people complain about hunting. yet they eat meat...

[Husker1911]

I believe it's the inimitable Ted Nugent who has promoted one day a year when EVERYONE harvests an animal. A day that everyone kills and prepares an animal, and then eats it. While I'm not the biggest Nuge fan around, I heartily subscribe to this idea!

 

[moewadle]

There is a place for God's creatures,

right there beside the potatoes and gravy. Isn't that how the saying goes?

 

[ChefJeff1]

I killed my first deer here. I read "Fastfood Nation" and it changed my life. I eat mostly organic foods and exercise. My deer did not suffer. He lived a free life in the mountains of Idaho. Farmed animals suffer for their entire life. My deer died for my cause and he has my respect. Jeff

 

[LadySmith]

Hockeybum:
People are hypocrites. they eat meat, and yet complain about killing animals.

I’m one of those people hanging in limbo between becoming a hunter or a vegetarian. I don’t complain about hunting or hunters, though. You all brought up some points that hit close to home, such as:

Mustanger98:
I believe people are so far removed from where their meat comes from that they can't see what a commercially farm-raised animal goes through.

That’s me. Except for fish, I’ve seen animals killed, usually in horrible & brutal ways, but only once for food and I’ve never seen the complete process. That one time for food was when I was very small, visiting my great grandmother and she found me in her pen playing with the chickens. She told me to pick one, and I did thinking she was going to give it to me as a pet. She said, “Give it here.” So I handed it to her and she twirled it around really fast. My “pet” chicken went sailing through the air, hit the ground running and I chased after it. Found it huddled under a log, pulled it out and discovered its head was gone! Spent the rest of the afternoon vomiting and crying. Had the freshest fried chicken for dinner that night but never connected the two until much later.
Flash forward to the present. Bought and cooked a store-bought turkey for Thanksgiving. Almost wrecked my car gawking at a flock of wild turkeys on my way home from work. Can’t grasp the concept that those ones walking around and flying past are edible. The one from the store is meat, those others on the hillside are animals.

Mustanger98:
Thing is, she's not into deer hunting because she has a certain amount of squeamishness about shooting something "warm and fuzzy".

Yep, that’s me again. Came home a couple of weeks ago and there’s a young buck sauntering past my front door. I’ve seen a bobcat, feral cats, coyotes walking down my road, foxes, a flock of quail in my backyard, lots of squirrels, jackrabbits and the occasional brown bunny. Fowl aplenty. Yet the only things I want to grab are binoculars and a camera, not my rifles. Those are animals. What I have in my freezer from Safeway is meat.
However…
As I’ve written before, I’d like to try hunting at least once just to know the entire story from beginning to end. I’ve been lacking the opportunity, the time and know-how to do it. And to be perfectly honest, the main thing holding me back is fear. It’s keeping me from making the time, finding the opportunity and gaining the experience. Just when I take a deep breath and think, yes, I can do this, I read about shot & wounded animals in pain and squirming gut piles. Eeuuwww!!! And there I go back to my fear-filled and lazy little “civilized” cubby hole stocked with USDA approved stuff.

 

[Colt46]

LEANWOLF-Not from Colorado

I Did happen to rent Parker and Stone's musical(the southpark guys) "Alfred Packer-The Musical". Why it didn't win an Oscar was pretty apparant, but I've always like oddball films

 

[dfaugh]

BTW I've never had a hunting argument with a vegetarian/vegan.

Actually I have. My nephews wife is a vegetarian, and will gladly dicuss why she won't eat any meat, of any kind, in a rational non-confrontational way. She doesn't try to "convert" anyone or anything like that, even my nephew, who east meat when they go out, and occasionally some at home (but she won't touch it).

BUT, we busted her for wearing leather (shoes and handbags), to which she replied "but they couldn't have gotten the hides, if you hadn't eaten them!" At least a slighly more comprehensible response than you usually might get.

 

[wacki]

they say its okay to eat meat from farms, because they dont suffer...

Maybe if they pay EXTRA for free range animals but nobody does that. Your run of the mill commercial meat farm is a very disgusting and brutal practice. I'm sure everyone here hates PETA but you should make them read one of the PETA chicken articles.

 

[Cromlech]

. . .when I have to hunt the Lesser Spotted Evil Critter there ain't no way in heck I'm gonna eat what I shoot. That would just be gross.

Just use some Tobasco sauce, and even the nastiest home-invader becomes palatable.

 

[TexasRifleman]

Can’t grasp the concept that those ones walking around and flying past are edible. The one from the store is meat, those others on the hillside are animals.

My neighbor has this same problem. Won't eat meat and freaks out if the discussion of burgers or steak comes up.

She, however, has NO problem with her Coach purse, leather lined Suburban and Steve Madden leather shoes.

I reminded her that her purse was once the wrapper for my meat and she pretty much lost it. She had never made that conneciton either, but I notice she's still wearing shoes and carrying purses.

