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Pro gun argument Do you think a world without guns or civilian guns is scary?

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I have been told more than once by police for me to get a gun to defend myself from several big thugs. The police said they couldn't defend me. I took their advice. Problem solved. If a life sentence was given to criminals who used guns in the commission of a crime then there would be less gun violence...IMHO.
 
If a life sentence was given to criminals who used guns in the commission of a crime then there would be less gun violence...IMHO.

So... what sentence would you give a man who murders someone with "just a knife"?
 
Following on a little from the other thread, here in England there are very few handguns, and all of them owned by criminals or the Police.

So what do kids do in gang wars in London? They dont shoot each other.


They stab each other

Now the government are trying to think of ways to ban knives, which is going to make eating dinner a bit difficult ...

Sorry about that. Seems you guys are just toast. It isn't so different in many parts of the us. That would be the parts of the us that wish to emulate europe, hence obama. I'm guessing he'll do for us what they did for you. Pity.
 
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I would be property for any man capable of taking me. Since I'm only 5'3" and not athletically gifted that means any man between 14 and 70 who is over 5 feet tall and who possesses at least 3 functioning limbs.

Sounds like a personal ad.

You'd have to fight my husband and my oldest son for me (the little ones are too small to fight).

Of course, in such a world, I'd be really fearful for my nearly 15yo DD who would be just of age to be sold into an arranged marriage to the highest bidder.

A gun-free world would be a terrible place for women.
 
Survial would depend on physical strength and training with swords and spears. Remember: God did not make all men equal. Sam Colt did.;)
 
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If guns had been readily available, would the people have risen against their oppressors? That seems somewhat debatable.

I know someone who said it's pointless to have parachutes on aircraft "Because I would never jump."

Okay, lady, enjoy the crash. But the rest of us don't have to go down with you.

The point is, if you have a gun or a parachute, you can choose. If you do not have them, you have no choice.

To see how effective an armed Jewish uprising could have been, look at the Warsaw Ghetto. Imagine dozens of Warsaw Ghettos.

We're talking 1930s-era Germany, not 1943 Poland with WWII and the Holocaust in full swing.

The ghetto uprising was a classic example of too little, too late and accordingly an ultimate failure.
 
Kaiser Bill II was said to have asked a Swiss soldier before WW I, "The German Army is twice as large as the Swiss Army, what could you do if we were to invade you?" The Swiss soldier replied, "In that case we would all have to shoot twice." Switzerland wasn't invaded and to the best of my knowledge never has been because of an armed citizenry.

This is what scares the gun grabbers beyond everything else IMHO, that those of us with guns would all shoot back if they attempted to confiscate them. :evil:

A world without civilian gun ownership would be like the Dark Ages, Middle Ages, and all other times where the average civilian was effectively disarmed. The strong and wealthy would kill, loot, rape, and pillage at will, and the rest of us could only cower and say, "yes massa". :cuss:
 
Once upon a time, there were no guns. The main political groups of the day were the National Sword Association, and the Brady campaign to prevent sword violence. You see where I'm going with this?
This might actually not be too bad for me, I'm very big, and I have a very big family. We could probably drive crime out of my neighborhood.
 
Also i dislike your title

'Civilians' are supposed to be armed like the .mil, so their should be no separate classes of firearms in reference to civilians and Military, the arms are supposed to be of the same class so to speak
 
Total gunlessness would never mean safety. The old, young and many women would be mostly helpless against most adult men who were set on doing the weaker folks harm.

Genocide would be just as easy as before but machetes and hatchets would be the bludgoning tool of choice like in Africa.

Gov'ts would reign supreme with little to keep them in check. Any Hitler-type could take over.
 
Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto: "You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass."

I'd hate to see the day when that reality ceased to exist.
 
I will admit I could not sleep at night if I did not have a firearm.. I know to some that sounds really weird. But I have had one for the past 31 years and it would just not feel normal.
 
