Pedesoli Flintlock Rifles...

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sooter76

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So I'm considering picking up a flintlock Pennsylvania Longrifle and am currently looking at the Pedesoli offering. As I have zero experience with blackpowder guns outside of the modern inline rifles I'm looking for some educated opinions... Thanks in a advance.
 
Pedersoli makes a nice product. Fit and finish is generally very good. Specifically regarding their flintlocks you sometimes hear two complaints. One is that sometimes the frizzens aren't really hard enough (= low or no sparks). This is a fixable problem. The other is that they have an overpowered spring that tends to add to reliability but means that they can eat flints.

I have two Pedersoli flintlocks and like them both, and I also have one of their percussion guns and it's very nice as well.
 
Are you looking for information on functionability, appearance from a historic stand point, or both?

There are really four to look at. The "Alamo" and the "Kentucky" are both too short, in my opinion, for large caliber flintlock rifles in the "longrifle" category. They do offer them in .32 and if you are looking for a small game rifle, I'd opt for either one of those. (There are a pair that are even smaller than the Alamo and Kentucky, and I'd avoid those altogether.)

That leaves the "Pennsylvania" and the "Frontier". The Pennsylvania will work well, and the barrel length is good, but the largest caliber that you will find it in is .45. Plus it has a small lock, and the smaller version of the Pedersoli flint lock can sometimes give the shooter problems.

The Frontier would be my choice (aka the Cabela's Blue Ridge Hunter)... the barrel length is 39" and it comes in .54, with a 1:65 twist barrel, so will shoot heavy loads of roundball quite well. The lock is robust, and functions very well. Don't look for a "longrifle" that will both shoot conicals and round ball. Shoot the round ball, and if you want to shoot conicals, then get a plains rifle or a caplock CW era rifle.

The only problems with all of them is that Pedersoli tends to use a patent-breech design... and you have to be sure to take a little extra time to keep the breech clean. The rifling in the barrels on the Frontier model can be very sharp from the factory, and cut patches, but this problem can be simply corrected too.

NONE of the Pedersoli "longrifles" match anything in history. The frontier has a case hardened lock, a buckhorn rear sight, the stock isn't correct in shape, and ramrod thimbles that double as washers to retain the barrel. Still for under $700 it's a very functional, good looking rifle, and you won't be turned away from any historic events if you are carrying it. It will slay deer and some larger animals too, with a .530 patched, round ball.

LD
 
All of the above... Truth is I don't have a lot of experience with muzzle loaders, even of the in line variety. What I'm really looking for is a decent quality flintlock that is kind of historically accurate that i can use for hunting and shooting. Beyond that I'm essentially looking for a rifle I can take apart and learn how they go together with an eye towards eventually building a more accurate and quality one myself farther down the line.
 
Pedersoli's Frontier is a good choice, as is Lyman's Great Plains Rifle. Both are excellent guns, and both are 'kind of' historically accurate. Neither requires a course in gunsmithing to maintain them. The GPR is a little less expensive.
 
So following onto this, being in the position myself to want to move to flinters, what would you pick if:

You wanted a reliable rifle

Of original historic design

Of high quality, without being bespoke custom quality

And you were not interested in anything with markings "for use with black powder only" on the side, or from the rack at Cabelas. Lyman? ... no. Or TC or any of that quality line.



Bottom line:

Not unlimited budget

but

at the same time you were not "overly" price sensitive.



Ideas?


Willie

.
 
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There are used flintlocks available in the $300-400 range on various forums. A CVA may come up for a little less. I would advise staying away from Traditions' models. A good used custom flintlock with a Siler lock and a good barrel can sometimes be had for $600-850. Just browse around and be patient. Strike when the opportunity arrives. Pedersolis have a good reputation generally but quality control is sometimes a problem.

Above all, read and research as much as you can about rocklocks.
 
I would check the classifieds at the Traditional Muzzleloading Forum because All of the factory rifles out there have barrel markings from the modern world, and none are close copies of original rifles... though the Lyman GPR is the closest out there, but it's not a longrifle, it's a plains rifle of the 19th century.

I would also check the used rifles at Track of The Wolf.

And I would check Armslist, and use the word "flint" in the search engine. Sometimes you can find a good bargain on Armslist as the seller doesn't know what price to ask and you spot it quickly...as bargains get snapped up fast.

On Gunbroker, you can find some flinters, but in the 18th century rifles and muskets, usually the sellers are living in a world of fairies and dragons they are so overpriced. For example there are two full sized Brown Bess muskets, used, being offered, one is more than $900 and the other is over $1000... when in kit form they normally go for $900 and thus carry the warranty. One fellow wanted $1250 last month for his used Japanese made bess repro... for that much you can get an Italian made one brand new.... as I said, the world of fairies and dragons....

You are probably looking at $800-$1200 in a used longrifle that meets your criteria. Under $800 are sometimes found, but it's rare. I wouldn't pass up a good, used, Dixie Gun Works, Tennessee Rifle if it was in .45 or .50 and priced at $700 or less. The modern markings on the barrel can be polished off, and the barrel re-browned. Sure, it's also an early 19th century style, but you wouldn't get too much flack for it at a Rev War event.