 

[real_name]

I'm vegetarian since 1985, which was when CJD/Mad Cow disease came to my attention back in Britain. I stopped eating beef, the rest followed quite easily. 21 years later I'm 6'2" and 220 lbs, I work in construction, I'm healthy. Being vegetarian isn't a death sentence.

Anyway, I have a LOT more respect for those that kill their own meat than those that get it at Kroger, irradiated cuts of who knows what?
It is, to paraphrase the Native Americans, closer to the earth to only kill as much as you will eat. It is also more healthy, as you are avoiding all the growth hormones. It is a lot better for the animal too if that is of any concern.

Read 'Fast Food Nation'.
Read 'The Omnivore's Dilemma'.

Neither of these books are pro-vegetarian, they are anti-meat industry. They would be of great interest (IMO) to hunters.

If you hunt you are eating humanely killed, organic, prime meat.
That stuff costs a fortune in the whole foods store.

 

[bakert]

Quote by Declaration Day> "Bambi is merely a cartoon character, who was given a cute name and personality." Nothing ludicrous about that. I've pointed that out to numerous people when they bring the subject up. I don't usually argue with people over that, try to just walk away. Wonder what they'd do if a steak or lb of hamburger had those big old brown eyes??

 

[highlander 5]

I am not a hunter but I do support the right to hunt and have had the same "Bambi" arguments and to no avail
I might add.
When I was a kid staying with my grandparents it was always "go to the hen house and get the eggs for breakfast' in the morning as a kid this was fun for me.
Watched my grandfather kill chickens for supper,grand mother would have fits as I stood watching my GF cut off their heads. We had horses,cows and at least 3 pigs
as i got older I found out two where for us to eat 1 for the butcher to slaughter and cut up the other 2.
Gee come to think of it maybe that's why I turned out the way I am

 

[quatin]

Taking free range meat is more humane than buying caged meat. However, it's embarassing when people make a HUGE fuss about how deer are dangerous and kill people by standing in roads and causing "accidents". Therefore it's a gift to humanity when you kill a deer. Is it not an over reaction to state deer as people killers? Should we start killing bad drivers and people with bad jaywalking haibts?

 

[DirtyBrad]

Hunting is one thing, but it only accounts for a tiny fraction of the meat consumed in this country.

Do you think it's okay for animals to suffer? How much animal suffering do you think the meat industry in this country causes? If you haven't really looked into it, what do you think the chances are that it's a lot worse than you think?

What do you get out of eating meat? If you think you can't be healthy without animals, what about vegetarian athletes and the millions of people who live this lifestyle? How much of it is just going with the flow and doing what's normal?

Are those benefits worth the suffering? If you really know about the suffering and you really understand the benefits, I would say you at least make logical sense, if not moral. If you don't, I would say hypocrite is exactly the right word.

 

[pax]

I have a vegetarian friend who hunts. Her family eats meat, she doesn't. (And ain't stereotypes grand?)

I'm sure everyone here hates PETA but you should make them read one of the PETA chicken articles.

Actually, the PETA chicken articles aren't exactly accurate. We've got several friends who run chicken farms, and these farms are nowhere near as icky as PETA wants everyone to believe.

Similarly, beef slaughterhouses may be hideous awful places -- I don't know, never having toured one -- but I do know that I sure see a lot of beef animals wandering around the fields around here. The cattle don't spend their entire lives in the slaughterhouse, after all. Whoda thunkit?

pax

 

[Mikee Loxxer]

Cows smarter that deer? Hardly. I am from cattle country and a deer hunter as well and can tell you from first hand experience that this is simply not the case. Cows are simply meat with feet which are bred to be docile and easy to manipulate (the occasional bull being the exception of course). Deer on the other hand (especially old bucks) have to be smart to survive.

 

[ID_shooting]

My wife has one of those Ultra Liberal, No Meat Eating, Micheal Moore Worshiping friends.

I simply told her that I will respect her if she repects me in return. We have her over for dinner now and then. I will prepare her food seperate from ours to ensure it does not come in contact with our meat, she knows this and trusts it. She has never had a non-civil discussion about it and has yet to comment negatively about our killing of animals.

Can't say I like how she votes, but she is a plesant person to be around.

 

[moewadle]

Since I have joined THR

I have tried to encourage tolerance, understanding, and NON-STEREOTYPING from everyone. The post just above this one sounds like a good example. Certain subjects like hunting, guns, religion, politics, etc can be pretty controversial. Part of being in a free society, that we have fought to protect for over 200 years, is the freedom to practice, to a great extent, our own individual beliefs and we need to respect other people's RIGHT to practice those beliefs. I am not asking you to respect their beliefs as such, but to respect their right to have those beliefs and exercise them. Sometimes the best thing to do is keep our mouths shut.

 

[DirtyBrad]

pax,

Because some farms may not be as bad doesn't mean that other farms, or most farms, aren't worse. I would respectfully ask what percentage of America's poultry is coming from your friends' farms and those like it vs. say Tyson chicken.

