Open letter to the THR community...

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Mexicans seem to want to stay Mexicans--in the U.S. Or tell me that the Mexican flags and Aztlan propaganda and statements by La Raza mean nothing.

They mean about as much as burning crosses and KKK outfits. I am a little skeptical of the proposition that Mexicans risk life and limb crossing the desert on foot because they want this country to be just like the one they fled. There hasn't been a culture yet that has successfully resisted assimilating into American culture. People come here precisely because this is the culture they want to live in.

 

[longeyes]

I am a little skeptical of the proposition that Mexicans risk life and limb crossing the desert on foot because they want this country to be just like the one they fled.

Has it occurred to you that poor, uneducated people just do what they know, that maybe they are not making the best choices for themselves? Now that wouldn't be a surprising pattern, would it?

There hasn't been a culture that has resisted assimilation? That might have been true before welfare and multiculturalism, not any longer. I think those old positivist assumptions are out of date.

When was the last time you saw half a million KKK or Nazis out in force, waving their colors?

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

There hasn't been a culture that has resisted assimilation? That might have been true before welfare and multiculturalism, not any longer. I think those old positivist assumptions are out of date.

So you believe that people are leaving homes where they are just fine with the culture to come here - and that once they come here and enjoy one of the highest standards of living and freedoms in the world, they still want to change the culture to be like the one they left?

When was the last time you saw half a million KKK or Nazis out in force, waving their colors?

1940s if we are going by the actual term. 1960s at least if we are just going by the shared beliefs. Of course, I also find it difficult to believe that any group of 500,000 people has a lot of beliefs in common. Just because I am marching in a big group of people and someone in that same group is carrying a stupid billboard, it doesn't mean I support or share that specific belief.

 

[longeyes]

assimilation

Assimilation means more than speaking English and not being a felon and paying taxes. It means embracing the core values of the American Republic. If we are not able to ensure that the next fifty million Mexicans who come to the U.S. are in philosophical congruence with The Rest of Us we are asking for civil war, the loss of what we have known as America, or both.

 

[macavada]

I'm sick of "Americans" crying about assimilation. Just because you don't have the patience for them to complete their journey from immigrant (illegal or otherwise) to American (which can take two to three generations) doesn't mean they're not assimilating. If you're just dissatisfied because they're moving in to your neighborhoods, well tough. Who cares if they assimilate anyway. They can live in this country and speak their native tongue for fifty years, for all I care.

How fast do you need them to assimilate? Seems like the next new excuse for not allowing foreigners. Do they need to take a test in six months? three months? Do they need to have taken ingles sin barreras before they even step foot?

 

[gc70]

Hey, J6, I'll trade you for your two hard-working Mexicans.

We're renovating some of our offices and on Friday I took one of my team leaders to check progress on her office. The office door was closed and I was surprised to find a Mexican (no habla) worker staring out the window (no biggie - it might have been his siesta time). As my team leader and I looked around, there was movement under the plastic cover over her desk; yep, there was another worker under there. I don't know whether the guy under the desk was also on siesta or just had a thing for huffing womens' shoes, but I'm ready for some trade-ins.

 

[Jammer Six]

Assimilation means more than speaking English and not being a felon and paying taxes. It means embracing the core values of the American Republic.

Well, that's what it means to you, anyway.

 

[MadMag]

For me, I am not to worried about assimilation.

I just want illegal aliens to pay taxes and stop taking free rides on our welfare system.....seems fair to me.

 

[CAnnoneer]

what passes for "education" in America today is mental masturbation, just make-work for overpriced academics. This country has too many MBAs and too many lawyers and too many "marketing" people. Just my opinion.

That is a direct result of a culture of bottom-line and instant gratification, combined with Hollywood values, and the idea that you must go to college even if all you get is a worthless pointless irrelevant degree.

To train a decent scientist or engineer, you must have him work hard for maybe 20 years. It is difficult and it requires a lot of hard analytical thinking and mental discipline. In comparison, you can churn out a reject in the soft descriptive "sciences" such as sociology, political "science", psychology etc. a dime a dozen. All you get is more socialists and communists who happily buy into the "it's the capitalist racist white man's fault" when they can't get a cushy job to support them and their feeling of superiority just because they "went to college".

