stakeout at a bank they guessed he would rob, on the day they guessed.

http://www.wgnx.com/Global/story.asp?S=1746792

I'll stick to our (usually) stupid robbers.

Kobun: have those other robberies been similar to this one (the one in Norway)? With automatic weapons?

 

[Kobun]

papercut,
yes, the other robberies have been similar.
In the others they have used AK-47's, HK G3s, MP5's and I believe UZIs. All full auto smugeled in or stolen from the military of course.

Yesterday they got away with something like $4 mill.
Three wehicles were used in the robbery.
A Range Rover, a Saab station vagon and a Ford Excursion.
They spent 20-25 minutes on site using a ladder and a sledgehammer to gain access to the bank.
They went onto the roof on an adjacent building, and used the ladder to get into the banks cortyard. Here they broke through a window.

During the escape they drove in formation, shooting at groups of people on the way to work. Fortunatly nobody was hit.
They drove through residential streets at high speeds, dropping caltrops (!!!) as they went.

Up to 15 men may have been involved.

08:00 A burning truck blocks the exit from the police station, blocking in squd cars.
08:10 Six masked men enter the bank building from the roof of n adjacent building. Other men set up a permiter around the area.
08:15 The police get the alarm and dispatches units. One unit is engaged and shot at.
08:20 A planiclothes police officer is taken hostage and placed on the ground. This permiter guard shoots at the police supervisors unit and kills him, while standing over the hostage.
08:30 More units arrive and the shooting continues.
One robber is probably hit by police fire.
08:40 The robbers exit the bank carrying large bags. They escape in three vehicles while shooting out as they go.
09:00 The cars are located engulfed in flames aprox two kilometers from the bank. The police set up a permiter around Stavanger.

It is believed that most of the crew is from Ex. Yugoslavia with military background.

 

[NonServiam]

There are certain similarities with the october robbery of the Oslo postal terminal. Well-planned, ruthless, automatic weapons. Ordinary Norwegian police is simply not trained or equipped to handle these situations, and our SWAT equivalent only arrives when the action is over, due to the speed and efficiency of the robbers ...

 

[0007]

Probably organized crime ring from one of your neighboring countries. Russian mafia or some such. Don't care who or how many they kill during the operation. Love to see this tried in Switzerland...

 

[mete]

This reminds me of the Brinks robbery in Nyack NY in 1981 which was the start of major changes in police operations. The "commando car" I gues s is what we would call a SWAT vehicle , this one a Ford Expedition. For those who don't know what a "caltrop" is - this is a 4 pointed star which the thrown on the ground will always have one point straight up. It was invented hundreds of years ago to be strewn on the battlefield to stop horses and has now been reinvented to stop vehicles. !

 

[Kobun]

mete,
the "commando car" is NOT a SWAT vehicle!
It is the shift supervisors vehicle.
"Kommandobil" means "In charge vehicle" or "Leadership car".

The national SWAT team driver a range og 4x4 vehicles, usually all black.
The local teams use what is available depending on location.

 

[mete]

Thanks Kobun. I see they are now taking a vote on www.aftenposten.no whether people think police should always be armed or armed only in emergencies.

 

[Norwegian]

Now reports says that three people have been arrested in Sweden that in regards to the robbery.

More news will follow tomorrow since the Norwegian police are in charge and handle the media on this one.

 

[another okie]

Someone mentioned above that headshots were tough with just an MP-5. MP-5s are quite accurate if you take the time to get a good sight picture. You can make accurate shots out to 50 yards fairly easily and 100 yards with good training.

"It's like seeing a really nice painting... that Hitler painted"

Just as a minor aside, I've seen some of Hitler's work, and it was mediocre. He was just a postcard painter who cranked out cheap drawings of buildings to sell to tourists.

 

[igor]

A weird choice of ammunition the Norwegian police have made! I guess it was the Danish police then that bought consulting from the Finnish police tech center and issued the same Gold Dots our cops do.

It seems that the mentioning of 10mm MP-5's (some Norwegian 'net medium, can't remember which) was baloney, then?

 

[Kobun]

When you have a bunch of whiney politicins that thinks guns are bad, and that the police really don't need them, and that if you mention hollowpoints, or "dum-dum" bullets like they think the name is, then they get all upset and whine about the poor criminals, and how we have to follow the Hague, Wienna and a bunch of other conventions that is connected to war, not police action.
And the police is supposed to "shoot for the legs" anyways.

 

[igor]

Kobun, lots of luck to you converting those politicians... I have a clue about the wide spectrum of various ludicrous ideologies in Norwegian politics and sure don't envy you.

