Please educate me on on the SMLE.

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Tallbald

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To ask the value of an original SMLE would be like asking "how high is up?" I suppose. But here's the thing. An upcoming estate sale includes among a few assorted other rifles a .303 SMLE "stamped" (as it is listed). I'm a lover of of older rifles and am attending the auction because of a few other things they have listed. IF the SMLE appears original ( I know and even remember the days when they were $15.00 plus postage and often were "parts" bin guns put together), what range for any garden variety SMLE would be reasonable, ignoring some strange rare specimen? I have read there were 17 million of them made with all the variants, and I also realize condition condition condition matters. This isn't my first rodeo, but it's my first SMLE gamble ride.Thanks. Don
 
It might be easier to ask "how high is up". The term SMLE has been morphed to mean a lot of things. The ShtLe MkIII or #1mkIII is the vintage WWI battle rifle. But, the term has also been used on the #4mk1 WWII rifles and it's variatons. There is a lot that goes into the value of an Enfield, and it depends on a LOT of variables. A complete rifle of either guise COULD be worth $100 to $500 depending on a lot of conditional things. Can you get a better description of the rifle, so that we can help you determine a value range? I personaly have 14 different Enfields, and their value varies greatly.
 
Generally speaking a decent, basic, non FTR/greenstripe rifle with matching numbers and a good bore runs in the $350 range lately.
 
Hi Doug and thanks. I figured it was a question with too many variables to given a brief answer. If it was a vintage Smith or Ruger revolver, I'd be able to answer it myself.
Unfortunately all I have is a newspaper photo and the description ".303 rifle stamped" next to several other rifles. if it's OK i'd like to send you a PM. Don
 
It means original, not factory repair..........Original SMLE could mean any of em between the Long Lee & the Pattern 13.............Yes and a good one can run any where from 350 bucks and up................
 
Thanks for the help folks. Really I guess I'll just have to go to the auction, check out the bore, look for matching serial numbers and treat the rifle like any other possible purchase. I'll weigh the machine work and wood against what a similarly made rifle might cost if it was made today, and see if it speaks to me. Chances are though it will scream to me in my ear and beg me to spend more on it and take it home where it will be appreciated. Don
 
If it happens to be a #4/Mk.1 and has a two-groove bore (all Longbranch, Savage, some mfg. in England), it might have trouble using ammo with BT bullets.
This happened in my Longbranch, despite having a very bright bore and nice rifling. Possibly a worn throat or muzzle could cause bullets to "keyhole" at 100 yards.

I traded it for a #4 with a 4- or 5-groove bore, manufactured in England.
No more keyholes with boat tail (BT) bullets, despite the rifle having a bore which is not so bright as the previous.

Good luck in the auction!
 
If it's a sniper model No. 4, you may be looking at north of a thousand bucks, unless you find an auction where no one else knows any more than you do.

Lift the bolt handle and look at the info stamped on the metal ring there, holding the stock and forearm together. If it's not actually made at Enfield Arsenal, it may be from BSA or other contractors or from some foreign producer. Lithgow in Australia made many. Other stamps say where it was used. A Broad Arrow property mark within a U means South Africa. The BA within a big C means Canada. Canada also made some No. 4 rifles at Long Branch arsenal. And some were made by Savage here. Savage examples may be marked as US Property, but were Lend-Lease, although I've seen a photo or two of Merrill's Marauders with British rifles in Burma.

The Pattern 13 and 14 rifles do not use the Lee action: they are Mauser-based.

Any really nice SMLE or No. 4 rifle that hasn't been "sporterized" is worth $300-500, and some may be worth a lot more. If a rifle is stamped FTR, it means Factory Thorough Repair. Some look new. And a bunch of No. 4 MK 2 rifles were imported here about 10 years ago in original factory wrap.

It amazes me that some know more about Moisins than they do about the British .303's.

For hunting, look for Winchester or Norma .303 ammo. Remington makes it, but has a RN bullet that may not feed as well in some rifles and may not shoot as closely to the sights. Don't buy .303 Savage ammo by mistake, if you ever find any. It's a different round, more like a .30-30, for Savage M-99 rifles.

There were also British sporting rifles made originally on this action. Some were by BSA, LSA, even by Holland & Holland. They look NOTHING like the ones done here by Bubba. In between are the restocked ones from Parker-Hale. I saw those for about $150-250 at Hudson's Bay Co. in Canada many years ago. They were the best buy I ever saw in an inexpensive hunting rifle. Canadians routinely shoot moose and elk with .303's. In Africa, they've taken elephant, although hardly ideal, especially in thick bush.

And I think the military .303's are among the most historically interesting of any foreign service rifles. Most seen here are in pretty worn shape, but a good one is a really nice rifle. I'd rather be armed with a No. 4 than a Springfield '03.

BE AWARE THAT THE STOCKS come in different lengths. Look at the heel of the stock for a letter code. S=Short, B=Bantam, L=Long. I forgot whether N or R =Regular. See that the stock fits you right. Of course, you may want the rifle, anyway, to re-sell.

The info stamped under the bolt handle will tell you the year made and the Monarch on the throne then. GR=George Rex, either George V or VI. VR= Victoria Regina. ER=Elizabeth II Regina. I guess ER would also mean Edward Rex if made during the fairly brief reign of King Ed.VII.

