Old Brady Campaign slogan

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NavyLCDR

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"Never let a tragedy go to waste." As SAM1911 pointed out in the other thread, "The facts aren't even all in yet, and even when they're known, what in the world is the point of speculation? There's no strategy to be made that hasn't been in place and employed since Newtown, Aurora, etc., etc.

They're coming? They're ALWAYS coming. Keep up the fight, always."

Well, SAM1911, one fact is known. We must fight the Brady Campaign and others from day one, because the fact that we do know is they won't wait until the bodies are even cold before they will jump on it:

http://www.bradycampaign.org/?q=brady-campaign-mourns-victims-of-mass-shooting-at-navy-yard

In recent years we've experienced mass shootings in a supermarket parking lot, an army base, a movie theater, a temple, shopping malls, universities, high schools, elementary schools, and now a naval facility, and after every one the corporate gun lobby's friends in Congress obstructed the will of the American people and stood in the way of sensible solutions to gun violence. Americans deserve better than this.

While it is too early to know what policies might have prevented this latest tragedy, we do know that policies that present a real opportunity to save lives sit stalled in Congress, policies that could prevent many of the dozens of deaths that result every day from gun violence. As long as our leaders in Congress ignore the will of the people and do not listen to those voices, we will hold them accountable. We hope Congress will listen to the voice of the people and take up legislation that will create a safer America."

You can close this thread if you want to as well. Just know that the other side isn't waiting.
 
You know, as "secured" as the inner parts of a Navy shipyard are, one has to wonder just how this could have happened in such a location. I mean, they have rules against having guns there! Oh.... So maybe that really doesn't work so well.

It just kills me to see these people tripping over each other to call for policies to be implemented for the rest of the country when those policies were already in effect for the time and place of the disaster! It's even worse when they try to play it off as "This is what the people wanted all along and the powerful elites wouldn't let us have it." I'm never quite sure if I should be insulted for being called not a person or should feel complimented for being called a powerful elite. Either way, it makes me sad to see them dancing around excited to have fresh blood spilled that they think supports their cause, especially when it proves just the opposite.
 
One thing that I think needs to be said before this thread gets shut down is this: why do pro-gun people continue to think we are the minority? I always read, "Don't do this or that (like open carry) because it will upset the anti's and they will legislate away our right to do that." The Brady Campaign likes to scream that they are "the will of the American people ".

Well, in California, maybe. But most of the other states, no way. Look at the recall of the politicians in Colorado. It's time we stopped letting the anti-gun crowd be the more vocal minority and time for us to start being the more vocal majority. It's time we quit letting the Brady Campaign and their puppet groups be the only one's screaming their opinion from their soapboxes and time for us to get on our soapboxes and start screaming the facts equally as loud.

In a fairly recent city council meeting in February in Oak Harbor WA there was an issue regarding an illegal ordinance banning firearms in parks. When the pro-gun group finally started publicizing it as much as the anti-gun groups did there were 23:1 more pro-gun people attending than anti. There were over 200 pro-gun people and less than 10 anti-s. We have got to stop quietly letting the Brady Campaign scream about how they represent the majority of Americans, when they don't.
 
The Brady Campaign and all the other Antis have created marketing themes that they believe will get the best results for them. It used to be that WE were the problem. Then they discovered that WE didn't appreciate being accused of being equated to drug dealers, gang bangers, and psychos and, worse for them, WE were a pretty big group that average everyday folks could identify with and those folks didn't appreciate the implication that they weren't any better than the criminals and lunatics.

That theme didn't play well for them so they switched themes to the big bad power hungry power playing NRA, but that hasn't played as well either because WE are the NRA in more than just the slogan's terms. WE join and support the NRA and SAF and GOA and the numerous state organizations. WE identify with the NRA so by attacking the NRA they swell our ranks and hurt their cause.

The new theme is to follow the backlash against corporate greed and malfeasance and try to characterize the firearms and ammunition manufacturers as the ones manipulating Congress, who would otherwise enact every draconian restriction and ban the Antis want :rolleyes:. The Antis now want to cast themselves in the light of Erin Brokovich fighting to protect the health and lives of the little people being harmed by the ruthless gun makers. They think by not attacking US and focusing on the companies as willful participants in tragedy they can drive a wedge between US and the manufacturers and retailers and that the great middle won't identify with this focus of their attack as they did before.

