One possible explanation for irrational hoplophobia

[Deleted member 66305]

When I was a child, I would sometimes have disturbing visions; I would be playing with, or talking to, a friend, and would suddenly see a "mental movie" of me punching them, or I'd be near a long drop, and picture myself jumping off. These visions were NOT accompanied by any desire to follow through -- quite the opposite, I found them very unwelcome and disturbing, and would actively take steps to avoid what I saw in them -- I'd step back from the edge, or put more space between me and the other person, or take a break from playing with them altogether.

I found these images so upsetting, my parents took me to see a child psychologist. he questioned me about them, specifically, whether I had any intent to DO what I saw in the images (no), and how they made me feel (disgusted), and what I did when I saw them (avoid the situation). He said that since I already did not want to follow through, and I did find them unwelcome and disturbing, that I would only give them power over me by allowing them to influence my behavior in any way. I remember the words he used clearly; he said that by avoiding the situation, I was giving it a "will of its own". e.g. -- By stepping back from a drop, I was giving it an assumed will to pull me over. By putting down a pair of scissors I was using because I had a vision of stabbing somebody with them, I was giving them an assumed will to compel me to do it. By giving these inanimate objects an "assumed will of their own" to make me hurt myself or others, I could end up fearful of many things I shouldn't be.

He had a name for these kinds of visions, but I can't remember what it was. He said it was not uncommon, and it was the brain's way of playing through scenarios and telling me to be cautious. Anyway, I followed his advice, and refused to allow the vision to affect my behavior in any way. The visions became rarer and rarer. I still see them every once in a while, but it no longer troubles me; I just brush them off and proceed as normal, unless it DID indeed reveal a real risk I hadn't consciously considered.

One thing I have noticed in many conversations with anti-gun types, which they sometimes admit themselves, but more often I infer from other things they say, is that they fear the gun has a will of its own, and merely having one will make them do bad things. I often wonder if they, also, experienced visions like I did, but rather than ignoring them, consistently avoided the situation, causing them to grow the belief that the situation had a will of its own.

 

[Werewolf]

they fear the gun has a will of its own, and merely having one will make them do bad things

Just an excuse for being irrational and at their core evil bastards. Good people don't have thoughts like that.

 

[Claude Clay]

my take on them is that they do not trust how they would act with a gun [ eg;shooting someone over a parking place] they transfer that mind set to others.

simply put--as i think, so must others.

theirs is a simple world and why attendance at Disneyland remains strong

 

[GoWolfpack]

Good people don't have thoughts like that.

Bull

Good people have all kinds of thoughts. Good people don't do things like that.

 

[CypherNinja]

I get stuff like that. I always just chalked it up to my brain quantifying dangers and the like.
Using the cliff example, I'd see a vision of me falling or jumping off, and the results, inducing me to say to myself: "<Lumbergh>Yeeeeeeahhh........</Lumbergh> that's why I'm going to be careful near the edge of this cliff."

When I bought my first gun I got a bunch of them about safe/unsafe handling and the 4 rules. First time at range, more 4 rules visions. First time carry etc........

At this point most of the "gun visions" are played out, except when I get new action types and the like. (I expect more when I finally get a pump shotty for example)

I have them about machinery (ever seen what lathe can do to someone? PM me if you want to see some gross linkage), cars, knives, chemicals, anything dangerous. It's just my Id telling me it would suck to not be careful, no harm no foul.

 

[Deleted member 66305]

Just an excuse for being irrational and at their core evil bastards. Good people don't have thoughts like that.

It may feel good to dehumanise your opponent, but it really doesn't help you to overcome him, especially if the main weapon in your arsenal is education.

 

[gym]

It sounds like they are afraid that "they" would not be able to control themselves, "or at least think that", so it then gets passed on to you, or, us, as a pro gun community. Possibly some interesting deep seeded psychological findings in your observation. The lack of one’s control gets passed on to others, based on their fear of losing control of themselves. It may go back to their feelings of inadequacy and general control issues.

 

[rogertc1]

Not really gun related is it?

 

[Legionnaire]

Not to cause thread drift, but "visioning" can be a good thing. Ever read The Defense of Duffer's Drift?

 

[Deleted member 66305]

Not really gun related is it?

Trying to understand how anti-gun attitudes originate is not gun-related?

 

[mustang_steve]

Thoughts are not evil, performing evil actions is evil. Evil thoughts are just temptation or a warning, depending on how you feel about it.

Either way, fear of what you would do to another is not all that uncommon. The problem is most people never learn to cope with it. Learning to trust yourself is the most important thing a person can ever do....after all, if you can't trust yourself to do the right thing, who the hell can you trust?

My roomate is seeing an anti, and we convinced her to hold my blackpowder revolver once...you can tell just holding it makes her uncomfortable. I think it's their complete discomfort with the idea of a firearm that makes it so. She was utterly terrified of the trigger, despite having proof that it was unloaded, and the hammer was not cocked back.

Yesterday, I got her to hold a drill though, and she held that thing with confidence. Ironic since one can consider a handgun a "remote drill".

