Reloading...Is it safe?? For me? For my gun?

[GaryL]

Now, I expect the next poster to say that Oh, yes, he uses lube on all his cases if they are new, and that he just runs it around on his finger a bit, and keeps a rag on hand to wipe off the excess. And he loads his .45ACP on a single stage, in 50 round batch processing, which is fine by him because he shoots about 200 rounds a year. All of that is fine--but that is not the typical workflow for pistol reloading.

How about the poster after the next? Actually, I do agree with you. I loaded pistol for years without any lube. Based on what I read here, I picked up some Imperial sizing wax to try (for rifle reloading). Then I decided to try a little while pistol loading. It isn't necessary, but just a little on a case after every 15 or so sure smooths things out. And using very little like that avoids having messy cases. If I didn't have the wax to use, I wouldn't bother with it.

I load 300-400 in an hour, so the single stage comment doesn't apply.

 

[Jordan85]

so no need for case lube then....

But I'm still curious.... why all the recommendations for the Unique powder w/ a 160/165 grain bullet when I always thought the .40s&w standard was 180 or 200 grain?

Is this b/c these recommendations are more for competition in order to have greater accuracy and lower recoil, etc? And the higher grain loads are more for self-defense?

I need to hurry up and decide what to buy. Hopefully the parts of my kit should be here by this Fri...

 

[XD-40 Shooter]

I don't have any particular reason for loading the 165's, I just like the load that I have developed for them, 6 grains of Unique. Nothing wrong with loading 180's, they will perform just fine, my Lee 2nd Edition show's 5.2-5.5 grains of Unique for a plated 180. I also bought the 165's based on price, at the last gun show here, they were $1.50 cheaper per 100. Since I bought 1000, that adds up.

 

[jfh]

IIRC, the .40S&W has never had a 200-gr. bullet considered 'standard'. The first factory rounds, made to FBI specs were, IIRC a 180-gr. bullet loaded to 950 fps. Shortly after that, 165-gr. bullets showed up, and then the lighter ones.

Meanwhile, 10mm bullets were also being sorted out. Some of the earliest Lead bullets were from Precision Bullets, and were a 200LSWC. The Profile actually is today's LTC--with a touch of shoulder on it. These are problematic in some 1911 10mms; the bullet seats so deep with the shallow nose that there can be case bulging with the a good LOA, with subsequent FTFs. The next lead bullet for 10mm was in the 170-175 range, and then 155s started showing up.

Meanwhile, of course, these 10mm bullets (e.g., the development of the bullet came out of 10 mm, not out of 40 S&W early on) were being tried out in .40S&W. That's about the time I quit fiddling with .40S&W, so I haven't kept track of current trends or favorable combos for .40S&W.

My own inclination in loading 10mm is to run a 180 at about 1000 fps from my various 1911 10s. That is a soft-shooting load in my guns--takes 5.2 gr. of 231 or more. For .40 S&W, I'd be inclined to work with 165 gr bullets, but I have no idea of powder would be really good. Personally, I don't care for Unique, but that is really just a bias based on dirtiness.

231 is probably a good powder for you to start with, Jordan85. That or AA#5--both will meter well in your Lee measure, and 231 will help you find an accurate lower-power load. It also will be very economical--but whether or not it is currently considered a preferred .40S&W powder, I dunno. Another powder I've been impressed with in the past year has been Power Pistol, and one of my all-time favorites is WSF.

To start out with, use WSPs--i.e., Winchester Small Primers. Personally, I would buy at least 200 new cases (Starline), and I would get some 165 JSPs to run, probably the Speers--that's Speer #4410.

So, a tentative shopping list would look like this:

200 cases (Starline, or whatever) - appr. 35.00
1 lb. powder -- appr. 20.00
1000 primers -- appr. 25.00
400 Speer TMJ bullets -- appr. 65.00
500 165-175-gr. lead bullets - appr 45.00

The one pound of powder will be good for close to 1000 rounds in the lighter loads. Having some new brass on hand will allow you to learn to measure it, and give you some indication of longevity once you find your favorite load.