LD
 
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I don't own a flintlock because my first one, Pedersoli, was a POS. Never got it to function reliably. Sold it and glad.
 
I've been living in Michigan the past couple of years and bought a GPR .50 percussion to hunt the black powder deer season here. Bought .50 caliber moulds and have gotten a lot of pleasure out of that rifle. Now my job is transferring me to Pennsylvania where the black powder season is flintlock only as best as i can tell. Now I am forced to buy another ML and I've settled on the Pedersoli Frontier rifle. I'll get in it .50 since I already have the moulds. I am just soooo bummed at the prospect of having to get yet another muzzleloader. Life is so unfair.
 
In the $2K range I'd just keep an eye on the track of the wolf page and wait for something that tickled my fancy. A lot of those guns aren't used, they're guns made on spec by custom builders. Like if somebody wants to try something out they'll just build it and list it on track of the wolf rather than deal with selling something that's already built when they're not really set up for that on their own website. I know Gary White does that as an example. His more ornate pieces are out of your price range but the simpler ones aren't.
 
The Pedersoli is a good starter as is the Lyman Great Plains Rifle (my own preference).
However, the frizzen spring just isn't right on the former. That upper bend in it is plain wrong.

Why not have a custom gunmaker make one for you? There's no shortage of folks who can build the gun you want.
 
For $2K? I'd watch Gunbroker...or try a custom builder. Larry Gardner does excellent work. If you don't get too fancy with the decorations ("Poor boy" rifle), you can get precisely what you want.

Or if you're good with woodworking, get a kit. My father built some superb rifles from kits from Dunlap Woodcrafts.
 
Here you go Will: :)

http://www.natemckenzie.com/gun-galleries/southern-rifles/

http://www.natemckenzie.com/gun-galleries/bucks-county-rifles/

I had one of his used custom built rifles that I bought from TOW. It was, in a few words, unbelievable quality.

In my opinion, I like his Southern Mountain rifles more that his Pennsylvania or Virginian rifles. But I think he also has the Pennsylvania Upper Susquehanna rifle, a school that a lot of custom builders ignore, down pat.

That's all anybody wants to build, Lancasters and Lehighs, Lancasters and Lehigh's!!! Nobody wants to build nothing else but Lancasters and Lehighs :banghead:

http://www.allenmartinrifles.net/gallery-of-guns/schimmel-rifle-lehigh-valley/
http://www.allenmartinrifles.net/gallery-of-guns/herman-rupp-rifle-lehigh-valley/
http://www.allenmartinrifles.net/gallery-of-guns/pre-revolutionary-war-lancaster-rifle/

But I love them also. :)
 
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I have both the .45 rocklock and a .50 cap lock from Pedersoli. I'm guessing the rocklock was originally purchased from Cabelas as the Frontier.
Love them both, but after about 700 rounds out of the rocklock, I ended up with a borked stirrup. After pricing replacement parts, I opted to get a new R&L lock (RPL #6). very minor fitting. Very good lock. Now both are at the top of the list of my favorite rifles....
 
I just picked up a Pedersoli Kentucky flintlock on Thursday tried it on the range yesterday.
I'm in the UK so .45 smooth bore and only aloud to put shot in it.
Really enjoyed shooting it feels sturdy and Fitted me well.
The down sides are really just the lock area.
The trigger pull on it is more of a yank, the vent is too small, the pan wont shut on half cock and the vent is too close to the bottom of the pan.
Seems like a lot but a 1 mm drill in the vent sorted that problem
I have seen some people dremmel out the pan....doing that today!
the other 2 problems I cant fix so i'll scratch my head awhile and thinK before I figure it out! (only payed £150) :) Cant go wrong!
 
Sorry not the best at spelling, you can have Bp rifles with the right Licence
I only have a smooth bore licence so shotguns are all I can use!
Shooting over the range yesterday as a Blast though, best fun in ages.
 
I'd just keep an eye on the track of the wolf page and wait for something that tickled my fancy.
Click to expand...

Word of Warning....

(imho) The rifles offered on Track are not vetted...probably as they are on consignment. Meaning they may be well built, but often the builders are good at wood-to-metal fit, but not good at historic "fit". I see too many offered between $1500 -$2000 range where the builder took a precarved stock, and left way too much wood to the rear of the lock... in other words fitted the lock, but did not pay attention to the lock mortise... and sometimes the lock is poorly fitted having gaps between the plate and the wood. At the same time the rifle may have lots of nice carving and a nice patchbox inlayed and so has a high price. Too high.

For me, a builder should be an expert at the lock to stock and barrel fit, as well as the lines on the lockplate to lock mortise fit,... first, ...as that is basic, and then worry about embellishments. Too many of the newer builders are in a hurry to get to the fun part, and neglect the basics. A well carved, highly embellished stock, with a boogered lock mortise should not cost more than the cost of the parts (imho).

Buyer beware. I looked at rifles for 13 months on Track before I found one that was correctly assembled and bought it.


For your price range I'd contact Cabin Creek Muzzleloading and see what it would cost you to have a basic Pennsylvania Mountain Rifle or a Yorktown, or Virginia rifle built from one of their kits.

LD
 
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