Scary, hell yeah. A United States without gun ownership isn't the United States as a lot of folks see it, especially those who might do something aobut it. There are a lot of scary thoughts one could see from it happening, it's frigging scary man. Wrote out a rant of pondered thoughts in five minutes and I who am a peace loving law abiding southern boy got real freaked out by what he thought of at random.

Just a few ideas that give me reason to be afraid of the day that America makes the Bill of Rights illegal, we know there are around 14 million deer hunters in the U.S. and let's not lie, those guys and women who can drop a buck at three-hundred and more yards with a high powered rifle could easily double out as those who drop non-USA forces at three-hundred and more yards. Not all cops or National Guard folks are per se good shooters, seen that plenty enough out at the rifle ranges when I've been. First time I ever fired an AR-15 was from some National Guard guy who just got done with training a couple months before and bought himself one to train with when he wasn't doing his required bits. He fired a few rounds on my Mauser before giving up to a sore shoulder (only got one shot on target at fifty yards) and I fired five rounds at fifty yards and found it incredibly accurate. First time I ever fired the gun the guy looked at me and said he was impressed, it was only like a six inch grouping on the bulls-eye.

Granted when you love to shoot 8mm Mauser(aka 8mm Magnum, bought the ammo cheap and stacked it deep) from standing position out to fifty yards for speed (only one shot to two seconds or around there) the .223 isn't anything amazing. Felt(probably just percieved) more recoil from a .357 magnum out of a lever gun.

He filled me in that most the guys were Northern transplants who grew up in Florida and that what I had done was better than nearly all of them at the end of their training and qualification.

So with exception of those long time self-practicing National Guard guys and relatively few qualified and practiced law enforcement, able to skillfully wield the High Velocity semi and single shot rifles, the guardians of justice and freedom probably don't total more than a million on a good day (probably not a tenth but stick with me here). So maybe we got three million LEOs nation wide, four million National Guard nationwide, and add five million professional combat able military service members, so that's twelve million. I realize the numbers probably aren't even that close but then the point isn't ending here then is it. In Iraq, highly trained U.S. troops, some 160,000 combat troops got quagmired by some 30,000 militants in a country of 35 million. Most the casualities have been from IEDs and mortat attacks as I understand it. Freaks me out.

If guns become illegal, will being American becomes illegal (a question to ponder), then what is it to say that it is impossible for the next Civil War(or Revolution) to spark off. Maybe not a big thing at first but you've got the Ku Klux Klan, Militia types, Militant White Supremecist types, who often times stress firearms proficiency and occassionally engage in drilling and simulating combat scenarios.

Then there's explosives which are far easier to make than firearms, homemade nerve agents are easier to make than firearms, low-grade RPGs and Katusha rockets are probably easier to make(look at Hezbollah) than firemarms, slitting someone's throat while they sleep is probably easier than making a firearm, using a woman as a decoy to lure an armed fascist supporting opprressor to a place of privacy to kill them and take their arms is easier than making a firearm, going to the homes of the armed fascist oppressor supporter and killing them and their families and taking their arms, frightenningly it could be considered by the dangerous and desperate should Americans be stripped of their rights. The list is a long one folks, Washington pays folks to think of these things (a grandfather of mine was employed in one of their think tanks during the 70s) and they have all said that where this is a will there is a way and nothing can stop it, it's just a matter of bodies and ba**s.

Guns get made illegal in this Country, the USA, it's frigging scary folks. What's to stop the 'spark' that sets it all aflame. Maybe I'm looking too far to the fortitude of the American spirit but lets remember, those freedom loving great Americans in Montana talked of recession should the 2nd Amendment be destroyed (let's be real, saying the 2nd Amendment is a collective right is destroying the intended purpose of the 2nd Amendment), and the seccessionist movement might be a small rag tag group of isolated fringe elements but so was Castro, so was Chairman Mao, so was Hitler, so was Stalin.

