"Project Argentine" (7.65 cases from .30-06)

[ProfessorX]

While I'm new to reloading, I'm FASCINATED by the idea of making my own brass. As it is, the only brass I've found is made by Norma, more than $1.50 EACH case, and on back order. For the record, I don't reload to save money (actually, I'm spending lots of money ..LOL) I'm doing it for the joy of it. Since I stopped playing with old cars, reloading helps scratch my "mechanical itch". I've only reloaded a few thousand pistol rounds and just started making my first bottleneck (.223) rounds. I enjoy the learning curve.
I've thought about startiing a thread entitled "Project Argentine" where I could share the experience of making brass by "conversion" of brass of another caliber. my idea is to write the thread fom the perspective of a new reloader and that perhaps it (the thread) could serve as resource to other newbies or even to more experienced reloaders who are "converting" cases for the first time. I did a search of this Forum and did not find much info...of course I may have done a poor job of searching. I'm hoping there are others on the Forum (read more experienced) who might be willing to help and guide me in this endeavor.

So.....I shall begin my search for knowledge. I'm looking to convert .30-06 cases into 7.65 Agentine Mauser (also known as 7.65 Belgian Mauser or 7.65 x 53). Can anyone direct me to websites, articles, books I could read, etc so that I may learn how it is done....and then do it? Thanks for any help.

 

[Rico567]

I've never done 7.65 Argie from .30-06, the only conversion I've ever done is to .375 Whelen Improved. Fundamentally, it was done in two stages, first down to .35, then to .375, then check length, trim, fire form, trim again. Hard to say, in your situation. There's no real difference in caliber, case length / shoulder angle are likely to be the changes. It might be something as simple as running the .30-06 case into the 7.65 Argentine size die, then trim (that's basically all that's required to make .35 Whelen from .30-06), or it could be much more complicated than that. If you could get at the archives of Wolf Press, I'll bet there'd be an article in there that would answer your question.

This series of pictures compares cartridges: http://orygie.ru/gallery-patrons-e.php

Scroll down to the sixth set, and you'll see the 7.65 x 53 right next to the .30-06. The Argie is a shorter round, so maybe a well-lubed case, cut off to the right length, could just use a 7.65 x 53 size die as a form die with the depriming stem removed. The Wikipedia article on the 7.65 x 53 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.65×53mm_Argentine) states: "Reloadable cartridge cases can easily be produced by resizing and trimming .30-06 brass and .303 British load data provides a useful point from which to work."

 

[RentaCop]

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/69...765mm-argentine-mauser-from-30-06-springfield

 

[NCsmitty]

Welcome to THR, ProfessorX.

I have nothing to add to the conversation but I've been reloading for over 50 years and it's still fun. Your resurrection of that great old 7.65 Argentine by reforming '06 brass will be rewarding, and you'll have a smile on your face when you fire that first round that you made from scratch. There's nothing like it.
Good luck and good shooting.


NCsmitty

 

[LAGS]

I dont see why you cant make the Argi out of .30-06 cases.
I recently made up some 8x57 Mauser cases out of .30-06 cases.
I removed the Expander from the die, and full length sized the lubed case in an 8mm sizer die.
Then I reinserted the expander back into the die and full length sized them again to expand the neck.
Then I had to trim off some of the neck with a Dremmel tool and trim them to the proper length on my case trimmer.

Doing it in two steps rather than one helps prevent the expander from getting stuck in the case after the sizing.
The Expander works better when it is Expanding the neck as it is going IN rather than when being pulled back thru the case after the sholder is repositioned.
It is just a matter of prefferance I guess, but the cases came out great.

The 1909 I had years ago was already taken out to 7.65 -06 when I bought it, so I never got the chance to play with the original caliber.
I have had a few 8mm-06's also in years gone bye.
I guess years ago it was more marketable to rechamber surplus rifles than to make custom ammo or casings.
Back then, Just buy factory .30-06 and fire it in your rifle, then reload the fire formed cases with the right dies and correct diameter bullets.

 

[nambu1]

I have made many 7.65 from formed 06. I found that you will have to ream the neck with a 303 Wilson reamer to thin the brass or it is extremely tight and the bolt may not close.

 

[hovercat]

I have done it.
Annealing before forming helps. Also, remove the deprime/expander plug before forming. Trimming with the lee trimmer is possible but takes a long time. A solid bench is needed, a table top with the press clamped to it is not enough. After trimming/chamfering, a final resize with the expander plug is needed.

 

[ProfessorX]

Thanks for all the help and input. (previously, I had been on another forum where I got my bxlls busted for being new to reloading....as if they never started out "new"). I especially like the RCBS die suggested by RentaCop. I went to the Midway site and it's on backorder so I clicked on product notification and will look elsewhere in the meantime. The RCBS number is 14365. I'll be doing a search later. Also, I can see where I'll need to anneal the .30-06 brass. There's plenty of info about annealing brass on Youtube. Think I'll start there. Please keep the info flowing. Thanks again.

 

[floydster]

Been doing it for over 50 years just using a standard 7.65 die, actually an old Herters die I have, just anneal the 06 cases before resizing--some of my brass is 1942

 

[clearcut]

Hi X, I just worked up 20 7.65's from '06's I start by de-capping. cutting the necks off by chucking the neck in my drill press and use a fine tooth hacksaw,I don't cut the shoulder just the neck,next they are annealed with a map gas torch,lubed. full length sized (lots of stress on bench)then trimmed to 2.106 and chamferd, re sized then loaded .270 cases will work as well. be sure to mark them so they don't get chambered in the wrong rifle!! a .311 bullet might make mess in a .270 or '06. I use a sharpy in the extraction groove.I got my lee dies from midsouth .I hope this helps.

Welcome to THR
CC

 

[Twmaster]

I make my Argie brass from a few different large rifle cases. .30-06, .270WIN, etc.

The only thing you need to watch is using Lee dies to push the necks back. There is a weep hole for lube to escape. Sometimes a divot will form in the brass at that weep hole.

I have a Redding trim die like the one shown from RCBS. Works great.

Now go make some more brass and shoot that Argentine rifle!

 

[Swampman]

A few years back, I formed quite a few 7.65x53 cases from '06 brass.
A few caveats:
-Imperial Sizing Wax is the best lube I've found for reforming cases. It'll save a lot of effort and reduce the loss rate considerably. Used properly, it'll also keep you from getting oil dents on the shoulder.
-I generally love Lee dies, but as Twmaster pointed out, the size and location of the pressure relief hole makes them a poor choice for reforming cases.
-While annealing is probably a good idea, make sure you know what you're doing before you attempt it. I formed many of them before I even knew what annealing was and they worked fine.
-I found that neck turning or reaming wasn't needed when I formed the cases from commercial Winchester brass. As always,YMMV.

 

[Twmaster]

I should clarify. Lee dies are a great value. You can form brass in them if you are careful and rotate your brass while gradually pushing the neck back while forming brass. Don't be afraid of using Lee dies. Just understand what they are doing and work around that.

 

[Hobie]

I use a form and trim die. Some cases could do with a neck turning or reaming. Annealing can extend case life. I have also used .280 Rem, .270, 8x57, and .25-06 brass.