PETA is an easy target for those looking to dismiss the issue. While the majority of PETA's work isn't of the headline-grabbing, fake-blood-flinging variety, what if we agree to leave them out just to eliminate the emotion, extremism, and bias associated with them.

Instead, look to the industry itself. Look at its own publications and products to get a sense of what it's really like.

For a more condensed version, check out Fast Food Nation, which has been brought up a couple of times here. It's a very interesting read and its sources are very well cited.

 

[WolfMansDad]

I have several vegetarian friends, and none of them have ever expressed any opposition to my hunting. All the heat I have taken for my "lifestyle" has come from people who eat store-bought meat. Then again, all the vegetarians I know are either opposed to the meat industry, or they are doing it for health reasons.

I tried being a vegetarian for a couple of months once. Boy, did it suck! And yes, I did get all the good recipies from my vegetarian friends. I'm just designed to eat meat.

 

[DirtyBrad]

moewaddle,

I very much agree that we need to have a high level of discourse, respect others, and not stereotype. But there's always a but...

Most of us seem to agree that a person has a right to be left alone and follow his own path. Until that path infringes on another's rights. And a lot of people think animals have rights. I've certainly heard some strong language on this forum in response to someone hurting a dog.

***

WolfMansDad,

I hear a lot that people tried being a vegetarian, but couldn't stick with it. I can't make sense of this argument. If you think about the treatment of animals, decide it's not something you agree with, and that you want to stop contributing to it, that's a powerful moral decision. To reverse that because of the taste of food is hard to understand.

If you believed those things and still do now, I would hope you would give it another shot. How about only eating meat that you hunted yourself? That would take you out of the factory system, but still give you an avenue to satisfy your hunger to eat meat every now and then.

 

[pax]

Brad ~

Believe what you read if you want to. I believe what I've seen.

Chicken farms I've been to are suppliers for a couple of major brands.

*shrug*

pax

 

[Cousin Mike]

Funny this subject comes up...

I was talking to my girlfriend the other day about hunting. I basically just asked her if she'd ever given any thought to learning how to hunt. We live in the city, but I have a friend who offered to teach me how to hunt and I plan on taking him up on it. It's something I think anyone who eats meat should learn how to do.

Anyways, when I asked her, I got a really quick "No."

I was actually kind of baffled, because she can shoot, she carries a gun, and she isn't one to kid herself about where her meals come from. We've watched hunting shows together, and occasionally it'll be a father teaching his young daughter how to hun. She loves to see those girls get their deer. She is, by no means, anti-anything gun related. So when asked if she wanted to learn for herself, it shocked me a little that she said "No," without even thinking about it.

I pressed a little bit.

"Well, we eat meat, and you know where it comes from."

"True, but I just don't know about going hunting."

Hmmm... I need to be careful with this one, but I press on. "So what is it about the thought of hunting that you don't like?"

She thinks for a second... "Hmmm... I don't know."

So I give it another try. This time I try another angle - is she just squeamish? Let's see. "Well sweetie, not trying to be funny, but... if you don't think you could kill a deer, then how do you know you could kill a person if you needed to?"

She makes a certain face she makes when she's thinking about something really hard. I can tell she's doing some soul searching, and just when I think I might have won, she looks up and says,

"Well, if I ever had to shoot a person, it would be because he was trying to hurt me in some way... So hell yeah I'm going to shoot him. But with a deer, it's different. He's just trying to live his life - so I guess to be honest, I just view a deer as innocent."

Damn! She hit me with a knockout punch!

I had to respect that. And to be honest, I can completely understand it. For me, it's food. Like I said, I've never been hunting as of yet, but what makes it alluring to me is getting in touch with something my ancestors had to do. It's about getting in touch with myself, and nature, and stepping away from cars and cell phones, computers, work, paychecks and everything life has become... and going out and hunting for my own food like men always have - long before life was full of gadgets and the meaningless duties most of us call "work". That's appealing to me on a lot of different levels. Shooting a deer, killing an animal... Those things, to me, have so little to do with why I want to hunt that it's really not even a factor.

For her, all she thinks of is that she'd be killing something innocent. And the killing aspect is what dominates her thinking about the entire subject.

Sorry for the story, but I had never really heard that before, and I thought I'd post it here. It was just funny to me that she had such a simple reason for feeling the way she does about it. But what blew me away was that none of her reasoning had anything to do with Bambi, or being an anti.

 

[USMC - Retired]

I was asked by a anti once why I felt I could kill and eat deer.

I told her that if God didn't intend for us to kill and eat deer, he wouldn't have made em outta meat!

 

[DirtyBrad]

pax,

I do believe what I read and it very often conflicts with the limited scope of things I see for myself. I do my best to be an objective reader and to be skeptical.

***

Cousin Mike,

Very well said. Why does your girlfriend feel that way about the deer, but not the animals on the farm?

That might be the best signature line ever.