When was the last time you bought yourself a product of sociology or psychology that you could eat, wear, or drive?

 

[CAnnoneer]

So you believe that people are leaving homes where they are just fine with the culture to come here - and that once they come here and enjoy one of the highest standards of living and freedoms in the world, they still want to change the culture to be like the one they left?

Therein the error. What they want is their native culture in combination with American prosperity. What they do not understand is that culture and prosperity often go hand-in-hand.

What is different with the new wave wrt older waves, such as Polish, German, Russian, Irish, and Italian, are that in the respective periods past, there was no socialist multiculturalism to tell them that it is not only okay not to adopt the American ways, but that in fact it is preferable and that in doing so they become entitled to special treatment. Older waves were also not told that breaking the law was okay.

Our homegrown leftists are just as much to blame as the cheap-labor corporatist stooges in WashDC. They all play their destructive roles only too well.

 

[longeyes]

We'll see how much American prosperity the "new wave" obtains if they don't acquire high-level white collar skills or succeed in getting significant wage hikes for blue-collar labor. Right now, as illegal immigrants, they're not doing either, just getting by, for the most part, taking what they can get plus whatever welfare benefits they can scrounge via their dependents. Of course, if they accomplish either of those goals we'll need still more illegals "to do the jobs Americans won't do."

From what I heard being said by illegals during the demonstrations--"what difference does it make if we're legal or illegal?"--I think, yeah, we have plenty to worry about regarding their grasp of American values. Where they come from, The Law is a joke and la mordida is the rule. Here it's different--so far.

 

[R.H. Lee]

They can live in this country and speak their native tongue for fifty years, for all I care.

Well, sure, if that's all it amounted to. But it isn't. Nearly all governments, and more and more businesses are throwing up the language barrier 'para assistencia en espanol ponge numero nueve.......'
Even ATM and debit card machines ask if you want English or Espanol (why.....does it need to convert currency if I pay in pesos?.........)

A common language (and culture) is (was) one of the great strengths of this country. Multilingualism is divisive. We get weaker every time an illegal immigrant jumps the border.

 

[CAnnoneer]

It is amazing to me that people do not see the stark differences with previous waves. To complement RHLee's statement, observe that never before did the government require bilingual education and administrative services in the language of the newest wave of immigration. Do you see these things required in Polish, Irish, German, Russian, or Italian? Anyway you look at it, it is cheap pandering to the latino votes and another form of new entitlement. It makes them believe they are special and deserving of special treatment and arrangements. That builds up expectations and desires for even more giveaways and privileges. These recent demonstrations only show the level of divestment and division.

 

[RealGun]

My sister-in-law teaches high school Spanish, and her oldest daughter, my niece, is a bilingual bank manager. On a regular basis, the police call the school and arrange for my sister-in-law to serve as translator for some perp or domestic problem. See the dilemma? Someone in this country should be expected to learn the language to some level ASAP. Staying in cultural ghettos primarily for sake of language or being allowed to join a work crew only if able to speak Spanish like the rest of the crew is an aberration.

 

[wingman]

[QUOTEIt is amazing to me that people do not see the stark differences with previous waves.][/QUOTE]

In my small part of the world there is a huge change in illegal behavior in just
the past 20 years, more prone to violence. Doubt that talk with grunt level
police in south texas.

 

[TX35]

Google MS-13... Nooooooo, they're here to just work for a better life!!!! Whatever....

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

What they do not understand is that culture and prosperity often go hand-in-hand.

Frankly not many native born Americans have a good grasp on that concept either. I'd gladly trade some native born Americans for some of the immigrants I've met. At least the immigrants I've met appeciate the difference in culture and why it contributes to America's greatness (and they still have that quaint and once common notion that America is a great place to be instead of being the root of all evil in the modern world).

 

[Thin Black Line]

So you believe that people are leaving homes where they are just fine with the culture to come here - and that once they come here and enjoy one of the highest standards of living and freedoms in the world, they still want to change the culture to be like the one they left?

Some do, some don't. Some want to do something entirely different.

