Questions about modern rifles

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Oolong

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Hello, i don't believe i've posted in this forum before and i had a few questions.

1. which would be a better purchase a bullpup like the tavor or one of the higher class AR-15s like the REC-7 and MK-12.

2. Due to my love of rustic looking guns is it possible to put wood on any of the high class ARs?

3. Finally, In your opinion what's the best rifle you own.
 
1. which would be a better purchase a bullpup like the tavor or one of the higher class AR-15s like the REC-7 and MK-12.
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Better for what purpose? A bullpup like a Tavor will be shorter overall for the same bbl length, but it has some disadvantages like slower mag changes.

As for the other two, you can't get a real Mk 12, but you could build what could be assumed to be a close clone based on what information is openly available. But you're really comparing apples to oranges here: The Mk 12 is a medium range designated marksman rifle meant for relatively long range shooting. The REC7 is an AR styled rod type piston operated carbine designed to be run suppressed and generally set up for close quarters work. The Mk 18 CQBR is a more direct comparison to the REC7.

So, what do you want to do with the rifle?
 
A bullpup Tavor will be better for urban close in close quarters combat like in Aleppo or Ramallah. A larger traditional AR will be better for across the field rural fighting like in Afghan. It's all about where you will be operating.
 
I kinda just wanted to do some target shooting with it, this will be the first gun i own and i dont want a piece of junk.

also not serving.
 
There's a huge difference between a quality entry level modern rifle, and the highly specialized AR style rifles you listed in your first post. Since this will be your first firearm you're far better off getting a good entry level rifle like a S&W M&P15 Sport II and learning how to use it. Use the money left over in your budget to buy a basic sling, a couple cases of ammo, and to pay for a carbine course. Take the carbine course and shoot the hack out of the rifle in local competitions after that. Once you've gotten that experience under your belt you'll know the type of competitions you like shooting, and you'll know if you're better served making a Mk 12 clone, buying a REC7 and a can, or simply just upgrading your entry level carbine will best serve you for favored game.
 
If you're just looking for a range toy, get any of the lower-priced AR's on the market that are reputable. S&W15 is a good choice. Get familiar with the platform before you start tinkering with it. No need to buy a Colt or other top-of-the-line AR yet. Also, make sure you consider sights or optics in your budget.
 
pup like a Tavor will be shorter overall for the same bbl length, but it has some disadvantages like slower mag changes.
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It may look like it but I've found mag changes to be much faster and easier with the Tavor than my AR.

Which is better is tough. ARs are easy to build and swap parts on, with the Tavor you stuck with two barrel choices in 556 and one in 9mmP, plus different handguard sand rails.

I find I shoot my Tavor better than my AR because the point of balence makes for easier offhand shooting and maneuverability.

BSW
 
An entry level quality ar15 can be had for 600 bucks and is AMAZINGLY easy to use. A tavor is at least $1600, and while amazing in design and portability, has no where near the aftermarket support. I would love a Tavor, but would i have it over an ar15, no i wouldn't. Get an ar, mags, ammo, and a decent sighting system (irons, optic, or both) and some training. Once you are comfortable with that, go see if the tavor is still interesting. My .02 cents

Sent from my LGLS740 using Tapatalk
 
1. I have exactly zero interest in the Tavor, or in general any bullpup. It's a solution in search of a problem. High end accurized ARs are certainly fun, and there are a lot of good manufacturers. The fact that you're comparing one to the other is a little odd though.

2. Yes, a couple companies do wood stocked ARs. Turnbull for one. But IMO it's counterproductive. One of the advantages of the modern AR is the free float barrel, which gives it much better field zero stability than most guns (slings, bipods, improvised rests etc. don't move zero). Going to a wood handguard means no free floating barrel, and you lose much of the point of a modern AR.

3. This is sort of a meaningless question, because different rifles are for different purposes. It's pretty much meaningless to say whether a dangerous game rifle or a battle rifle is "better". Here's several rifles I've been 100% happy with:
LMT MWS
LMT MRP (I've got limited experience with this, but thus far it's done OK)
Winchester M70 7mm rem mag super grade
Browning 1886 .45-90 (custom)
Remington 700 long range 6.5 Creedmoor (custom)
M/96 Swedish Mauser (6.5x55 Mauser)

They all serve different roles though...
 
