Police Seize Guns From Man Thought to Be Neo-Nazi Leader

[Browning]

Well, the part about the felonies had nothing to do with the ERPO. I addressed that first.

Sorry to confuse you. It was directed at the side conversation about felons getting their guns back. I specifically stated someone convicted of a felony.

You quoted BSA1 who was referencing the Kaleb Cole case (possibilities about why he didn’t show up to challenge the order), he hasn’t committed any felonies.

You must not have known what he was talking about.

 

[P5 Guy]

That is so cute.
I am sure that you also find laws where pedophiles and child rapists that were just released from prisons and they have to register and are prohibited from play grounds, too harsh, stupid and unconstitutional.
As long as they don't come near your family, daughter or grand daughter, right ?

LOL! you are quite the comedian.
Those laws are UNCONSTITUTIONAL, and what they do accomplish is make an untouchable caste. If those folks are such a danger why are they out of prison?

 

[buck460XVR]

Then try him in a court of law and attempt to convict him of whatever crime he’s alleged to have committed in front of a jury of his peers while having legal representation.

If that won’t happen then he’s entitled to the same rights you enjoy.

Then arrest and prosecute him for his ACTIONS.

Because of his rights, he cannot be arrested without proof of his crimes. This is why, even tho folks know that members of the Mafia, outlaw biker gangs, street gangs and other "brotherhood" groups have committed crimes, without adequate proof, they ares till allowed to walk the streets. Due to "rights", convicted and released pedophiles are allowed to live down the street from children. This guy is scum of the Earth. He's a pile of slime. Thinking he's anything else means you support him and his ideals. Hard to believe folks are upset, because even tho there is sufficient proof he is a threat to others, over the confiscation of his firearms. As I said before, odds are there are hate crimes committed that he has been a part of, has knowledge of or maybe even instigated. Because of his rights, he is allowed to stay free. Odds are his Aryan Brotherhood buddies have plenty more guns for him. Odds also are that this will escalate this slimeball to do something in retaliation over what he thinks are N-Word lovers, have done to him.

I have no sympathy for this dirtball, just happy he ain't my neighbor. While I have my doubts over Red Flag laws, if there is an argument for them......without a doubt, this is one of them, and I have no fear at all, that this action will ever have any influence on my right to own firearms.

 

[TikkaShooter]

If those folks are such a danger why are they out of prison?

I asked a LEO once why are they out of prison. I don't know if this is correct; however, his answer was some crimes have a federal mandatory sentence. As a result, to avoid overcrowding some people who shouldn't be released are released.
If any current or retired LEO wants to add to his answer or correct it, I'd appreciate it.

 

[BSA1]

Why don't any of you have problems with search warrants?

What makes you think I don’t? However there is a big difference between a search warrant and a EPRO.

A search warrant is generally for finding evidence of a crime or finding “fruits” of crimes.

For example a search warrant is issued for search of suspected drug dealer home. Evidence would be finding scales used for weighing the drugs, balloons used to package drugs, lab equipment, etc.

Fruits of the crime could be the $10,000 in cash that is found during the search or the expensive sports car sitting in the garage that the dealer brought using the money he made selling drugs.

As discussed with EPRO what crime has been allegedly committed to justify seizure of the accused firearms?

There are volumes of court cases over the decades establishing the rules for use of search warrants and decisions by Appeal and The Supreme Court.

There are no rules that have been reviewed by Higher Courts for EPRO’s.

 

[Browning]

Because of his rights, he cannot be arrested without proof of his crimes.
This is why, even tho folks know that members of the Mafia, outlaw biker gangs, street gangs and other "brotherhood" groups have committed crimes, without adequate proof, they ares till allowed to walk the streets. Due to "rights", convicted and released pedophiles are allowed to live down the street from children.

That’s how it works. If there isn’t adequate evidence to secure a conviction no one should be imprisoned.

This guy is scum of the Earth. He's a pile of slime. Thinking he's anything else means you support him and his ideals.

Supporting the idea that the system shouldn’t be able to throw an individual in prison because many don’t share his political beliefs isn’t the same thing as agreeing with them.

It means just that.

By the way, do you feel the same way about the New Black Panthers who advocate to murder of children if they’re white? Or is it just the freaks from one side that you have an issue with?

Hard to believe folks are upset, because even tho there is sufficient proof he is a threat to others, over the confiscation of his firearms. As I said before, odds are there are hate crimes committed that he has been a part of, has knowledge of or maybe even instigated.

If there was sufficient evidence they would’ve arrested him and gone for a conviction.

