Right Handed Left Eyed...

[NickEllis]

I had posted this on one of the other forums, and I wanted to know what y'all thought about it.

I have a buddy of mine who is just now starting to get into handgunning. He is right handed, but is left eye dominant, and it is giving him fits for sighting. He can't shut his left eye to allow his right eye to dominate, and if he shoots with both eyes open like he wants to, his left eye takes over and he ends up cross sighting. We had thought about him switching to shooting left handed, but this would also necessitate alot of changes as far as concealed carry goes, and all that comes with that change. He can use some shooting glasses with a dot on the left eye to allow the right eye to take control, but lets, face it, you can't walk around like then all day when you are concealed-carry. Any of you have any input into this?

Thanks

Gaiudo

 

[Henry Bowman]

I have this same problem and would be very interested in knowing how anyone with the same problem has overcome it in a practical way.

 

[Sleuth]

Some of my students found that putting a section of clear tape over the left eyeglass lens helped a lot. The left eye could not focus, so the right eye did the work. Others blacked out the lens with cardboard to overcome this problem. Let us know if this works for you.

 

[Sean Smith]

Funny, I'm right handed and left-eye dominant, but I guess my left eye is *so* dominant that it never gave me any problems.

 

[sanchezero]

I'm the same way, Sean. I don't have any problems at all just letting my left eye take over.

I shoot rifles left handed, pistols right handed.

The clear tape trick does seem to be the recommended solution to this 'problem' tho.

 

[CWL]

Same exact problem here.

Try closing the left eye when shooting and using only (weak) right eye to align sights. I do it this way because I am able to shoot pistols and long guns the same with right eye.

My groupings have tightened up considerably from when I formerly used both eyes.

I used to worry about loss of peripheral vision, but you can open both eyes immediately to counterract any fears. -Besides, in shooting situations, tunnelvision will close up your view so tight that it won't really matter.

 

[NickEllis]

Dominant left...

Thanks for all the responces...

Its interesting to know that there are more people out there that are dealing with this, and thanks or letting me know how you dealt with it. I have also used the tape thing for myself when skeet shooting, as well as rubbing grease or chapstick on my shooting glasses just enough to blur it so that my right eye is ensured of remaining dominant. Luckily my right eye is strong enough that I can shoot normally under most circumstances.

However, by buddy's eye is constantly taking dominance over his left. I am interested in how you guys who let your left eye dominate adjust your shooting stance. It is very possible that my stance is screwed up anyways, but it would seem to me that if I were going to be on target when sighting with my left eye I would have to make some pretty serious adjustments to my stance/grip.

As for all the suggestions for taping glasses, I can see how it would be helpful, and have used it for the range, but this seems to be inappropriate for carry, as it would change alot of stuff when you don't have the tape on. Unless you guys are walking around with tape on your glasses.... It just seems to me that you would want to be training under the same parameters that you would find yourself in during actual "social situations."

Thanks again guys.

 

[sanchezero]

I am interested in how you guys who let your left eye dominate adjust your shooting stance.

I shoot facing square to the target, both arms about equal extension (mod iso-ish), both eyes open. The gun just ends up in front of my dominant eye. It seems completely natural to me.

I have noticed some LEDom guys who cock their head a bit, but I don't do that. Pupil to pupil, I'm about 2 inches. It doesn't seem like a big deal at all to make a 2 in 'adjustment' left or right.

 

[HBK]

I have this problem, but it isn't a big deal. I shoot a modified Weaver stance, with my torso more squared to the target and close my right eye.

 

[Jim March]

Another one here!

Your buddy needs to decide what KIND of handgun shooter he wants to be. For range work only, somebody interested in target or "formal competition types" like Olympic bullseye or Metallic Silluete(sp?) the various "switch eye to the right tricks" like taping the left glasses or closing the left eye will work best. Taken to extremes, you train yourself to completely switch.

But for *combat* shooting, none of those are a good idea. You won't have those tricks available in a fight.

If that's his direction, he needs to do the following:

1) At close ranges, tilt the gun about 45 degrees leftwards, so the sights line up with the left eye.

2) But that won't work at longer range (past 25 to 50 yards depending on the gun and the rate of bullet drop). Basically, the bullet drop pattern will be "wrong". Bigtime. For the same reason serious accuracy rifles have a bubble level built into one of the sights: you need the gun vertical to allow the sights to line up with the bullet drop.

I could go into more details, but the point is, the Weaver hold is a godsend because with a little adjustment, you can cock your head over far enough to get the left eye lined up with the sights even with the gun vertical. I believe that cross-dominant shooters should strongly consider sticking with Weaver over Iscoceles. Granted, I'm not a firearms instructor or even competitor and I'm NOT qualified to state that as a professional opinion. It's my personal opinion as a pure amateur who's never competed, OK?

But, I think I'm right. As a bonus, the Weaver seems to have advantages when dealing with BIG recoil (44Mag or higher, or a superlight 357 ). The guys shooting 454s and other crazy stuff, including John Linebaugh, Taffin, Taylor and the like shoot from the Weaver position, or some variant.