I'd say the people in the presentation below DO want to change our
culture because they have absolutely no respect for it and see American
culture as something inherently evil from the start:


http://www.wehategringos.com/index2.shtml


As a veteran, I understand I fought for "freedom of speech" for AMERICANS
but this kind of cr@p is akin to letting the nazis, communists, or Al-Q into
the USA on a free pass during a time of war. These people completely
refuse to assimilate and their attitudes are the antithesis of everything I
hold dear and risked my life defending.

I'll go a step further and state here that an "american" who knowingly hires
illegal aliens in order to save a buck is hurting his fellow citizens, undercuts
domestic businesses that FOLLOW THE RULES, and indirectly contributes
to the fifth column globalist traitors who are attempting to subvert this fine
country.

 

[CAnnoneer]

I'll go a step further and state here that an "american" who knowingly hires illegal aliens in order to save a buck is hurting his fellow citizens, undercuts domestic businesses that FOLLOW THE RULES, and indirectly contributes to the fifth column globalist traitors who are attempting to subvert this fine country.

Precisely.

 

[Art Eatman]

I note in passing that there are two legal immigrants involved with THR who are stronger about the Bill of Rights than a high percentage of the native born. Holds true for many posters here and at TFL who claim legal immigrant status.

As near as i can tell, it t akes about three generations before it could truly be called "assimilation". It seems to me that with the general changes in our society, the culture into which they assimilate will be far different than what existed merely twenty years back...

I'd say we get stronger with legal immigrants, given the history of "brain drain" INTO the U.S. Since it's fact that there is a net tax burden on society due to illegals, it is inescapable fact that they weaken us.

Art

 

[Jammer Six]

Since it's fact that there is a net tax burden on society due to illegals, it is inescapable fact that they weaken us.

A businessman who only reads one side of the ledger is doomed to fail.

That is only one side of the ledger, by definition.

You don't know how many illegal immigrants pay taxes, and neither does anyone else. Therefore, whether the net is a gain or a loss can't be measured.

My checking account always looks great before I add the checks.

You don't know, because no one does, how many deposits they've made.

Furthermore, their contribution is beyond measurement- all human beings bring more to the table than can be measured.

Those sons and daughters everyone here is so afraid of contain the same potential that every American does, and has the same chance of achieving that potential. And they will be legal, native born, full-fledged American citizens, from their first breath. Just like you.

Another, subtle contribution, that I'm stunned no one here picked up on, is that there's now an American foreman and an American journeyman out there who lost their jobs.

Will they figure that out? Will one, perhaps, choose to stay awake on his next dispatch? Will the other consider putting out, even though it's cold?

They have a chance to learn, to improve. If they do, the competition will have made them stronger.

We get stronger every time an immigrant crosses the border. In so many ways.

 

[Waitone]

****Poof****

 

[Jammer Six]

Beans for lunch?

 

[Trip20]

We get stronger every time an immigrant crosses the border. In so many ways.

Take off those shades. You still spouting this tired old line?

Maybe you wouldn't mind detailing for us how we grow stronger in "so many ways."

Lets hear each "way", and a detailed description of it's benefit. And steer clear of the cheap labor racket. That's old news as well.

 

[haole_boySS]

As near as i can tell, it t akes about three generations before it could truly be called "assimilation". It seems to me that with the general changes in our society, the culture into which they assimilate will be far different than what existed merely twenty years back...

I might have missed that someone else already posted something similar cause I kinda skimmed thru the 6 pages.....

Why does it take 3 yrs to learn our language? The language in which our Constitution and Bill of rights was written. I personally think that is the issue that most native born americans have. I just want people that I have to interact with, on a daily, in MY OWN country to speak my language. I don't think that is too much to ask, and it doesn't take 3 yrs to learn english.

I guess I base my opinion (thats all it is, just an opinion) on other countries tolerating english speaking Americans doing the same in there country. Would Mexico or any other country south of them (that doesnt have a US military presence) allow us to cross their borders, live in their system illegally, set up camp and build a little America? Where we refuse to speak the language, refuse to accept the culture, etc etc?? Would any non english speaking European country tolerate it? Any Asian country?

I dont think they would. Again, that is just MY opinion. I believe that a wave of Americans doing this same thing in another country would be forced to assimilate to survive. I dont believe they would twist and bend to accomadate us.

jmho

Andy