Think about it, what you are telling me is that he belongs to a dangerous neo Nazi “terrorist group” that’s covered up in guns and that’s constant training and you think that taking the guys legal guns away from him is going to make everybody safe?

You don’t think that this guy’s buddies wouldn’t lend him one if he wanted to go do something? Or you don’t think he has something stashed? That’s not reality.

If this organization is as dangerous as they’re making out (something I’m not convinced of), it’s the same thing as with the Bandito’s, Hell Angels, MS13, the Crips, Bloods or any other criminal organization. If one of their members needs a gun they’ll get him one.

If he’s committed a crime do it the old fashioned way, investigate him, arrest him, prosecute him and if he’s convicted then imprison him.

 

[theotherwaldo]

My take: You are either concerned about everyone's natural and constitutional rights or you will soon have no natural or constitutional rights if you happen to fall out of favor with the powers that be.

Just because a person or group is despised by "all right-thinking people" doesn't mean that that person or group should lose their rights.

 

[entropy]

LOL! you are quite the comedian.
Those laws are UNCONSTITUTIONAL, and what they do accomplish is make an untouchable caste. If those folks are such a danger why are they out of prison?

Because capital punishment is all but nonexistent in this country. There, I said what you all were dancing around.

Those here who say all convicted felons should be able to own a gun after serving their sentence are forgetting three little words: Pyschopathy, Sociopathy, and Recidivism.

Should all convicted felons be able to get back the right (or have it un-repressed, if that is your semantic preferece) to own guns? NO. Some probably could, the tax dodger mentioned earier, perhaps. I know a guy who's felony was for killing a cat. he threw a wrench at it, and it died. I'm of the mind a medal might have been more appropriate, certainly not a felony. I don't think he should have lost owning guns over that.

Pyscopaths will flat out say they will commit the same crime they were in for at parole hearings; most parole boards are smart enough to keep them in, but far too often (indeed once is too often) they are let out. Sociopaths make a life of deceiving people, psychiatrists included. They get out almost every time. Then there's your garden variety prisoner, maybe not clearly mentally ill, but knows no other way, and enjoys the 'rush' of <insert felony here>. They will most likely commit crime when released, often within 24 hours of it. And keep doing so in an endless cycle that does no one any good, including the convict.

 

[Zendude]

It mainly boils down to "costs". The cost of the prison, of the guards, medical costs, food, etc. It is so much cheaper to take the firearm away and lock it up.

Yup. Then we can all feel safe because without a gun, it’s impossible for a criminal to commit a homicide.

 

[alsaqr]

Those here who say all convicted felons should be able to own a gun after serving their sentence are forgetting three little words: Pyschopathy, Sociopathy, and Recidivism.

In general, those who advocate possession of firearms by convicted felons, especially violent felons, know nothing about felons or prisons. In another life i worked as a corrections officer in a medium security prison. The recidivism rate is sky high.

One armed robber smoozed the parole board and was released. He attacked a maintenance worker at a highway rest stop on his way home. Yep, the idiot attacked a man using a weed eater. Within two weeks the perp returned to our prison, cut up and blind in one eye.

Recidivism:

The 401,288 state prisoners released in 2005 had an estimated 1,994,000 arrests during the 9-year period, an average of 5 arrests per released prisoner.

Five out of six released offenders were rearrested.

The vast majority of arrestes were not related to technical violations.

Sixty percent of these arrests occurred during years 4 through 9. „

"An estimated 68% of released prisoners were arrested within 3 years, 79% within 6 years, and 83% within 9 years. „

Almost half (47%) of prisoners who did not have an arrest within 3 years of release were arrested during years 4 through 9. „

More than three-quarters (77%) of released drug offenders were arrested for a non-drug crime within 9 years.

Forty-four percent of released prisoners were arrested during the first year following release, while 24% were arrested during year-9. „

Eighty-two percent of prisoners arrested during the 9-year period were arrested within the first 3 years. „

Five percent of prisoners were arrested during the first year after release and not arrested again during the 9-year follow-up period. „

During each year and cumulatively in the 9-year follow-up period, released property offenders were more likely to be arrested than released violent offenders. „

Eight percent of prisoners arrested during the first year after release were arrested outside the state that released them, compared to 14% of prisoners arrested during year-9."

https://www.crimeinamerica.net/offender-recidivism-and-reentry-in-the-united-states/

BTW: Then Nazi subject of this thread lives with his parents. Imagine that: A world class bad butt living with Mom and Dad.

 

[Robert]

While I agree these laws are unconstitutional we will have to wait until a case actually reaches something other than a local district judge to get a ruling. The court of THR opinion will not change anything neither will talking in circles. Let's call this one done.