Pistol caliber carbine

[coyotewillie]

I've been considering a pistol caliber carbine. I have both a .40 and a .45 handgun. Which caliber will show more improvement through the longer carbine bbl? I could care less which caliber I get, but thought one might be a better pick because of increased velocity and such. Thanks. Greg

 

[Gun Master]

I have a 9mm Hi-Point carbine . I don't shoot it much, but it did well when I used it . Never owned a .40 cal. anything, and have heard some negative comments on this cal. I have had several .45 pistols, and I'm prejudiced in favor of it . With the scenario you presented, I'd get a .45 . On the other hand, since you own both (.40 & .45), I'd say get the one that is the most convenient or available . You da' man, you decide . Buena fortuna .

 

[LAGS]

The .357 Marlin I own is a nice pistol caliber in a rifle.
But since they do not make a Semi Auto in the .357, I want to attempt to convert an SKS to .357.
The Bolt face will work, I just have to find someone to make me a barrel so I can try it.

 

[PO2Hammer]

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/calibers.html

 

[zhyla]

Which caliber will show more improvement through the longer carbine bbl? I could care less which caliber I get, but thought one might be a better pick because of increased velocity and such. Thanks. Greg

Why does improvement matter? If, say, a 9mm round was 50% faster out of a 16" barrel and a .45 was only 30% faster, but the .45 still had more energy, which is the better choice?

The "big three" handgun rounds are all about equivalent and they all benefit from the rifle length barrel. Get the one that makes sense for other reasons.

 

[mavracer]

I would bet the 40 gains a bit being higher pressure. most 45 loads won't gain much after about 10" as the pressure has dropped by then.

 

[oldpapps]

Oh good. A 'Good', 'Bad' and 'Don't Care' question.

The 'Good' up front.
Interchangeable ammunition. Only one set of loading dies. Same components to buy.

The 'Bad' is next.
Colt tried this marking approach way back... The Colt Lighting rifle and pistol. Great idea that didn't work out. You end up with a wimp rifle or a major hand full pistol. No one is happy.
But for our exercise. Both the .40 and the .45 are loaded for retarded blow back actions with set energy parameters and these must be adhered to. The normal barrel lengths are 4 to 5 inches and most ammunition is tailored to this length.

Now to the 'Don't care' section.
Hopefully you reload, if not think hard about it.
I load both the .40 and .45 with the same 231/HP38 powder... Same burn rate. Any [relatively] fast burn rate powder will be at a greater disadvantage with a long/er barrel when compared to any powder with a slower burn rate. At the same time, the comparability between the shorter pistol barrel and the longer rifle barrel must, if you still want to use the same ammo, be within the proper parameters to function.
What to do? Simple, load for your primary weapon and expect the other to suffer. How much will vary with loadings.
I don't have a rifle chambered in .40 S&W, so I can offer no help here. I do have a Marlin CampGun in .45 ACP.
The loading: 200 Grain LSWC, 5.6 grains of 231/HP38, CCI LP primers and mixed brass.
From a 5 inch 1911A1 barrel - 875 FPS (give or take).
From a 16 1/2 inch Marlin barrel - 1045 FPS (give or take).

My opinions and these have very little validity if any.
A shoulder arm gives a more stable sighting platform. In this case it is for a poor rifle round. My Marlin CampGun is NOT for sale.
A better combination would be a pistol/rifle combo in .357 Mag or .44 Mag or .45 Colt or.... Any case/round that normally can utilize larger quantities of slower burn rate powders will have much better potentials with the longer barrels, yet still be usable if not heavy loads in the pistol. And the proper powder will still need to be selected. I have a very good loading of 231/HP38 that pushes a 240 grain 44 at 1016 FPS and almost a duplicate loading using 2400 powder with the same bullet to the same velocity. Both of these are from the same 'pistol'. If fired from a longer barrel, the 2400 would excel and the 231/HP38 dribble off.

Standard disclaimer on my .45 ACP loading, it works with my components, in my weapons, but may not be safe in yours with your components. I use it as an example not as loading advise.

Load with care,

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Colt tried this marking approach way back... The Colt Lighting rifle and pistol. Great idea that didn't work out.

The Winchester '73 paired with the Colt revolver certainly worked out good.

 

[dprice3844444]

http://www.justrightcarbines.com/
http://www.mechtechsys.com/index.php

 

[CraigC]

Colt tried this marking approach way back... The Colt Lighting rifle and pistol....You end up with a wimp rifle or a major hand full pistol. No one is happy.

The 1877 Lightning DA revolver and Lightning rifle were never chambered in the same cartridges. Although the rifle was chambered in cartridges also available in the SAA like the .38 and .44WCF.

In modern guns they works quite nicely. Even with medium burning powders like Unique, the .38-40 gains 350fps at standard pressures. A 180gr at 1200fps from revolvers or 1550fps from rifles is potent from any perspective.

 

[coyotewillie]

And the winner is....PO2Hammer! The only one who actually gave a real....answer!! Thank you.

 

[1858remington]

The Keltec sub 2000 comes in 9mm and 40S&W. Its a nice foldable package, that is great for hiking. It uses Glock magazines which are easy to find.

The Just Right carbine is a great gun, but priced a little high. A buddy of mine bought one and he loves it, so do his kids. (His daughter claimed it as "hers")

Beretta has the Storm carbine, in 9mm and 40S&W. It has the ability to switch ejection to either side, in case your a lefty.

You could always get a 9mm upper for your AR-15, very pricy though.

Personally, I bought a semi auto Soumi M31. Its a WWII Finnish submachine gun, uses 36 round mags and 71 round drums. It is very accurate and reliable. They sell for around $400. It was the most expensive to produce sub gun of WWII. Its all machined, and is on the heavy side. It has a quick change barrel, just like machine guns of the time.

 

[MichaelK]

Why does improvement matter? If, say, a 9mm round was 50% faster out of a 16" barrel and a .45 was only 30% faster, but the .45 still had more energy, which is the better choice?

Umm, no, not really. Maybe 10%. Short, stubby pistol cartridges aren't loaded with the kinds of slow burning powders revolver cartridges can be loaded with. So, only very moderate increases in velocity. My Lyman manual lists loads for both the 9mm in pistol and rifle lengthed barrels, and they only get about 100-125 fps increase in the rifle length.

With one of my own revolver/rifle combos, I looked at +P 38 specials out of a 6" revolver and a 16" Marlin. The revolver gave me 1090 fps with Lyman's 358477 SWC, and 1285fps in the rifle, in line with Oldpapp's data.

Make your choice on what you think will be a better plinker. It will be perfect for stalking empty cans, and maybe an occasional rabbit, but you'll really be getting a better sight picture and maybe better accuracy rather than more power. Don't think it will turn your cartridge into a deer-getter.

 

[bubba in ca]

I dumped my pistol caliber carbines for the same reason most police did--they don`t make sence. For the same money you can get a 223 or 30 ak gun and for a whole lot less money you can plink with 22lr.

 

[woodweasel58]

I too dumped my pistol cal carbines when .223/5.56 was $4.00 a box, it's not any more. I just picked up a couple of J R Carbines, 9's, with the cost of brass, bullets, powder, primers and time, the more you shoot the better off you'll be. I plan on shooting a lot more 9mm's and less .308 & 5.56. I'll gladly take 100, 150, or more increase in vel., whatever it is, it's welcome. Plus the wife & younger kids like shooting them.