If the American government ends the 2nd Amendment, do we still have the United States of America or the Fascist States of America, and will everyone hold that government to be a legitimate government that deserves loyalty and law abidment, will everyone not see that government as a threat, something diseased and evil that should be removed from existence. One last frightening thought, Timothy McVeigh was one man with a Uhaul truck and a thousand pounds of fertilizer (yes Ammonium Nitrate but that's just a few visits to Home Depot and the aid of a coffee grinder, as the News[CNN] has shown in previous airings once not all too long where they showed New York detectives refining a thousand pounds of Ammonium nitrate) that killed 168 people, he didn't use any guns and the total cost of the ammonium nitrate was probably still cheaper than a brand new Kimber. What could happen with a thousand Timothy McVeighs walking around, what could happen if they target power grids, key bridges, Hydro-Electric damns (one those damns maybe the one that aids in the supply of most of California's with water), shoot what about ten thousand Timothy McVeighs. It scares me real bad folks real bad.

Well you all try to sleep now and I'm going to pray we never have to a face an America that has made being American illegal because the thought of it downright scares me.
 
You know, the question has an answer.
There was a time before guns. Prior to the introduction of gunpowder.
Go into a history book and find out how nice and peaceful human societies were before guns.
Yeah .... scarry, ain't it?
 
We're talking 1930s-era Germany, not 1943 Poland with WWII and the Holocaust in full swing.

The ghetto uprising was a classic example of too little, too late and accordingly an ultimate failure.

Kristallnacht (Crystal Night, when attacks on Jewish businesses broke so many windows) was on November 9–10, 1938. The Wannsee Conference, where the "Final Solution" the decision to exterminate the Jews (and many other people) was on January 20, 1942.

Between those two dates, there was much that could have been done, but was not done. On May 13, 1939, the German transatlantic liner St. Louis sailed from Hamburg, Germany, for Havana, Cuba. On the voyage were 937 passengers, most of them Jews fleeing the Nazis. The Jews were not allowed to land in Cuba, and the ship tried other countries -- including the United States, where they were also turned away. They finally retuirned to Germany, and ultimately almost all the passengers died in the Holocaust.

The entire holocaust was a classic example of too little, too late. But it's hard to deny the old adage, "Desperate situations call for desperate measures." Had the Jews possessed arms, they would have had a choice -- and if enough of them had made the choice to resist, the outcome might have been much different.
 
But that's a big "if."

I suspect that most had no inkling of what would soon transpire, that the situation may degenerate into genocide.

Indeed, having the means alone is not a very effective guarantee that the people will never be murdered en masse by a dictatorial government.

Unshakable will and persistence, as well as training and organization are absolutely essential.
 
There will always be guns. Period. :)

When there aren't SUPPOSED to be any guns, there will still be guns. PERIOD. :rolleyes:

The only difference will then be that the people who shouldn't have guns will have them and the law-abiding citizens won't have them. :uhoh:

So, what would happen is people would be easy targets for robbery, burglary, rape, etc., ad nauseum. :barf:
 
But that's a big "if."

Actually, it's a small "if" -- look at how Korean shopkeepers defended their stores in the LA riots.

A little resistance early in the game could have made a big difference.
I suspect that most had no inkling of what would soon transpire, that the situation may degenerate into genocide.

Many did -- the people who sailed on the Saint Louis are an example. Many Jews moved valuables to Switzerland (where they have drawn interest for years, since the original depositors didn't survive to reclaim them.)

Clearly, people had a good idea that very bad times were coming.
Indeed, having the means alone is not a very effective guarantee that the people will never be murdered en masse by a dictatorial government.

Actually, it is. There is a concept called "force in being." Basically, it means before you start to screw over someone, you have to take account his ability to defend himself.

Unshakable will and persistence, as well as training and organization are absolutely essential.
And if you want to be sure people don't organize and train, you disarm them.
 
Look a Rwanda they did not particularly need guns to hack and chop thousands of people to death. I'm not really religous but the first murder in the bible was with a rock.
 
Clearly, people had a good idea that very bad times were coming.

But nothing like the magnitude and circumstances of the Holocaust.

Of course, all this amounts to mere suspicion or speculation on our part.

The threat is no longer Hitler’s Holocaust and there is no point trying to re-fight WWII.
 
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