The TMJs will be easier for you to start loading with, and if your pistol is still pretty new they will help to burnish the barrel. They do raise the cost per round, but the benefit for an easier startup is there. Meanwhile, you can try out lead bullets as well.

Jim H.



Jim H.

 

[Jordan85]

I already have some once shot brass to use for now. I'm going to Cabelas tomorrow to get some Unique powder and 165 grain bullets (hopefully) since that seems to be a popular load, even though I've heard negative things about the Unique power burning dirty..

Is this what I need for a primer???

I wouldn't get it here to avoid the hazmat fee, I just need the picture reference for when I go to buy:

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=166619&t=11082005

 

[BobCat]

Yes, just as Jim H. suggested - Winchester Small Pistol primers. Not to disparage other brands at all, but these are suitable.

Unique is, well, unique in that it is usable in so many calibers. May not be optimum, but applicable - I use it in .38 special, in .357 mag "very light" lead bullet loads suitable for cowboy action shooting (about equivalent to a "hot" .38 spl); in 9mm and .45 ACP, and have read of folks using it in "very reduced" .30 caliber rifle loads (also known as "Gallery Loads") - if you search around the web you will find an article - ok, here it is: http://www.reloadingroom.com/index_files/Universal 30.htm - about that.

Sorry to stray so far from the subject at hand! You will find uses for Unique, it will all get shot up and you will not wind up throwing away or wasting any. Some folks say it burns dirty but I clean my guns so I don't care.

Just take everything a step at a time, check your work, be patient and methodical, and you will be rewarded with a notable absence of drama when it comes time to fire your first loads.

You want to laugh? Remember I posted about sticking a bullet in 1972 or something, and my brother got it out of the barrel? The next guy who posted is the very same brother - we were both responding to your thread at almost the same time.

Also, I should thank you. For some reason, you got me thinking about re-reading Hatcher's Notebook - and I've been taking a few minutes to re-read the chapter on receiver failures of early-number Springfield rifles, owing to improper heat treatment. The book is a treasure and I encourage you to find it and read it. Still, reading about "what can go wrong" does reinforce the caution to work methodically and carefully.

I hope this is not too rambling and disjointed. I'm home with the flu - last time I ever skip the flu shot! - and, while not as feverish as I was, am probably irresponsible giving advice on reloading in this condition. Certainly am not reloading, in this condition (shudder!).

Have fun! This is the start of a learning experience that can go on for years and years.

Regards,
Andrew

 

[callgood]

Jordan85

so no need for case lube then....

.........................

As a rule, no. I have carbide dies for my single stage press. I have never used lube with that setup. When I got my Dillon Square Deal I noticed some brass "stuck" to the belling device in station #2 (powder measure). Sometimes it just required a little harder tug to the handle. Sometimes it required both hands. Since I segregate my brass by mfg., I realized it was "MRP" stamped brass that was the culprit.

I use Hornady One Shot lube, so I stood the cases up on a cookie sheet, sprayed inside the mouths at a 45 degree angle and it solved the problem. Since then I have noted a few other headstamps that cause this problem.

You do not list what equipment you are using. I have a Harrels Schuentzen powder measure that is very accurate. However, it does not like Unique- throws really underweight charges. So far, every other powder I've used is dead nuts accurate.

Trust, but verify,

 

[sourdough44]

I have reloaded for 30 yrs & never damaged a gun or myself. Just use your head & get reliable data for your loads. I suggest a new loader also start with a single stage press.

 

[GaryL]

I already have some once shot brass to use for now. I'm going to Cabelas tomorrow to get some Unique powder and 165 grain bullets (hopefully) since that seems to be a popular load, even though I've heard negative things about the Unique power burning dirty..

Guns need cleaning anyway, so I wouldn't worry about Unique being dirty as too big an issue. If it's loaded light, you get a small amount of soot, which is true of many powders. It tends to fill cases, so it's a safe one to start with, and it is fairly flexible. One nice thing about it, it often works well for reduced loads in magnum cartridges.