Honestly, it IS that they are scared of guns.....they see the idea of an armed world terrifying. Why they place so much fear into an inanimate object I have no idea....i just wish to remove such phobias.

 

[Deleted member 66305]

It sounds like they are afraid that "they" would not be able to control themselves, "or at least think that", so it then gets passed on to you, or, us, as a pro gun community. Possibly some interesting deep seeded psychological findings in your observation. The lack of one’s control gets passed on to others, based on their fear of losing control of themselves. It may go back to their feelings of inadequacy and general control issues.

If you think about it, the majority of gun control laws seem to be predicated on the belief that mere proximity to weapons will turn an otherwise careful, peaceful, and law-abiding person into a foolish, violent criminal, and that lack of access to weapons will turn the violent, criminal and foolish into upstanding citizens.

 

[Deleted member 66305]

Thoughts are not evil, performing evil actions is evil. Evil thoughts are just temptation or a warning, depending on how you feel about it.

Either way, fear of what you would do to another is not all that uncommon. The problem is most people never learn to cope with it. Learning to trust yourself is the most important thing a person can ever do....after all, if you can't trust yourself to do the right thing, who the hell can you trust?

I have heard "I just wouldn't trust myself..." out of the mouths of many anti-gun folks. I'm sure it's not 100% correlation, and I've certainly never done any statistically rigorous survey, but I would hazard a guess that a lot of them don't trust themselves, for whatever reason, and therefore, can't trust others, either.

 

[ArfinGreebly]

Lack of Control

To be fair, I do know a guy who confesses that he, personally, won't own a gun, because he's afraid he would "use it." He's afraid his temper would take over. I've known the guy a long time. In more than twenty years nothing in his behavior or demeanor suggests he would act out through violence. I don't press him on it, but his "confession" doesn't fly.

On the other hand, I've known people who were apprehensive about firearms for two primary reasons: 1) they were immersed in a cultural tar pit regarding weapons, and firearms in particular, and 2) they had no experience with the machinery.

I've trained people to drive who were apprehensive about cars, having never operated the machinery. I've trained people to use computers, again, apprehensive because they had no experience with the machinery.

It is common -- even expected -- for people to be apprehensive about machinery they've never used, never touched, and about which all they hear is bad news.

Those people I've taken to the gun range and walked them through the introduction, basic safety, and then put them in control of the machinery have seen their apprehensions dissolve in a matter of minutes.

There have been those who don't even want to try, but their fear is something different: the fear of being wrong about a deeply held belief. Nothing to do with the gun itself. Their "identity" had become so fused with their "belief subscription" package, that taking part in any activity that threatened to invalidate that package, especially a cornerstone belief in it, was simply rejected out of hand. In those cases, you have to find a way to separate the person from the belief subscription, and allow him to examine it from the outside, without risking "who he is." Seriously. There are people who have decided "that's who I am" about a belief, and questioning the belief "threatens" who they "are."

In all cases, though, I have found that being allowed to be in control of the machinery just blows through the mystery and apprehension.

When that happens, fear becomes fun.

Take them shooting. It works.

 

[waldonbuddy]

If I remember my college psychology class, according to Sigmund F. the part of you brain that is impulsive is called the "id".
According to Dr. Freud, the psychic was made up of three parts called the, "parent", "adult", and child.
There was a book about this called, "I'm Ok Your Ok".

The id is responsible for all of the random illogical thoughts that seem to run through your thoughts at any given time. Its normal.

 

[USAFNoDAk]

Do these same liberals, who believe that having a gun would make them do something they might regret, also believe that buying a Playboy or Penthouse magazine will cause them to rape or sexually assault their neighbor lady or some other female whom they happen upon? It's such a silly take on life, but it does indeed exist. I don't know if I'll ever understand it, even though I can acknowledge its existence.

 

[Werewolf]

Good people don't have thoughts like that.

Bull

Good people have all kinds of thoughts. Good people don't do things like that.

If one has evil thoughts can one be at their core truly good? If one has evil thoughts and doesn't act upon them perhaps it is not because they are good but more that they are afraid of the consequences or the benefit to themselves is not worth the potential cost.

Or maybe all men have evil thoughts at one time or another and we're all inherently evil. Perhaps...

Good and evil. We could go on for hours and hours about what it is.

 

[Deleted member 66305]

Do these same liberals, who believe that having a gun would make them do something they might regret, also believe that buying a Playboy or Penthouse magazine will cause them to rape or sexually assault their neighbor lady or some other female whom they happen upon? It's such a silly take on life, but it does indeed exist. I don't know if I'll ever understand it, even though I can acknowledge its existence.

There is evidence that addiction to pornography can lower your sensitivity to sexual violence.

I find that idea, frankly, less improbable than the idea that mere proximity to a weapon will turn you evil.

 

[Deleted member 66305]

If one has evil thoughts can one be at their core truly good? If one has evil thoughts and doesn't act upon them perhaps it is not because they are good but more that they are afraid of the consequences or the benefit to themselves is not worth the potential cost.

I bet there were days Gandhi really wanted to pimp-slap a Brit just for being a Brit.

I don't believe one truly has full control over what thoughts flit into one's mind -- all one can control is one's actions/reactions.