What if i just want to go to a range and shoot?
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Ive had mostly AR rifles. The pure enjoyment of shooting, for me, is much higher with a rifle than a carbine. The noise is less, the ability to spot my hits with a scope is much better with the rifle. By rifle, I mean like the Colt AR-14 A4, the flat top 20" barrel gun with excellent iron sights in the removable carry handle, and ease of installing a scope as desired. The rifles aren't very popular these days, but for the actual shooting part, are head and shoulders above carbines and more fun for me to shoot. If you get serious about accuracy later, you can build or rebarrel the upper receiver with a match grade barrel and free float handguard. I wouldn't try to start with "The best!!" until you have shot a bit and get to the point you can actually tell the difference in the various improvements. I also very much prefer the fixed rifle stock. The siding carbine stocks feel like a loose wobbly underfolder AK stock to me. Im just weird like that.

If you are OK with a higher quality gun, I wouldn't look for the cheapest way in the door. Buying a medium grade gun will generally give better resale down the road if that matters, and I simply enjoy quality guns, and yes, I enjoy the little horse on the side of the Colts (guess the new ones don't have that?).
 
What separates the ar rifle from the carbine? is it the barrel length or the buffer tube?
 
An AR rifle is typically 20" barrel and fixed stock.

An AR Carbine is typically a 16" barrel with a Collapsible Stock.

You would be hard pressed to do better then an AR... I consider it to be the equivalent of the Small Block Chevy... everyone makes parts for it, and you can make / buy exactly what you like. It is a good all around rifle.

The AR can cover the bases from blaster to accuracy... and do it reliably.. even if you did need parts, they are inexpensive for high quality and readily available.
 
I own 5 AR's in different SBR configuration. I owned a Tavor for about a week and luckily didnt lose my ( Non Highroad word ) on it. Worse trigger this side of a AUG. Someone somewhere someday may invent a trigger for a bullpup that doesnt suck but I'm not holding my breath for it.
 
What separates the ar rifle from the carbine? is it the barrel length or the buffer tube?
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Both.

Pictures may simply it.

Rifle type,

http://www.colt.com/portals/0/productimages/2014/AR15A4_700w.png

Carbine type,

http://www.colt.com/portals/0/productimages/2015/LE6920_700W.png

The rifles are generally accepted as softer, smoother shooting. One aspect may be the port pressure. The carbine has about double the port pressure as the rifle (port where the gas is tapped off to operate the action), and the bolt carrier cycling isn't as sharp or fast in the rifles. How it manifests itself to me was it wasn't possible to spot my hits at 600 yards with a scoped carbine, it was easy with a rifle with the same scope on the same targets. Carbines have a variety of buffers to tune them somewhat, and can be made a little smoother with the right ammo, rifles just one weight of buffer, and they just work. The carbine seem noticeably louder to me also. Again, same ammo, same location. 4" shorter barrel is noticeable in muzzle blast to me.

To each their own, that's just my observations. For me carbines just aren't fun to shoot compared to a rifle. If carbines were the only choice, Id likely not have any interest in shooting them.
 
What if i just want to go to a range and shoot?
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For just going to the range and shooting I would think the higher end AR would be a better option than the tavor. Better trigger, better accuracy, more customization. Others have said just get a cheap one but if you have the money to spend on a more expensive one I would go that route. They have better triggers, barrels, free float handguards, and are just all around smoother and more enjoyable to shoot. If you budget is under 2k I would recommend getting a Daniel Defense. If you could go a little over 2k then get a JP enterprises.
 
I have a pepper laminate stock and grip with a freefloat tube on mine, and I like it.

http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/stock-parts/furniture-sets/ar-15-m16-wood-rifle-furniture-sets-prod38906.aspx

Ironwood designs also has wood stocks, as well as boyds gunstocks. I believe the wood stocks that windham vex is using are boyds, or at least that is what it looks like to me, as the shape is the same as boyds, and the other 2 places mentioned have more a a2style shape.

I did ask lucid about the possibility of a wood freefloat tube, and they said they had some requests, but I don't know the status of it.

If they had a freefloat tube, I would have gotten nutmeg instead of pepper.
 
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So if a Ruger AR-556 and S&W M&P 15 are entry level guns what is a mid level gun?
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The M&P15 Sport is an entry level AR that's actually really well made. The M&P15T is a mid priced model with some higher end features. If you're wanting a more pseudo M4 carbine the FN-15 is a good start, as is the Del-Ton Extreme Duty 316.
 
Not at all. They emerged from Bankruptcy and have been building AR-15's and 1911's at a dizzying rate. The rest of their catalog is back burnered for the time being although they eek out a few SAA's .
 
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