The Night Rider
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That's not a bug, that's a feature
PSA: Don't try to hide bullets.
- Thread starter Mk-211
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The attempting to conceal part that wasnt in checked baggage?
RetiredUSNChief
Member
To be fair, it was wrong likely because TSA fed them the wrong information.
A bullet is not a round of ammunition, as we know. It's an inert hunk of metal(s) forming ONLY the projectile portion. Unless it was something like an unspent tracer round, it's not dangerous at all.
As someone else said...he could have simply mailed it, which wouldn't have violated anything either.
At issue here is the TSA can pretty much call whatever they want to be "dangerous". We already know (in writing) that the TSA thinks stupid things like nail clippers are dangerous/forbidden devices.
EDIT:
I'd like to know exactly what the guy was arrested for. This not being an actual round of ammunition, and just a piece of inert metal(s), there's a clear argument to be made that this ISN'T an actual dangerous device at all. It would also be worth looking at what the TSA rules specifically call out as forbidden (which I'm not going to waste my time doing at this point in time). If the rules specify ammunition components, then there may actually be a case to charge him criminally.
However, there may be other charges that could be levied with this. For example, I don't know how this might fit in with historical relics. It is illegal in some places to remove historical relics, like historical Civil War locations. Fort Moltrie, for example, you cannot go about with a metal detector finding and removing bullets, cannon balls, jacket buttons, etc. from these places because they're protected historical areas. Are there places in Hawaii which are deemed such, based on the attack on Pearl Harbor in 1941? If this is a spent round from such areas, there may be criminal charges related to that which could be levied against him, separately from the TSA issue.
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The guy probably could have dropped it in his suitcase next to his socks and flown home just fine with it. Loaded ammo has to be in factory or plastic boxes designed for it to pass tsa inspection, but I doubt anyone would even notice a loose inert projectile stuffed in next to your razors.
doubleh
Member
I have been around a long time and nave developed a definately poor view of government and news agencies in general.. I have decided finding an intelligent government employee to have little better chance that stumbling onto a real hen's tooth. The media may actually have a few more than government but they use it to lie to us.
A smart lawyer should be able to soak the TSA for some taxpayer funds over this.
A smart lawyer should be able to soak the TSA for some taxpayer funds over this.
CapnMac
Member
As a guess. It was not the violation of the Common Carrier's prohibited cargo list (which is covered in CFR). It was the commotion he made when they went and pulled him out of the Gate waiting area and told him he had to come and answer their questions post haste.
Checked bags go through scanners, just underneath the passenger areas in airports. Our guy here would have gone through the passenger TSA screening process just like all the rest of the folks. Probably huffed and puffed about that dehumanizing process all the way to the Gate, too (unless stopped to ge get stuff in the airport stores, etc.).
Now, what marroon goes, well, I'll just put this full thermos of coffee in my checked bag, is beyond the scope of THR (I've had Kona coffee, and it can be good, not good enough to want to stash some in a thermos for over a 4-5 hour plane ride
).Now, whether the comparison of how this CFR violation of Common Carrier rules mirrors those for shipping firearms via FedEx, UPS or similar common carriers, I will leave to our esteemed moderators.
herrwalther
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Not sure what the big deal is. I have flown home with 50BMG rounds in checked baggage (post-9/11) with no issues. Did the rules change at some point on what is too big to fly with?
Lo-Profile
Member
I have more than a few of these found while in the military. Most are old WW2 vintage. I found one while walking on the reef in Guam. Was just laying there.
And THAT is probably the rest of the story.
He did something remarkably suspicious and probably got mouthy instead of having done the standup thing.
Do you though? I'm not finding anything that says that you have to declare ammo in checked baggage. It's not something I've ever dealt with, since I've always had a gun to declare whenever I had ammo.
Riomouse911
Member
I know American Airlines policy is to declare ammo at the counter, show its packaged correctly, then secure it. I usually fly AA, but I rarely bring firearms along on trips.