But, there's a discussion going on here where I got the mentioning of the 10mm MP-5 from (so it was no news material, my bad) and they seriously lack expertise in it. FMJ vs. JHP, .223 vs. 7,62 vs. 9mm... Unfortunately Aftenposten has made it impossible for someone without a Norwegian cell phone connection to take part... would some of you locals in the know enlighten that audience a bit?

 

[Kobun]

igor,
NE EU, where is that?
And, no, I'm sorry, but I will not take the job of trying to un-hollyweirdize the Norwegian public.
That doensn't get us anywhere anyways.
I am however slowly working on getting the police to go to a 223 carbine and 9mm pistol, hopefully with good ammunition.
Like you saw, people see a .38 case and start talking about MP5-10's...
It is only the FBI that has those...
And, why go to the bother of stealing a gun from the FBI in the US, smuggle it out of the US and into Norway just to use it in one robbery and then sink it in a lake... Not to mention that 10mm ammo isn't exactly filling all the shelves in gunstores here.
It is much easier to steal from the military in Norway and Sweeden, or to smuggle guns in from the Balkans and eastern Europe.

Unfortunatly, it seems the robbers sometimes have more brains and use better logic that politicians and the public here.
I blame Hollywierd for corrupting their minds!

 

[igor]

Kobun, det er Finland. And I used to live in Norway for a year too . But I wasn't pushing the burden of pounding some sense in Norwegian politicians on your shoulders alone! All the best in converting whom you can.

A top cop there pointed out neighboring countries as examples of better access to weapons for LEO but omitted Finland. Why? Our cops carry Glock 17 or 19, with Speer Gold Dots, and they always carry on duty, open or concealed. Only some few of the old school still prefer a revolver. They also have MP-5's (semi-auto only version!) in the cars, since maybe 5-6 years back. Before that they had assorted shotguns, hunting rifles and even Valmet assault rifles as support weapons...

So I heard some Albanians were caught in Sweden already. Good going! I wonder if these guys might have been the same that attempted on an armored van here... last summer or was it the previous? They had a Chevy van, professional gear and weapons, spread "Spanish riders" on their escape route and torched the van immediately after the heist too - but couldn't get in the armored car at all!!! :banghead: OTOH, they didn't fire a shot IIRC, if not a few at a police car in pursuit, before the polices' tires were busted by the spikes. Noone has been caught.

 

[mussi]

in Switzerland...

We had the Fraumuenster robbery which was very well-planned and non-violent, and very successful (54 million Swiss Francs robbed).

They got some of the robbers but never found the money.

The last violent attack on a bank in the 80s quickly told the robbers that some cops do carry 9mm pistols and have assault rifles in their cars sometimes, although, by some sheer miracle, all robbers shot survived.

Lesson No 1: Don't commit armed crime in Switzerland.
Lesson No 2: If you do so, don't aim at cops.
Lesson No 3: Don't kill cops, since this heavily reduces your life expectancy.

Lesson No 3 is followed here as nobody ever survived killing a cop down here. Seems like the perps doing this always die on the run.

If it was a bunch of Albanians, I hope the cops catch them, or shoot them, whichever comes first. If this type of sh*t happened down here, we'd declare hunting season on these perps.

 

[Kobun]

Here are a few more pictures that has been released.

As you can see, there is a Ford Excursion and a Range Rover parked outside.
The figure in the circle is probably a permiter guard.

The left circle shows the SAAB they also used.
The guy on the roof is a spectator.

Look at THIS page, and click on SE VIDEO to watch a video of the survailance cameras.

 

[Mr-Heier]

Here is an update in this case. The police think they got all the suspect but they are not able to prove who shot the policeofficer.

Link to several articles from the case. (Norwegian)

http://www.vg.no/nyheter/spesial/nokas/?arkiv=ja

Videos:
http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=295028

Unique ammo was used.

http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=108566

The police thinks this is the killer.(totheright)

 

[El Tejon]

Thanks for the update.

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

Seems like an odd combination. .38 special revolver and 9mm subgun.

i talked to a guy who went to a SWAT school in Texas and his department issued him a revolver and a rope.

that was 10 years ago, in 1995.

***? in Texas too.....

 

[stavman]

Wow crazy post... I knew there was a town Norway with my last name... It crazy it got robbed.

 

[GunGoBoom]

And the police is supposed to "shoot for the legs" anyways.

Impressive crooks. Hope they are caught and hanged for the murder.

 

[rudolf]

Where did they get all that firepower from?

Here in Germany, a few years ago a bunch of German soldiers was in the woods training. They were held at gunpoint by two men and robbed of their rifles, which amounted to a dozen or so G3's. Just wonder what the commanding officer told his superiors afterwards what he's gonna do with those 'men'?

In the event of Germany letting you down in Iraq, you might consider whether you'ld want these guys at your side