Residents Terrified Over Idea Of Deadly Weapon On Streets

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First a note to all people, LEO's had FA's even BEFORE the 34' act.

Did the guns go missing, yes, my theory is this: a few LEO's that like to collect managed to convince the right people to let them "go missing" and here we are.
 
I salute V35's stunningly accurate description of New Jersey culture.

Having moved to the state a few years ago on temporary assignment, I continue to be taken aback by how completely subservient most Jerseyans are to their government...while being belligerent to their fellow citizens.

My time's up this year, and I'm positioned to pack up this Spring. Can't wait to burn my FID card at the PA state line.

Since we bought our home here, our property taxes have jumped by 65% and are approaching $10,000 per year. A significant portion of this money is confiscated by the state government and redistributed to "poor" cities, where school superintendents blow it on things like jukeboxes for their offices and exorbitant bonuses for themselves and their staff. The townspeople, of course, find nothing wrong with that behavior...it's not their money anyway...and decline to force resignation when the corruption is made public.

Ugh. I feel nauseated just typing this. I'm outta here.

V35 wrote:
NJ is a classic study in a civilization that has willingly and peacefully given up its rights. One must actually live there to appreciate how true that statement is. Corruption at all levels - including local police and all levels of government - is not only tolerated to a great degree, but dependence upon all levels of government is also common. In other words, NJers expect protection from the very government they know is corrupt.
 
First a note to all people, LEO's had FA's even BEFORE the 34' act.
Yes, and the average American could order a Thompson Submachinegun, the MP5 of the time from a Sears catalog and have it delivered anywhere with no documentation, background check etc.
So if police lost one then it would not be a very big deal unless a child found it. It would be about as serious as misplacing a container of dangerous cleaning chemicals, could pose a danger to a child, but otherwise not a huge concern.
Police could have them, and all citizens could have them. There was not even any prohibitions to felons and previous criminals from having them once they rejoined society until 1968.
So no matter who found it, it really was no big deal unless it was a child.

It is a huge deal to people now because of all the gun control. We have acceptable classes of people for some things, and less than equal for others. When the sheep might have something only allowed the shepherd people panic.

Prior to the NFA act some police did use firearms like the thompson. Most did not.

After the '34 act most LEO did not have full auto weapons or deploy them.
LEO were considered little different from anyone else and subject to most of the same laws until much later.
Even when SWAT teams first started in the LAPD in the late 60's (after seeing the SAS perform in the wonderful UK.)
Many of those weapons had the same appearance as full auto and the public assumed they were. They were in fact semi auto firearms. However after the public assumed for so long they were full auto, and it become generaly acceptable that they were, they actualy did switch over to select fire weapons. They of course used a current incident as in all situations to add that additional justification. The incident with the Symbionese Liberation Army, however similar incidents had happened previously, and police had faced criminals armed with such weapons for decades, so it was simply a convenient excuse.

Here is an section from wiki, which I know to be correct from other sources long before wiki existed:
The normal complement of weapons was a sniper rifle (apparently a .243-caliber bolt-action, judging from the ordnance expended by officers at the shootout), two .223-caliber semi-automatic rifles, and two shotguns. SWAT officers also carried their service revolvers in shoulder holsters. The normal gear issued them included a first aid kit, gloves, and a gas mask. In fact it was a change just to have police armed with semi-automatic rifles, at a time when officers were usually issued six-shot revolvers and shotguns.
As you can see most police did not have full auto weapons after the NFA act, and in fact it was frowned on when they had more than revolvers and shotguns. LAPD was on the "cutting edge" in changing that trend and it did not even equip officers with rifles until the late 60's. No full auto/select fire until the mid 70's.

In the interim various laws in various localities and states began to appear that excluded LEO. Prior they were generaly considered equal to everyone else. As more and more new restrictive laws appeared they excluded law enforcement.
The result is what you see now.