The obvious illogic of their new front, and the fundamental sameness of their objective, shouldn't go missing to US and we shouldn't let it go missing for the majority of the public that do identify with US. Firearms manufacturers aren't polluting the environment and poisoning workers or the public by secretly dumping toxins into the shop and environment. They're producing a product that is then being bought by the public. That product, unless defective, causes no harm to the public or the environment. It is an item that does nothing except sit and take up space all on its own. It doesn't migrate through the air or water or soil. It doesn't dissolve or sublime to gas. Like a toaster or TV it just sits and takes up space until someone puts it to use. The vast majority, take that both ways, of Americans purchase and use firearms without any harm to anyone statistically. Occasionally some criminal lunatic takes a firearm and uses it to cause tragedy and ruin lives. This is still no different than it has ever been, a criminal lunatic tries to harm as many people as possible as a slave to their own demons. They're not a slave to the car they drove any more than the firearm they use. They're driven by something completely personal and unique to them that has nothing to do with US. Because the Antis can't completely pass up trying to find some way to exploit every tragedy they have to find a way to do it without offending the people that vote so they have to focus on a new "evil doer" that the public won't identify with and that's the manufacturers.

This idea of the Antis that they can focus on the manufacturer isn't even a new tactic. That's been tried before and the courts pointed out the item and the manufacturer and retailer aren't responsible for harm as long as the item isn't itself somehow defective. Regardless of this the Antis can't attack the gunowner without peril since there are so many more of US than before and there are so many people who don't own guns that know us as friends and neighbors they trust. They can't attack the NRA as easily as they did before. They WON'T attack the criminal and the basis of crime. That leaves the manufacturer and retailer to attack to maintain their relevance. Or more accurately, their slipping relevance.

They won't go away and they won't give up because they now have careers and house payments to make based off their chosen profession of trying to remove firearms from US. They may even believe in their ideology, but make no mistake there are politicians and pundits and lobbyists that are Antis as a profession that have a lot of skin in the game personally in the form of their careers and they can't ever walk away from the fertile field of exploiting every isolated firearms tragedy because no one wants them for anything else.

We know that there will be attempts to exploit this tragedy, but we need the facts of this case to be able to more effectively counter the rantings of the Antis. We don't know enough details for a detailed plan, so we have to use a well established approach.

We need to vigilant, but we don't need to go off half cocked. Keep your powder dry and stay alert and don't be shooting at shadows in the dark. Write to your Congresscritters expressing sympathy for the victims. Point to the secure nature of the facility and ask how security could have failed so catastrophically. Point out the other weapons are reported as coming from the security staff at the facility and that they should have been secured better. Direct the attention to the particular character of the facility and that the murderer took weapons from the security personnel to carry out the crime. We will see discussions of his mental condition and whether he had ever received treatment and for what.
 
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Everything they propose would not affect the hoods around me when I grew up but would affect the farmers, hunters, gun collectors I have known; apparently few media people read or comprehend their "sensible solutions", like making felonious contraband out of guns or accessories that have been legal and commonly used for decades and generations.

ADD: given the usual "news rush" I don't know how this will stand up, but I saw this this morning:

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...avy-yard-gathering-weapons-along-the-way?lite
Jim Miklaszewski, Pete Williams, Richard Esposito and Erin McClam, "Gunman kills at least 12 at Washington Navy Yard, gathering weapons along the way", NBC News, 16 Sep 2013.
The gunman was armed with an assault-style rifle, a shotgun and a handgun when he was killed, authorities said. But law enforcement officials told NBC News they believed he arrived packing only the shotgun, which he bought last week from a gun dealer in Lorton, Va., about 20 miles from Washington.
Supposedly video surveillance footage shows him kill a guard with the shotgun and take the guard's pistol and spare magazine, w/o an AR visible.
 
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Nothing new here, the Brady bunch and their ilk will never stop the attack on legally owned firearms and the law abiding people who own them. It has nothing to do with crime or criminals.

As hso pointed out, they have changed their strategy from time to time, but they will never quit.

Freedoms, your gun rights among them, are something you have to be vigilant about and always be ready to fight for, in the media, in courts of law, in the court of public opinion,.......
 
You'll notice they try to make their proposals for new laws before the facts are fully disclosed. That way it's not clear how useless their proposals are. That is why speed is of the essence for these guys - the facts work to their disadvantage. They use fear and confusion. They need fear and confusion.
 
That's another good talking point.

The Antis jump out ahead of the facts to exploit the fear and confusion potential of an incident so they can sell their same old snake oil. Having no useful solutions they apply their same useless ones to every incident whether they have any benefit or not. Their approach is the same as every charlatan hawking a magic potion that cures baldness, calms the nerves, improves moral fiber, and enhances prowess.
 
The root cause of all the recent incidents has been mental illness. When viewed in that light I ask why are they not calling for mental health reform?
 
I think another good point underlying the point Hso made is the antis are ultimately trying to divide and conquer. They understand that numerically, they are inferior. So they are doing whatever they can to drive a wedge between police and citizens or between hunters and recreational shooters.

If you look at their legislative attempts, they are less concerned about whether legislation is actually effective and more interested in how they can make this a game of "Let's you and him fight!" between groups that would normally support the Second Amendment. A lot of times we try to focus our efforts on outreach to others who aren't into guns - and that is helpful and necessary; but we need to spend time educating the low-information gun owners amongst us about the specifics of legislation and the problems in some of these proposals.
 
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