Range officer recoil?

[susieqz]

hiya, guys.
i kinda fell in love with the springfield 9mm range officer in stainless.
thing is, i had a ruger p85 which i hated. i couldn't shoot it bulls eye. too much recoil for me for one hand.
the range officer is single stack so i could hold it better than a double stack.
i was thinking an all steel 1911 would calm the recoil, but i just looked up the weights.
the RO with 5'' barrel is only 3 oz heavier than the plastic p85 with 4'' barrel which i don't understand.

so, does that mean the recoil will be the same with factory ammo?
no gun shops near. i gotta buy without trying.
i can shoot anything 2 handed but i'm not interested.

your thots, please?

 

[JDR]

I had a Springfield Loaded 9mm 1911, which is very much like the Range Officer. I currently have an STI Trojan 9mm 1911. The recoil with a 9mm 1911 is very mild & manageable with Federal American Eagle 124 or 147 grain FMJ ammo, although I changed to a Wolff 9lb variable recoil spring to help cycle this ammo, which makes it even easier to rack the slide compared to the stock 14lb. recoil spring. I would also recommend getting a few Wilson 10 round Elite Tactical Magazines for a full-size 9mm 1911.

 

[susieqz]

thanks, jdr

 

[Sergei Mosin]

The P85 has an aluminum frame and is a typically overbuilt Ruger, which explains the weight. The recoil of a steel 9mm 1911 is about as gentle as you can hope to find in a centerfire handgun.

 

[susieqz]

thanks sergei.
it's good to hear it's ok for the recoil sensitive.

 

[toivo]

The recoil of a steel 9mm 1911 is about as gentle as you can hope to find in a centerfire handgun.

I'll second that. My 9mm Range Officer is the softest-shooting centerfire handgun that I've ever tried. Only rimfires shoot softer.

I have arthritic wrists, and recoil-sensitivity is a big issue for me.

 

[Edcnh]

I also have a Range Officer and find the recoil very manageable for a 45.

 

[wingman]

You sound like your a perfect candidate for reloading, AA5 powder in the 9mm,124gr bullet and the recoil is very mild. I'm not recoil sensitive because long used the 45acp, also 40 caliber but reloading gives accuracy and the ability to change felt recoil.

 

[Furncliff]

Susie... Depending on your strength and stature and your level of proficiency shooting any handgun one handed can be a challenge. I don't think you'll find the slightly heavier Range Office to be any easier than your Ruger.

I noticed your sig line said "Susie...rimfire person". To build strength and improve technique have you tried shooting with a good target pistol in .22 LR..?

I'm including a photo of the .22LR pistol that I have used very successfully to teach several female shooters.



This particular pistol is a High Standard Supermatic made in the 1950's. It has two major advantages that I see for building strength and technique. First the grip seems to fit female shooters very well and second it has removable barrel weights so that you can start out with a lighter pistol and add weight as you progress. Additionally the two slots or ports you can see at the top of the barrel at the muzzle direct some of the escaping gases upward, helping to control muzzle flip. Your choice of which pistol may be different, I only wanted to point out some features that make a target pistol easier to shoot well

Good Luck.

Tom

 

[MikeInOr]

My first full size handgun was a P89. It was stout and reliable but it was never a great shooter or all that fun to shoot for that matter. They were just awkward (but reliable) guns. Most people find the ergonomics of a 1911 MUCH nicer. The recoil on a 9mm 1911 isn't going to be that much lighter than your P85 but I would guess you will find the perceived recoil of a 1911 much less battering and find it to be much more fun to shoot than your P85.

 

[Deanimator]

The recoil of a steel 9mm 1911 is about as gentle as you can hope to find in a centerfire handgun.

Try an M1911 in .38 Special.

 

[Rock185]

Have had several all steel 9MM 1911s by various manufacturers, including Springfield. You're correct. the weight does moderate recoil. Standard pressure 9MM ammunition is very soft in a 1911. Even the hottest +P+ 9MM ammunition in a steel 1911 will have less recoil than standard 230 grain ball ammo in a 45 ACP version of the same gun.

I had a P85 years ago. Believe me, the 1911 is much easier to shoot well and reduction in felt recoil will be greater than an additional 3 Oz. in weight might suggest.....

 

[susieqz]

i've been working with a ruger 22/45 for over a year. i shoot 200-300 rounds/week.
i can sometimes get 2'' groups at 25 measured rounds.
i'd like to do the same with center fire.
i see ruger has some single actions that weigh 46 ounces.
they have plow handle grips.
would that extra weight tame a 38spc better than a 1911 can tame a 9mm?

i haven't looked at them because my single 10 is not nearly as accurate as my 22/45 but if that;s all i can shoot i can get one.
i'm mostly interested in one hand shooting at 25 yards.

 

[Walkalong]

I would not call full power factory 9MM mild from an all steel 5" 1911, but it certainly isn't heavy. I don't remember if you reload, but if you do, it can be loaded to a very pleasant level even for the recoil sensitive.

 

[MistWolf]

Susie, go rent or borrow a Range Officer & see if you like how it shoots. Or, like most of us, go buy it & try it & if you don't like it, sell or swap it

Chances are, you'll like the all steel Range Officer better. The P89 had an aluminum frame and a steel slide, which means more of the pistol's weight is moving back & forth, making the felt recoil more uncomfortable for you. But you won't actually know if the Range Officer feels better until you actually shoot it.

If it helps, my wife shoots a PPQ 9mm and likes it. Before, she would only shoot 22 rimfire

 

[rcmodel]

I'm 71 years old, and getting weaker by the month.