Prior to the political climate of the 70s the average American would have been appalled that the police were militarizing. The federal military was specificly prohibited from being used against the citizens since the Posse Comitatus Act, and turning the police into paramilitary branches would just be a way to bypass that. However the disdain by many for the radicals of the time caused the citizens to allow severely restrictive arms laws, where they could be carried, how they could be transported while at the same time giving more special privelidges to LEO than ever before.
Most current gun control stems from then. Prior to that it was legal to walk down the street many places with a longarm, take them into federal buildings, possess them while picketing, carry all firearms openly most places (and even concealed in many) etc.
 
How do you misplace a weapon... you don't. Some one stole it. At the very least it was checked out with out/incorrectly filling out all the paper work... which would be a crimal offence in both the civilan and miltary worlds.
 
Someone misplaced it. I do this all the time with my keys.

Strange that people were not concerned when the police had it. Why are they not concerned that the police still have several more to lose? I say take them away from the police if they can't take care of the public property they have been entrusted with. Might sound strange but it has worked other places where the police failed to keep accountability of their weapons.
 
Oh, I am not saying that police should not have them... Just the police that lost it. This is a breach of the public trust by losing valuable property that belongs to the people.
 
Yes, and the average American could order a Thompson Submachinegun, the MP5 of the time from a Sears catalog and have it delivered anywhere with no documentation, background check etc.
So if police lost one then it would not be a very big deal unless a child found it.

You are overlooking one key element. Back then parents parented, and children were raised to have common sense and an understanding of consequences.

If I found a gun, even as a very young child, I'd have quickly found one of my parents or another adult...and this was long before Eddie the Eagle existed.
 
Bingo

Quote: You are overlooking one key element. Back then parents parented, and children were raised to have common sense and an understanding of consequences.
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IN A NUTSHELL


Ls
 
An MP5 is maybe one of the best CQB guns made, when loaded with good JHP ammo, they are really quite effective. far better than a m4 at close range.

Until you throw body armor into the equation. After that an AR type has huge advantages.
 
Misplaced... Or stolen?
They have three MP5s. Its not like a couple dozen glocks and shottys to track. How can they lose ONE of THREE guns? Its unlikely that its was accidentally misplaced. Stolen sounds more reasonable. Except if it was stolen, it sound as if the PD isn't properly storing or locking their guns. So it was "misplaced".
 
Got your point Zoogster, the up armoring of LEO's has exploded in the last few years. That and more cops are becoming gunnies, so they get to request nice things, while police have always had access to FA's the 86' ban gummed everything up for us, but what are we going to do until Parker comes up?
 
This month's Harper's magazine index said that somewhere between 49% and 51% of NJ residents would like to move out of the state! I forget the exact figure, but it's roughly 50%.

I'd want to move too.
 
my team leader once left his hk53 propped up outside a ware house we were "liberating" beer from only missed it half and hour later que wrong down a motorway to get it back still sitting there:D
 
Missing?

I think some cop thought he'd "take work home" for some fun and didn't return it before somebody noticed.

"I'll just take it out and burn up a few mags and sneak it back to work"
 
How quaint: The sheeple are scared now that the sheep herders have lost a fully auto weapon.

Since 1993 I have run enviromnental cleanup jobs in 17 states including a big one at Old Bridge, NJ. The developers of the site were the ...... Brothers and they have US Rep. Pallone in their pockets. The ....... were encouraging run off from the site. Reason; to fill in the wetlands so they could develop that too. Pallone kept the EPA off their butts.

Those of you who live around New Brunswick will recognize the name when I tell you that their office is in the old Johnson and Johnson family mansion.

I had to bribe the union phone company employees to get phone service to our trailer: Had to bribe the union power company employees to get power. Then it got really corrupt.

I did attend some really good graduate courses at Rutgers and that made my stay there worth it all.
 
Jeebus ... its a submachine gun, not a suitcase nuke!


If people really understood how little advantage a subgun is over a handgun they'd stop this silliness.
 
If people really understood how little advantage a subgun is over a handgun they'd stop this silliness.

Better velocity--Better sight radius--Higher capacity-- better cover fire capability...

I would take the MP5 over a handgun in the same caliber almost anytime in a real combat situation...
 
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