Questions about new .31 cal pocket Remington

[Ghost Dog]

I just purchased a new .31 cal brass frame pocket Remington. I sent it into Traditions due to a spur on one of the chambers. I also had noticed that the hammer did not lock into the slots between the nipples (making it possible to carry with all five chambers loaded,) I asked them in my note to address this as well. When it came back the spur had been filed off so that problem's solved but the hammer still doesn't lock in the notches between the nipples. Is this normal for this model? or, do i need to send it back again?

Another issue, when cleaning and oiling it I had the cylinder out and at half cock, with no trigger gaurdon this model I wanted to make sure the trigger was solidly locked up, i put what I would consider to be a little more than moderate pressure on the trigger and to my surprise the hammer snapped down! Again, is this normal? can I adjust this myself? or do I need to send it back to Traditions? :banghead: Any help will be appreciated!

Thanks, G D

 

[Tommygunn]

As far as the hammer not fitting the notches, I would guess either that the hammer, or the cylinder has the incorrect profile. I think it is highly unlikely a company that sells them would alter this as they probably don't consider it a defect.
The burr on the chamber would be a defect.
I have a couple of these Remmie .31 caliber, one Pietta and the other Armi San Marco. IIRC the ASM doesn't have a hammer that fits those safety notches. I don't even recall off hand if the Pietta one does or not ... I seem to believe it does. Maybe not well.
These were milled into the heels of cylinders on originals, which were considered tools and were actually intended to be carried and used as weapons.
Modern replicas are more hobby/ sports and sometimes the manufacturer does not feel a need to make some of these safety features worl.
The pins on the heels of many Colt cylinders were usually omitted on Armi San Marco Colt Replicas and on some of the Pietta.
ASM not longer is in business, and recently Pietta has improved their weapons and more of them have safety pins or notches.

 

[ElvinWarrior]

I have two of those Pietta Remington 31 Cal pocket pistols. I took the cylinders and the hammers down to a gunsmith, and had him re-mill the locking slots just a tad deeper, and shave the hammer tip just a tad. They lock down just fine now. I also had that problem with the hammer falling out of lock, 5 minutes with a jewelers file, fixed it, the locking engagement was not deep enough. In addition to these two things, two more things of note. Both of my pistols had a problem with the nipples being seated down too far into the cylinders, I fixed this with thin spacers under the nipples. Stock from the factory, the pistols only would fire one or two of the cylinders, now they all fire reliably.

The last and MOST IMPORTANT problem with this model is the loading lever. the flange where the pivot screw threads through the lever, is entirely too thin, take it apart and give it a look. The Dixie catalog says, that this pistol is supposed to be loaded with a .321 ball, which is a VERY TIGHT fit. I wouldn't recommend loading it with a ball that big, go with the LEE .319 instead. The fit is so tight, and the flange so thin on the pistol, that I actualy pulled the loading lever apart, tearing the thin metal at the pivot base... Agin... :::: sigh :::: back to the workshop....

I don't use the built in loading levers to seat the projectiles down anymore, I only use it to lock down the cylinder pin. I load my cylinders outside of the pistol, using an inexpensive loading vise I picked up from NAA (North American Arms) for their modern BP 5 Shot 22 Magnum pistol known as the NAA Companion BP 22 Magnum. It is a hand held vice, but seats the bullets down very well on the pietta 31 cal cylinders, and they are only $7.00 for the vise.

Welcome to the Pietta Remington 31 Cal owners club !!!

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"



P.S...

If you're interested in AFFORDABLY priced, good quality BP guns, give Middlesex Village Tranding Post a gander. The average price of their pistols is $325.00 and the average price of their rifles/muskets is $625. They carry a a really nice two barreled 20 ga smoothbore pistol for $399.00 that form, fit and function is nearly the same gun as an overpriced uberti or pedersoli Howdah Pistol at 6/700 bux a pop. They also carry a two barrel flintlock 20 ga pistol for $425.00 and a full two barreled 20 gauge flintlock shotgun for 725.00. Compare that price for a fully nickel plated double barreled flintlock shotgun, to a Pedersoli cap lock at on or about $1,200/1,400 !!!

 

[Vermonter]

I wouldn't trust the steel in those Middlesex guns.

 

[Ghost Dog]

So, would it be reasonable to expect Traditions to work on these problems since it is a brand new gun? I know if my .44 cal 1858 had these issues when new I would have expected the company to make them right.