However, I still find nothing objectionable about 9mm recoil in any full size pistol, either steel or alloy frame.

It they sting your hand, try a shooting glove.

If the muzzle blast bothers you get better hearing protection.

(And don't confuse muzzle blast with recoil, which many people do.)

But the recoil of a 9mm shouldn't bother anyone of average strength.

PS: Revolvers 'kick' harder then auto pistols, regardless of caliber.
The auto spreads the recoil impulse out over a longer duration then a solid breech revolver.
And they use part of the recoil to operate the slide.

rc

 

[Sergei Mosin]

Try an M1911 in .38 Special.

Well sure, but there aren't too many of them around.

 

[Walkalong]

The P89 had an aluminum frame and a steel slide, which means more of the pistol's weight is moving back & forth, making the felt recoil more uncomfortable for you.

This is a very good point. I dislike a full size 1911 with an aluminum frame because of the weight of the full sized slide whipping back and with only a light frame it feels worse. I had a 4" aluminum framed 9MM that I did not care for, but love my 5" all steel one. The wieght of the steel frame helps.

That said, I love my 3" .45 ACP aluminum framed 1911. Less slide weight.

 

[Rock185]

Yes, a heavy revolver tames the recoil of 38 Spcl. more than a 1911 tames 9MM recoil. The warmest 38 Spcl. +P ammunition I have chronographed did not have the energy and recoil of standard non +P 9MM ammo. The basic 38 Spcl. 148 grain wadcutter is a wonderful round where very light recoil and/or great accuracy is desired. This round, in medium framed .38 Spcl. or .357 revolvers is very mild to shoot.

 

[susieqz]

thanks guys.
when i shot the p85 i hurt my elbow.
took weeks to get better.
that's why i'm bothering you with questions.

 

[MistWolf]

You may want to find a good coach to help you improve your shooting stance so you don't hurt your elbow

 

[MikeInOr]

It is nice to have shooting buddies. We always try out each others weapons and get a feel for what we like. My boss has a fn57... what a hoot to shoot! Too bad they are so expensive to buy and feed. Recoil is very light!

The recoil between lite 115gr 9mm's is different than the recoil of heavy 147gr 9mm ammo. You might try different types of 9mm ammo.

My recolection of my P89 is that it had a really large grip. I have large hands and didn't notice the drip size but several of my buddies did. The ergonomics / weight distribution of my P89 is what bothered and it is one of the few guns I have ever parted with. In comparison I found my 1911 in .45 acp a nicer shooter.

I own many C&R handguns most in 9mm. I use lite 9mm hand loads in these guns. Have you ever considered handloading? Finding a buddy the hand loads is a great way to start.

What ever you end up with you need to find a gun that is comforatable for you. If it isn't comfortable for you you will likely develope flinching problems. You might look around at different calibers too. My first hand gun 25+ years ago was a .380. It was a great gun to learn on. I still have it. One of my favorite guns to shoot is a Russian Tokarav in 7.62 x 25. That is a little .30 caliber bullet traveling very fast. The gun is a fair size and weight so the recoil is minimal. A friend had a Colt oficers model .380. That was a beautiful gun to shoot. It is basically a scaled down 1911 with the same action and operation. The balance was supurb and very minimal recoil. The Colt mustang is a cut down Officers .380 but it is no where near the shootability of the officers .380. A couple of my female shooting firends are very pleased with their Sigs... they just seem to fit them well.

 

[bannockburn]

susieqz

I use to start new shooters out with a Ruger Mk.I .22. Once they felt comfortable (and were proficient), shooting that I moved them on to a Star Model B (fairly close copy of a 1911 in 9mm.). Again, once they were accustomed to the 9mm. I had them try a Browning BDA in .45 ACP (in reality a SIG P220). Everyone who shot all three guns did very well working their way up through to the larger caliber guns. Both the Star and the Browning always seemed to me to be very "soft" on felt recoil. In fact my relatively petite 16 year old sister enjoyed shooting and had her best groups with the BDA.

 

[susieqz]

thanks, guys.
doesn't look like those guns will work for bulls eye.
if i can't get 2'' group at 25 yards i won't keep up the practice.
is there something in design that matters more than weight?
that star model b only weighs 38 ounces so it should have more recoil than a
RO at 42 ounces.

 

[Jim Watson]

I do not think a 9mm 1911oid is uncomfortable to shoot.

But I do not think a mass produced 9mm 1911oid is going to shoot as accurately as a good .22, I don't care what Springfield says about "match grade barrels."
If you follow out the link on the Springfield page to the American Rifleman article, you will see that a 9mm RO averaged 2.43" groups at 25 yards from a Ransom rest, with individual groups from 1.38" to 3.55". There was a lot of variation from string to string and brand to brand.
http://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2014/9/24/springfields-range-officer-m1911s/

More expensive gunmakers like Baer and Wilson put numbers in their advertising.
A standard model Baer is expected to shoot 3" at 50 yards with a 1.5" "guarantee" at substantial extra cost. Wilson says they "guarantee" 1" at 25 yards. (But the nice tight test target that comes with the gun is shot at 15 yards.)


If you want to plow money into a Range Officer, a gunsmith here says they are a good platform to customize. It could certainly get a refitted or replacement barrel that would improve accuracy to the NRA Centerfire and PPC standard. Springfield Custom will put in a real "match barrel" for $390. Will that shoot 2" at 25? I don't know. Would a $75 fitted bushing do nearly as well? I do know it would strongly depend on the ammo.