Southwest and Alaska Air doesn't say declare, but I have done it at the counter to show its properly packaged. I found a screaming deal one year on RWS match .22 ammo up in Oregon a few years ago and bought them out. I had both my checked luggage bags searched when I was checking ammo on Alaska (TSA literature was placed inside to let me know it was). That was on a Portland/LA flight. Both bags were all secured, the declaration tag was in each bag with the .22 ammo boxes in a locked MTM plastic ammo box, so all was good.
As always, check the policy of the airlines you are flying first.
Southwest and Alaska Air doesn't say declare, but I have done it at the counter to show its properly packaged. I found a screaming deal one year on RWS match .22 ammo up in Oregon a few years ago and bought them out. I had both my checked luggage bags searched when I was checking ammo on Alaska (TSA literature was placed inside to let me know it was). That was on a Portland/LA flight. Both bags were all secured, the declaration tag was in each bag with the .22 ammo boxes in a locked MTM plastic ammo box, so all was good.
As always, check the policy of the airlines you are flying first.
Stay safe.
This is an interesting question that I don't think I've ever seen brought up before. I read through the regs governing this and can't find anything saying that ammo in checked baggage must be declared, by law. Individual airline policy may vary, of course, but as far as I can tell, there's no regulation or law that says that ammo "must" be declared. https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-I/subchapter-C/part-175#175.10I know American Airlines policy is to declare ammo at the counter, show its packaged correctly, then secure it. I usually fly AA, but I rarely bring firearms along on trips.
Southwest and Alaska Air doesn't say declare, but I have done it at the counter to show its properly packaged. I found a screaming deal one year on RWS match .22 ammo up in Oregon a few years ago and bought them out. I had both my checked luggage bags searched when I was checking ammo on Alaska (TSA literature was placed inside to let me know it was). That was on a Portland/LA flight. Both bags were all secured, the declaration tag was in each bag with the .22 ammo boxes in a locked MTM plastic ammo box, so all was good.
As always, check the policy of the airlines you are flying first.
Stay safe.
Mosin77
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I was in the airport the other day and realized as I was just about to put my carryon briefcase on the conveyor in TSA pre, that I’d thrown a bag of 9mm in there the other day and forgotten about it. I very quickly felt around in the bottom of the compartment, grabbed the ammo, and dumped it in the trash. Whew. Would have been a lot more interesting conversation in just a few minutes if I hadn’t remembered.
Old Dog
Member
Eh, I was flying back to Detroit a few months back and the TSA bubbas held my backpack and asked me what I wanted them to do with the 100-round box of Mini-Mags. A tad embarrassed; I'd made a last-minute switch to another pack in favor of more pockets, forgetting I'd used it for the range a ways back and damn, all those sneaky zipper pockets, missed the ammo. Told 'em, trash it if neither of them wanted it, they tossed it in a can and I was on my way. No worries, no aggravation, no recriminations, remonstration or criminal charges.
Needless to say, that's the last time I ever let something like this happen when I'm flying commercial.
Riomouse911
Member
Looks like you are right. I was following AA policy, I thought it was a mandated rule.
Thanks for the research and information.
Stay safe.
A thermos full of liquid is fine in your checked luggage, unless the liquid in question is something you can’t fly with in any way. Ammo under 5kg/11lbs is ok in your luggage unless it isn’t in the original box or a suitable aftermarket box. I’ve never seen a requirement to declare ammo by the feds, an airline may have its own rules on that. A copper jackered lead bullet is not ammo. I don’t see where a crime was committed. Was it a weird, suspicious way to transport a bullet? Yes.
Yeah, he doubled down on things you can’t fly with. It must have sounded good at the time.
You want to be careful using your range bag as a carry on. The dog getting a whiff of powder can be interesting as can the TSA swabbing for explosive residue. Check out the random SSSS you can get on your boarding pass. It’s an irritating, aggravating, intrusive experience.
Ignition Override
Member
Some TSA agents are military veterans.
But for some of the others, they are wearing their
First Uniform….
But for some of the others, they are wearing their
First Uniform…
.
Stupid people doing stupid things is not really on topic for THR.
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