If you get it, post pics and any stamped data and we'll tell you what you have. Be aware that Australia never made the No. 4 rifle, but some were shipped there, and I've seen a photo of a RAAF man armed with one.
 
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Wow Lonestar. Thank you! I suspect that I won't be the only person there who has been eyeing the SMLE. I'll jot down what you have said and yes, should I through the luck of the draw manage to buy it, will post photos asking for assistance in identification. Don.
 
If it's a sniper model No. 4, you may be looking at north of a thousand bucks, unless you find an auction where no one else knows any more than you do.

Lift the bolt handle and look at the info stamped on the metal ring there, holding the stock and forearm together. If it's not actually made at Enfield Arsenal, it may be from BSA or other contractors or from some foreign producer. Lithgow in Australia made many. Other stamps say where it was used. A Broad Arrow property mark within a U means South Africa. The BA within a big C means Canada. Canada also made some No. 4 rifles at Long Branch arsenal. And some were made by Savage here. Savage examples may be marked as US Property, but were Lend-Lease, although I've seen a photo or two of Merrill's Marauders with British rifles in Burma.

The Pattern 13 and 14 rifles do not use the Lee action: they are Mauser-based.

Any really nice SMLE or No. 4 rifle that hasn't been "sporterized" is worth $300-500, and some may be worth a lot more. If a rifle is stamped FTR, it means Factory Thorough Repair. Some look new. And a bunch of No. 4 MK 2 rifles were imported here about 10 years ago in original factory wrap.

It amazes me that some know more about Moisins than they do about the British .303's.

For hunting, look for Winchester or Norma .303 ammo. Remington makes it, but has a RN bullet that may not feed as well in some rifles and may not shoot as closely to the sights. Don't buy .303 Savage ammo by mistake, if you ever find any. It's a different round, more like a .30-30, for Savage M-99 rifles.

There were also British sporting rifles made originally on this action. Some were by BSA, LSA, even by Holland & Holland. They look NOTHING like the ones done here by Bubba. In between are the restocked ones from Parker-Hale. I saw those for about $150-250 at Hudson's Bay Co. in Canada many years ago. They were the best buy I ever saw in an inexpensive hunting rifle. Canadians routinely shoot moose and elk with .303's. In Africa, they've taken elephant, although hardly ideal, especially in thick bush.

And I think the military .303's are among the most historically interesting of any foreign service rifles. Most seen here are in pretty worn shape, but a good one is a really nice rifle. I'd rather be armed with a No. 4 than a Springfield '03.

BE AWARE THAT THE STOCKS come in different lengths. Look at the heel of the stock for a letter code. S=Short, B=Bantam, L=Long. I forgot whether N or R =Regular. See that the stock fits you right. Of course, you may want the rifle, anyway, to re-sell.

The info stamped under the bolt handle will tell you the year made and the Monarch on the throne then. GR=George Rex, either George V or VI. VR= Victoria Regina. ER=Elizabeth II Regina. I guess ER would also mean Edward Rex if made during the fairly brief reign of King Ed.VII.

If you get it, post pics and any stamped data and we'll tell you what you have. Be aware that Australia never made the No. 4 rifle, but some were shipped there, and I've seen a photo of a RAAF man armed with one.
good info lone star
 
Thank you toall those who were so nice and helpful in working to teach me about the the SMLE. I did attend the auction and prices were crazy. I looked the SMLE over well and it was repaired in several places, like below the action where I saw inletted wood sections. Bore was dirty and I couldn't really assess it. The only matching serial numbers were on the action and magazine, and a few places had "AU" stampings. Finish was painted and only about 50% left. I couldn't find any dates, but I'm sure they were there. I'm guessing the rifle would rate an NRA "fair".
The rifle quickly went up to $350 PLUS (and I haven't seen this done here in Kentucky before) a $25 transfer fee by a local gun shop. I think, but might be way off base, that $375 would get me a much better specimen. At least that's what I'm telling myself. Thanks once more. Don
 
Yeah Don, sounds like that one got outta hand quickly, such is the case with auctions. You may have better luck getting a decent SMLE or other Enfield from a private seller, small LGS, or even a pawn shop.....someone you can deal and dicker with. Auctions, you might get a good deal, but prices only go UP at auctions.

FWIW, I found a really nice 1947 Enfield No.5 Mk.1 Rifle (Jungle Carbine) in an obscure pawn shop for $150. I honestly think they had no idea what it was. It was fitted with a scope, and to the uninitiated it could appear to be some Bubba-built deer rifle made from God-knows-what. I know that's what I thought of it until I could get online and research it, and discovered what it really was. Then I went back and bought it quickly.

I also have a 1917 BSA No.1 Mk.III Rifle, a 1952 RFI (Indian) No.1 Mk.III Rifle, a 1943 Fazakerly No.4 Mk.1 Rifle, and a 1942 Longbranch No.4 Mk.1* Rifle, all came from private sellers for good prices.

I was looking at another SMLE once in a pawn shop, priced way high. When my interest dropped because of the price and I walked away, he started dropping the price. I really did have to go, didn't have the time to mess with it or the money on me, but that guy followed me to the truck, dropping the price all the way. I think he was at $90 when I finally had to pull away. Wish I'd had the time and money, even a beater would be worth $90 for parts.
 
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