Arsenal? Hardly, gun experts say
Scott Segal
Dennis Wagner
The Arizona Republic
Jan. 18, 2003 12:00 AM
A Queen Creek munitions stash that federal agents touted Thursday as a potent military arsenal is nothing but a big dud, according to a defense attorney in the case and several experts on military firepower.
"That's not a cache of weapons," said Louis Aloise, a Boston attorney representing suspect Scott Segal. "It's a gun collection. The vast majority are not even functional."
Agents of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms seized the military equipment Thursday after Segal, who faces federal charges in Massachusetts, told them about it. At the time, they indicated that while some of the guns and explosives were inoperable, many of the 200 rocket launchers, grenades, flamethrowers and rifles appeared to be in working order.
Although the ATF stressed that there was no terrorist link to Segal or his weapons, the story captured nationwide media attention.
Aloise said his 40-year-old client, who has a prior conviction involving firearms violations, was painted as a nefarious arms merchant. In fact, he claimed, Segal is a victim of misunderstanding about his hobby of military collectibles.
A number of firearms aficionados agreed, pointing out that most of the seized weapons are clearly inert or inoperable - useful as wall ornaments, not killing devices.
Much of the gear dates to the Vietnam War or World War II. Aloise noted that the hand grenades have holes bored into them, rendering them inoperable. Rockets and some other munitions are painted powder blue, an indication that they are non-volatile training weapons. Bazooka barrels have been cut so they will not fire. Some of the rifles are antiques that date to the 1890s.
"It was portrayed as a cache of weapons for some sinister motive," Aloise said. "That's just not true. . . . My client has been a gun collector for 26 years, like his father and his grandfather before that."
ATF Special Agent Tom Mangan conceded Friday that some of the equipment is inoperable or non-explosive. However, he said, those items could be repaired. And other weapons, including machine guns, are fully functional, he said.
"We're not here to snooker anybody," Mangan said. " . . . Further examination has to be made (of the firearms and ammunition)."
Segal was convicted on a federal weapons charge in Arizona 10 years ago and agreed to give up a gun and suppressor as part of a plea bargain. Aloise said agents never picked up the weapon, so Segal kept it.
Last year, Aloise said, the ATF obtained records showing that Segal bought an Uzi-type submachine gun over the Internet. Aloise said his client believed the gun was non-functional and therefore legal.
When ATF investigators went to Segal's home near Boston, they discovered the weapon from his prior conviction as well as the Uzi. Faced with new charges, Segal cooperated with the ATF, telling agents about the storage locker in Arizona.
Investigators here said they expected to find only a few guns Thursday, not a munitions bunker. But collectors who viewed photographs of the weapons criticized the ATF and media for inciting public fear with misleading accounts of the firepower.
"It's a pile of really neat crap," said Steve Herod of Texas, who identified himself as a longtime firearms dealer. "You probably could hurt somebody worse with some of this stuff by dropping it on them."
Herod said nearly all of the weaponry appears to be non-functional, the kind of novelty hardware available at gun shows or over the Internet. Empty hand grenades are often marketed as gag gifts. Inoperable bazookas are known as "wall hangers" because that is how they are often displayed.
No criminal charges have been lodged in connection with the Arizona seizure, and U.S. Attorney Paul Charlton declined to comment.
Reach the reporter at dennis [email protected] or (602) 444-8874.
Scott Segal
Dennis Wagner
The Arizona Republic
Jan. 18, 2003 12:00 AM
A Queen Creek munitions stash that federal agents touted Thursday as a potent military arsenal is nothing but a big dud, according to a defense attorney in the case and several experts on military firepower.
"That's not a cache of weapons," said Louis Aloise, a Boston attorney representing suspect Scott Segal. "It's a gun collection. The vast majority are not even functional."
Agents of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms seized the military equipment Thursday after Segal, who faces federal charges in Massachusetts, told them about it. At the time, they indicated that while some of the guns and explosives were inoperable, many of the 200 rocket launchers, grenades, flamethrowers and rifles appeared to be in working order.
Although the ATF stressed that there was no terrorist link to Segal or his weapons, the story captured nationwide media attention.
Aloise said his 40-year-old client, who has a prior conviction involving firearms violations, was painted as a nefarious arms merchant. In fact, he claimed, Segal is a victim of misunderstanding about his hobby of military collectibles.
A number of firearms aficionados agreed, pointing out that most of the seized weapons are clearly inert or inoperable - useful as wall ornaments, not killing devices.
Much of the gear dates to the Vietnam War or World War II. Aloise noted that the hand grenades have holes bored into them, rendering them inoperable. Rockets and some other munitions are painted powder blue, an indication that they are non-volatile training weapons. Bazooka barrels have been cut so they will not fire. Some of the rifles are antiques that date to the 1890s.
"It was portrayed as a cache of weapons for some sinister motive," Aloise said. "That's just not true. . . . My client has been a gun collector for 26 years, like his father and his grandfather before that."
ATF Special Agent Tom Mangan conceded Friday that some of the equipment is inoperable or non-explosive. However, he said, those items could be repaired. And other weapons, including machine guns, are fully functional, he said.
"We're not here to snooker anybody," Mangan said. " . . . Further examination has to be made (of the firearms and ammunition)."
Segal was convicted on a federal weapons charge in Arizona 10 years ago and agreed to give up a gun and suppressor as part of a plea bargain. Aloise said agents never picked up the weapon, so Segal kept it.
Last year, Aloise said, the ATF obtained records showing that Segal bought an Uzi-type submachine gun over the Internet. Aloise said his client believed the gun was non-functional and therefore legal.
When ATF investigators went to Segal's home near Boston, they discovered the weapon from his prior conviction as well as the Uzi. Faced with new charges, Segal cooperated with the ATF, telling agents about the storage locker in Arizona.
Investigators here said they expected to find only a few guns Thursday, not a munitions bunker. But collectors who viewed photographs of the weapons criticized the ATF and media for inciting public fear with misleading accounts of the firepower.
"It's a pile of really neat crap," said Steve Herod of Texas, who identified himself as a longtime firearms dealer. "You probably could hurt somebody worse with some of this stuff by dropping it on them."
Herod said nearly all of the weaponry appears to be non-functional, the kind of novelty hardware available at gun shows or over the Internet. Empty hand grenades are often marketed as gag gifts. Inoperable bazookas are known as "wall hangers" because that is how they are often displayed.
No criminal charges have been lodged in connection with the Arizona seizure, and U.S. Attorney Paul Charlton declined to comment.
Reach the reporter at dennis [email protected] or (602) 444-8874.