Cabelas is rather expensive for Primers, just so you know.

 

[Jordan85]

Do you think 231 would be a better option?

 

[308win]

GaryL - Almost all powders leave residue and especially when used in reduced loads. I sometimes use Unique in my 45acp (loaded with lsw to around 900fps according to the guide) and I get a light sooty residue on the barrel and dust cover. It wipes off with a rag.

 

[jfh]

"...Do you think 231 would be a better option?"

We're down into the subjective issues and opinions of experienced reloaders, jordan85.

I recommended 231 because it is a good-metering powder and it will work across several calibers for low and medium (and some high) loads--IOW, a good one for a beginner.

Others like the performance of Unique, and don't attend to the dirty characteristics of it--but I do. You wouldn't go wrong with either one, really.

As for that once-shot brass, if it's your own, fine--but do be aware that .40 S&W pick-up brass from the range can include brass that has been Glockified--i.e., has a bulge near the base due to the ramp / barrel design of Glocks.

I'm not up to speed on how reloaders are using it--discarding it, or resizing it and using it for light loads, whatever.

Jim H.

 

[Jordan85]

I have been warned about the the perils of Glocked brass. But the brass I have is def all my once-shot brass out of my M&P. There are a couple of ranges w/in driving distance of me, but the one closest to me and the one I prefer most is a very small, community range.

There are only five lanes at the range, and both nights I collected my brass I was the only one shooting .40, and I was there from the time it was open until the time it closed (and helped clean up ALL the brass that was shot that night--range is only open 2 hours), and left w/ almost exactly the same number of casings as I had started with. But thank you for you concern.

I actually have a friend who shoots a Glock, and I was just planning on keeping his brass separate for now until I decide if I want to use them when I feel more confident in my abilities to spot problem brass

 

[Art Eatman]

From the opening post:

"So I take my ABC's of Reloading home and am reading over it, and THE FIRST 30 PAGES ARE STARTING TO MAKE ME SECOND-GUESS MYSELF."

Well, that's what ya get from reading. Shouldn't do that.

I started in back in 1950. I watched my uncle for a little while, per his orders, and then went to work. He was happy to ignore any aspect of child labor.

Yeah, I've read through the books and all that. I've just used common sense in how I do my reloading, and it's been good enough to keep me out of trouble through a bunch of thousands of rounds of rifle and pistol ammo, these last 58 years...

, Art

 

[[email protected]]

I've been reloading since the mid 80's & dad since well before that till a few days before he passed last Jan 31. In all that time between the 2 of us we have had a few (like less than 10) missfires, sqibs, etc. Only 1 time did it mess up a gun & that was old like 30+ year old loads that mom shot in a 38spl colt & didn't relize the gun didn't kick or go boom & she fired another round & split the last 3/4 inch of the barrel from a sqib load. Don't shoot a semi auto like a machine gun & pay attention to what is going on when you shoot & reload & you will be pretty safe.

 

[Idano]

Jordan,

I have found that all auto's over time if reload the brass enough will in time belly the brass. I have an H&K USP that will begin to belly the brass after about 10 -15 reloads depending upon the head stamp. I have had one web blow out on my Beretta 92FS and I notice that it was bellied so from now on all pistol brass after I tumble it and before I clean the primmer pockets I check ever case with a Wilson Case Gauge and if it doesn't fit it goes into the reclaim.

 

[Eljay]

Jordan, this ought to keep you up nights

[/IMG]

 

[Jordan85]

Sheesh.... How'd you do that Eljay?

 

[RustyFN]

I would go with a powder that meters good. Unique doesn't meter as good as most powders in most measures from most people I talk to. I have had good luck with Bullseye, Titegroup and HS-6 powders and have heard that 231 and WSF meter very good also. As soon as my Titegroup gets low I am going to try a jug of WSF, I have been hearing a lot of good things about that powder, especially in 9mm. My experience is with the Pro Auto Disk on the Classic Turret.
Rusty

 

[TexasRifleman]

I'm a single stage loader and look into every case, in the block, under the shop light that hangs over my bench.