Thanks, G D

 

[ElvinWarrior]

Ghost Dog,

Like others have said, These are design issues, not defect issues, I don't think there is a fix for the loading lever pivot hole being drilled too close to the edge of the flange, that would require Pietta to re-design the entire loading lever, possibly effecting the mounting flange, and the spacing on the barrel, and all kinds of things. They may offer to replace the nipples on the pistol, with good quality ones that won't seat down too far, but, again, that's their call, they may or may not decide to do that for you.

I would email or call them, and discuss it with them before I shipped it back.

Sincerely,

Elvin Warrior... aka... David, "EW"

 

[ElvinWarrior]

Vermonter,

Just because Uberti, Pietta and Pedersoli have figured out that they can overcharge us stupid Americans 4 and 5 times what a product is actually worth, and have us on our hands and knees begging for them doesn't mean that their steel is any better than anyone elses steel. All it means is that they have figured out very well what the breaking points are for pricing, and little else.

And if you own any actual vintage, antique guns, and you fire them, I assure you, with the vast advances in metal technology today, any steel made today, by anyone, anywhere, is vastly superior to anything made 150, 200 or more years ago. If you can fire an antique arm, with confidence, you should have no problems firing a modern one.

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"

 

[Vermonter]

I wouldn't use a full load in an antique gun.

Here's some related discussion regarding quality http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=527945

 

[ElvinWarrior]

Vermonter,

As I have said, the Italians have done a very good marketing job, they understand the market psychology of Americans very well.

It is interesting to note, that the discussion limits itself to comparing a Pedersoli, probably the top Italian brand, with generic "India" guns of no particular brand. Why didn't the poll compare a modestly priced Italian gun, to a modestly priced Indian one from a particular firm? Naturally, if you compare the very best of something, to another product not intended to be the very best, but much more affordable, you are not comparing apples to apples are you? The poll was biased in it's perspective to begin with.

Just because a number of persons have bought into their marketing techniques does not mean they are right, it just means they have bought the hype.

Remember, it is often the dissenting voice that is the most informed, and most correct.

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"

 

[Ghost Dog]

EW, I understand about the loading lever being a design flaw and was aware of that before purchasing this particular model, but there are notches cut into the cylinder for the purpose of setting the hammer in between the nipples.

Also, it is designed to lock the trigger at half cock to safely allow loading.

I put in a call to Traditions yesterday and was told the gunsmith will call me back.
Hopefully the will stand behind there product. I've been very happy with my .44 1858 and expected the same from the .31 cal pocket model.

Thanks again for your feed back, G D

 

[ReloaderEd]

Well done my man, well done!!!!

 

[Ghost Dog]

I finally got to talk to the gunsmith at Traditions. He told me he checked the other .31 cal pocket Remmies there and none of them locked up on the notches between the nipples with the hammer. I may try to mill out one notch and mark it so I'll have one that functions properly so I can load all chambers then safely put it in a holster.

He said the notch for the half cock possition could be filed out a little deeper in the hammer and said if I send it back in he would do that for me. I may take a look at it and if it is pretty straight forward, just do it myself.

EW, I took your concerns about the loading lever to heart and spent an hour in the shop today making a loading vice so I can load the cylinder out of the frame.

If we get some nice weather this week the daughter and I will have to head out to the farm and make some smoke!

 

[sltm1]

Ghostdog, it would bereally easy to adjust the hammer width to accomodate the safety notches, (a carboard center nail file would work for this job), my guess would be removing ony a couple of 1000ths and only a couple of mm's up the side's. As for loading, yes, get a press. Here's a pic of one I built for mine.

This is my "baby" Remmie, I shortend the barrel so it would actually FIT in my pocket.

 

[BHP FAN]

that has a ''business'' like appearance!

 

[tpelle]

Sltm1, how do you keep the "loading lever" (cylinder base pin retainer) from dropping down and locking-up the cylinder a la the Colt Walker?

 

[ElvinWarrior]

Tpelle,

I have often wondered about that one myself !!! I hope we get an interesting answer to it !!!

My guess would be to take an old shoe lace and tie it around the barrel in a nice, pretty shoe bow... LOL... Now we can all look like those poor hillbilly cousins with everything they own held together with strings and wire !!!

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka.. David, "EW"

 

[sltm1]

tpelle, I took the ram off the loading lever and squeezed the connecting arms together so that when reattached it was a jam fit with no movement. I was going to solder the whole apparatus together, but this was an easier fix and just as effective. To remove the cylinder, the loading arm retaining screw must be removed, then the loading arm. Fixing the Walker is a whole nother kettle of fish!! I used to make a springy brass collar that slipped on the barrel (actually clamped with a little pressure), with a brass tube soldered on the bottom that captured the loading lever, however, one size does NOT fit all Walkers so I stopped making them for sale a while back. A couple of guy's here bought them and on "The Firing Line Forum" also.