Reforming 30 cal to 7mm, need advice on issues found.

[WestKentucky]

I'm moving along quite nicely in a kit I got secondhand that included a contender barrel, dies, brass, and unopened box of bullets. Suffice it to say I have found some questions that I want answers to, and a few I really am not sure how these things happened. I'm no huge stranger to reforming caliber A to caliber B by necking down a cartridge but the two cases to the right (among others that are similarly formed) have me scratching my head a bit. See the pic below and you will see cases in various stages of transition to 7-30 waters from 30-30 which I identified. The two on the right are grossly misformed. The case with a bad/odd neck was full of tightly compacted walnut so I'm guessing that the walnut media acted kinda like hydraulic fluid and began reforming the case so that explains oddity#1 but the 1/2 length resized neck has me baffled. With this set of dies it is not possible to recreate this mistake. My only guess is that the case was formed in another set of dies. I'm not going to try it, but if a man were to attempt to fire form that case what would happen with so much air around the case? Would it be safe? Am I wrong to think that my best bet is to anneal and full length size every case for my own safety? Inspection of the heads shows that the cases have seen very heavy loads as well furthering my concern. Guys please give me a recommendation because at this point I'm considering scrapping the brass and forming all 200 or so of my once fired 30-30 into 7-30 brass.

 

[WestKentucky]

Sorry it's sideways

Try #2 on the pic.

 

[WestKentucky]

Mystery solved. From all indications and dimensions the extremely screwed up round was most like jammed into a 7.62x39 die. I will use the head for decoration of some sort, but will not be using it as a cartridge case.

 

[41 Mag]

When I form cases for mine from new 30-30 cases I use the following method.

1) lube the necks inside and out with Imperial Sizing Wax.
2) size them a little at a time until I can just close the action of the Contender with a sharp snap.
3) fire form using a mid range load and some 150gr Win bulk bullets.(these work really well on hogs also and they shoot pretty good for FF loads as well.)
4) neck size now fully formed cases and load with RL-15, and a 140gr Nosler BT.
5) anneal the necks after the third firing and so-forth thereafter.

My cases start off looking similar to your second in line and come out looking like the third. I have one batch I have over 10 loads on, and they were part of the initial load work up cases I used around 12 years or so back when I got it.

The Ballistic Tips hold together really well at the lower velocities I get from my 14" barrel compared to what you would get out of a 22-24" one. They are VERY accurate and I have gotten many 1" or less rested groups at 100 and 200yds. If you can hold it still it will drive them one after another through a ragged hole.

Keeping the neck tension consistent is paramount though, at least in mine. After 4 loads the groups start to spread out inconsistently unless you anneal. Once annealed they will drop right back into the clover leaf groups again.

Oh and one last thing. A LOT of folks advocate seating your bullets long, so that it holds the cases back against the breech when fired. This might work with a bolt gun, but don't be fooled into using it with the Contenders. These actions aren't as strong, and this can result in a pressure spike that will blow the action open. It is a FAR better practice to simply set a false shoulder, and it WILL hold the case where it needs to be to form perfectly, and keep your pressures where they should be as well.

Hope that helps.

 

[Jim Watson]

"Inspection of the heads shows that the cases have seen very heavy loads as well furthering my concern. Guys please give me a recommendation because at this point I'm considering scrapping the brass and forming all 200 or so of my once fired 30-30 into 7-30 brass."

That sounds best to me.
Start over.

 

[hoghunting]

"Inspection of the heads shows that the cases have seen very heavy loads as well furthering my concern. Guys please give me a recommendation because at this point I'm considering scrapping the brass and forming all 200 or so of my once fired 30-30 into 7-30 brass."

That sounds best to me.
Start over.

My recommendation also, when my 7-30 brass shows signs like that, I trash them.

 

[fguffey]

My only guess is that the case was formed in another set of dies.

My only guess is that the case was formed in another set of dies. I'm not going to try it, but if a man were to attempt to fire form that case what would happen with so much air around the case?

Case on the right, without knowing the make of die it would be a guess. there is an artifact on the case on the right that was caused by problems with case four. The neck started buckling above the shoulder/neck juncture, then the reloader changed methods and or techniques. He used a forming die, the forming die is open on top, it is possible the reloader was forming short cases for other chambers that used the parent 30/30 case. When forming cases I use a hack saw to cut the neck protruding from the die then finish with a file.

Cases with a lot of air around them when fired, pressure is reduced because time is a factor. I would not suggest fast powder, the case if work hardened could split if the case is formed to the chamber too fast. The case could fail because it could not keep up with the rapidly expanding gas.

Then there is case travel and case head insipient separation, the rim holds the case to the rear. that is good but the shoulder that is formed is not the same shoulder on the case when fired, because the case fills the chamber, the shoulder of the case does not run to the front of the chamber when struck with the firing pin.

F. Guffey