NSA taking gun ownership records...

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I stopped reading kos early in 2004 after he shared this lovely bit of himself:

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2004/4/1/144156/3224#16
kos said:
That said, I feel nothing over the death of merceneries. They aren't in Iraq because of orders, or because they are there trying to help the people make Iraq a better place. They are there to wage war for profit. Screw them.

by kos on Thu Apr 01, 2004 at 12:08:56 PM PDT
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He wrote that in reference to the contractors who were working to rebuild Iraq being killed, burned, dragged through the streets, and hung up for public display.

It was one of those moments where you go, "He's not merely against the war, he is for the other side." And he finds satisfaction in the gruesome deaths of folks trying to turn Iraq into a better place.

What a putrecent soul he must have.
 
I sometimes enjoy DailyKos, it's fun to watch people rant and rave there, just like it's fun to watch the people at FreeRepublic froth at the mouth. I don't have much use for either as far as the truth goes. From my experience it's always somewhere in the middle. Hey, I'm a middle of the road guy, and a huge civil libertarian. I hate partisan politics. That said, I've bought exactly two guns from licensed dealers. I bought a Mossberg 500 from Wal-Mart in about 96 or so. I remember doing the paperwork, but I don't remember a background check. I then bought a Ruger Mini-14 at a gunshow about a month ago. They seemed to have to write down the model gun I was buying, and my UT Drivers License number, and did an instant background check (which from my previous experience, I didn't think was necessary for long guns.)

I work in IT, and it got me thinking about what they could do with that data. What does the dealer do with my signed paperwork after they're done with it? Are they supposed to keep it, or do they send it to the Govt? Obviously with my Driver's license number, they pretty much know all about me.
 
tellner said:
Could the NSA be going after NICS? If the Administration wanted it, certainly.
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The major purpose of the NSA is basically looking for needles in haystacks. They sift an enormous amount of information looking for a particular phone call to a particular person. Why would the NSA need access to a database that was already pre-sorted and in control of the FBI? It make absolutely no sense from an intelligence standpoint. Rather, it is exactly the kind of lie that is propagated by someone who doesn't know a thing about guns or the NSA but wants to stir up the pot.

State records? There's a little more possibility for leaks, but depending on the State there may well already be procedures in place for sharing information with the Feds in cases of national security - the exception that swallows every rule.
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Well, that would be easy enough to know since the legislation that creates the background check would also have to authorize sharing the confidential information and explain who it could be shared with. To my knowledge, not one state authorizes sharing that information with the Department of Defense (which is who NSA works for) or any of their subordinates; but if you have information to the contrary I would like to see it.

Frankly, I think anyone trying to justify "this guy on the internet says that a friend of his who has a friend who works at NSA says" as a source that is even remotely worthy of consideration needs to put down the big ol' pitcher of Kool-Aid no matter what partisan nonsense it may support.

Rugerlvr said:
I work in IT, and it got me thinking about what they could do with that data. What does the dealer do with my signed paperwork after they're done with it? Are they supposed to keep it, or do they send it to the Govt? Obviously with my Driver's license number, they pretty much know all about me.
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The information from the phone check is supposed to be purged within 24 hours, though I am skeptical that actually happens in a lot of cases (though it is against the law to keep it longer). The dealer keeps the paperwork for 20 years or until he stops doing business. At that time the records are forwarded to the BATFE. Here is a link with more info on the process:

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_registration.html
 
I can think of why a TLA, not necessarily the NSA, would want access to a pre-sorted database like NICS results. They are looking for connections. Signal intelligence doesn't mean much if it's not correlated with other information.

Who you're talking to? Useful.

Who you're talking to, plus where you travel plus the fact that you buy a lot of guns? Very useful.
 
Data Mining

Who you're talking to, plus where you travel plus the fact that you buy a lot of guns? Very useful.
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That's called Data Mining in the IT field. It's extremely useful. Unfortunately corporations are already doing this on you. That's why you get targetted junk mail. They know your patterns.

I don't want anyone, let alone the government mining data about me. However, I'm afraid it's a foregone conclusion. How long we can forestall them is the only issue I see.

I was talking to a colleague the other day, and he was saying how many of these things are simply a matter of someone in the IT department saying to some civil servant: "Did you know we can do this now?" And the overzealous CS says "Really? Oh well, get that started then."
 
It's like the slow-boiling frog. We let a little privacy get away because we didn't notice. Then a little more in the "War on Drugs". Then more because The Business Community wanted to Help Us. Then some more because it's required by the new vibrant Global Economy. Then more because, well, 9-11. Then because it Supports the Troops. Then because "if you aren't with us you're with the terrorists" and now just because they can.

Pastor Neimoller's famous quote is getting a little threadbare these days. But it's still just as valid as it was then.
 
I can think of why a TLA, not necessarily the NSA, would want access to a pre-sorted database like NICS results. They are looking for connections. Signal intelligence doesn't mean much if it's not correlated with other information.
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I'm not sure what you were referring to by TLA; but our anonymous Internet poster's friend of a friend doesn't work for them. He works for NSA.

The NSA doesn't have any enforcement arm. They just collect information and share it with other agencies as directed by the Executive. So if the NSA isn't going to act on the information, what is it going to do with it? Correlate the information and then report back to the same agency that already had the information to begin with? I realize that some look unfavorably upon the FBI; but I bet they are competent enough to be able to search their own databases based on information the NSA provides.

This is pure crap that is being disseminated for purely partisan political purposes.
 
I just heard from a friend who had a frightening story to tell. Turns out he has a friend who works for the NSA. Apparently, the NSA has been getting the records of gun buyers from the FBI. I guess the program works like this...
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Oh yes. The old, "my friend has a friend" story. Very believable.
 
Well his "friend of a friend of a friend" is just like the MSM who calls it an unnamed soarce etc. Who to believe huuuuuuuummmmmmmmmmmm.:rolleyes:
 
friend of a friend

I don't generally buy friend of a friend stories either.

On the other hand, it's a GOVERNMENT agancy. You have to presume guilt until innocence is proven beyond reasonable doubtt.
 
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