I do that more than I used to, and it's good advice.

The only time I've ever had an "oops" was on a progressive RCBS piggyback where I got a double charge of powder in some 10mm.

To this day I don't know how it could have happened but luckily they were already light IPSC loads and it didn't do any real damage other than blow the magazine out the bottom of my 1911 and scare the hell out of me.

I find I like the slower pace of single stage loading now that I am not going through 600-800 rounds a week.

Take your time, check everything twice.

 

[Mr White]

I think where a lot of people get into trouble and get kabooms is when they try to make their own magnum or +P+ rounds.

Always remember that when a manual says X grains of Y powder behind bullet Z is a max load, that doesn't mean that X+2 grains of W powder behind bullet M should work a little bit better. This is the kind of crap that blows up guns and kills people.

Also, although you might be very anal and detail oriented about things, always keep in mind that everyone can make mistakes, even the most anal of us. When you're reloading, don't ever let yourself get sloppy; physically or mentally. No alcohol, no other recreational substances, avoid loading when your tired, rushed, or preoccupied with something else. Those times are the times you'd be most likely to make a mistake.

Reloading is a fun and safe obsession if you do it right, use caution and comon sense and remember that Max means Max.

 

[ilbob]

It is as safe as you make it.

Pay attention to what you are doing. No TV, no radio, no Ipod, no chatting with your shooting buddy. No day dreaming about the chick next door who is out sunbathing in her bikini.

Do it right rather than fast. Speed comes with repetition and doing it right. IMO, most of the claimed high rates of production are exaggerated or ignore prep time that speeds the actual work along, but still takes time.

 

[Eljay]

The story of the blown 629 in post #67. Yes it's mine, yes I was shooting it when it happened, yes it was from a cartridge that I loaded, and no, no one was hurt. I was loading a 44 mag but not near a max charge. I was using Bullseye, I know not the best powder to use in a big case, but I was looking for a snappy but cheep plinking load. the load was 7grns with a 240 gn LFP. I was loading on a single stage press I had a bowl of sized, primed, flaired cases, and was charging on a stand alone powder measure, charge case, put it in the press and seat the bullet. Every 5-8 cases I would dump a charge onto the pan of the electronic scale to check the charge. The scale would take a few seconds to settle and as it was i would keep loading other rounds, then I would take the weighed charge and dump it into an "empty" case and seat the bullet. I guess I had a brain fart and charged a case and then dumped the weighed load into the same case. So 14 grns of Bullseye, is a LOT of Bullseye. I was shooting in back of my property and that was the
6th round in the gun, instead of the normal up and back recoil it was just a push down, I looked at the gun said a few choice words because i now had a $550 doorstop and through the gun down. Behind me and to the left is a tin shed, above the door there was an oval shaped hole, i unlocked the door and looked around inside, there was another small hole in the roof on the side and another in the back wall, I dug around under lawn mowers and found the piece of the cylinder shown in the picture, you would be shocked at how sharp the edges on that piece of steel are, at that point I just sat down and thought long and hard about what just happened. I pulled every 44 round I had, I could not shoot anything with much recoil for quite a while, I pay very close attention when I reload, you should too.

 

[Kimber1911_06238]

reloading is safe. be meticulous (obsessive), read the manual, follow what the manual says (look at more than manual), and ask questions on here if you have any problems. If something doesn't feel/look right, stop and ask someone who knows.

 

[peterotte]

Thank you for sharing that Eljay. It can happen so easily.

I don't load pistol cartridges anymore (although I am thinking of retrieving my 44 mag to convert into a revolving carbine with 'silencer' fitted to gain the necessary 'barrel length' for feral pig hunting) but when I did, the fear of a double charge is what made me stick to a powder that would either overfil or not be 'overload' with a double charge. This meant choosing a load that was below half max for plinking.