---------

In short: at close range where mobility is a major asset, I twist the gun left and keep my body straighter (although still in a Weaver hold). From behind cover or while doing a long range shot, I'll bend my knees more, twist my upper body/neck rightwards, untwist the gun back to vertical and shoot that way. At which point I can hit a man-sized target 100% of the time at 50 yards. With a 2" barrel, 5-shot 38Spl snubby. No mobility that way! So I have two basic shooting styles, that are a variant of the same thing...both with my left eye, right hand.

Damned if I know what I'll do about long guns. Ask me once I've bought one.

 

[NickEllis]

modified Weaver...

Jim March,

and the rest of y'all too, thanks alot for taking the time to write your experiences down. Jim, the area that my buddy is worried about is concealed carry, and he can do the tape thing if he wants to shoot competition or do serious range work. However, for carry, and in training for carry situations, I think he would rather do something that has more profit for reality.

Thanks for spending the time to show what you do with your Weaver stance. It may not work for him, but next time we hit the range we will try it out and see what happens. It sure sounds like an improvement to me. If worse comes to worse, maybe he will just switch his dominant hand. However, if the problem can be rectified with a simple adjust in his Weaver, then that would be the answer for now.

With long guns, there are other issues at play, but issues that are less important than daily carry training.

Thanks alot. You have been a great help.

Gaiudo

 

[Jim March]

Cool.

Oh, one more detail: I'm using a Weaver variant that keep the strong arm (right) mostly straight, and forming a "cheek weld" against my right bicep. This is in the variant where I'm NOT in motion, the gun is vertical and I'm take a very well-aimed shot.

In the "mobile version", that's not practical, so the right elbow is bent more, my gun is flipped a little sideways (but well short of the horizontal "Hollywood Homeboy" style!) and my head is almost vertical. In this version, peripheral vision is still decent, although there IS a limitation on left-side peripheral vision that must be accounted for in tactical movements and threat-scans. (Remember, there's ALWAYS MORE GOBLINS. Wolves hunt in packs.)

So the transition from "mobile" to "marksman" involves an extension and untwisting of the right arm, while dropping with the body a bit and flipping my head rightwards into the "bicep cheek weld". And use of cover where possible! A lot of this may be adaptations to MY particular body shape/type, OK? Plus I'm not a qualified instructor. Try it, keep what works, discard what doesn't.

What else...you should know that I personally suck at non-sighted fire. All my shooting involves use of sights. I also can't freehand draw worth a damn and I suspect there's a link; a lot of the "natural point shooters" I've met also seem to be able to freehand sketch anywhere from fairly good to "professional cartoonist level". Again, no studies have been done but we do know there's such thing as a "natural point shooter" who make up between 1% and 20% of the shooting population, depending on who you ask. It could be well worth you or your buddy's time to sort out where you are on the point-shoot scale.

 

[Byron]

My wife has the same problem. We have been married 32 years. After giving up on techniques, I found that she instincts points because of this. At 10 yards, the bullseye belongs to her. I tried to get her to use sights recently as it had been a few years since she shot. She was all over the paper. She said let me do it my way and the bullseye was gone. Instinct shooting may be the answer for this situation. Byron

 

[NickEllis]

Instinctive shooting...

Wow, thanks guys...

Its very interesting about the whole instinctive sighing issue. I was always taught to use my sights, and so was my buddy, and have really been steered away from anything instinctive. Although, when I started bow hunting, I shoot much better instinctively, even with a compound. I would like to explore this possibility deeper, and will try to find some range money/time to give this option a few hundred rounds. Thanks for the input.

Jim, thanks for the input on your stance. I have never used the "cheek weld", but maybe that would help to keep my buddy's eye dominant. Interesting options, and it will be good to introduce them on the range. Luckily, neither of us have years of experience that we need to break to give these a chance. So we shall see what this does.

Thanks again

Gaiudo

 

[David Blinder]

There are three primary methods of dealing with eye cross dominance.
1) Close one eye which makes the other dominant. The negative aspect is that it reduces your field of view and depth perception.
2) Cant your head to place dominant eye in line with sights. Negative here is that you're now looking downrange at a weird angle.
3) Just move the gun the 1 1/2 to 2" so that it's in front of the dominant eye. In case you're wondering, #3 is my preferred method because it doesn't alter view in any way or require coordination of shutting an eye.

 

[Black92LX]

i have the same problem so i am training myself to shoot left handed. i have it down with my .22LR. but with bigger guns AR-15 and shotguns i am still working on it. handguns i still shoot right anded because i can still see the sights.

 

[10-Ring]

Maybe it's because I never knew any diff't If you apply proper technique & ALOT of practice, you'll be fine!

 

[RandyB]

I'm fortuante to be left handed and left eye dominant as well. My brother and father are both right handed and left eye dominant. We all three practice shooting non-dominant sides as well as 'our regular way'. Maybe genetic, or whatnot, but no problems target shooting, hunting, trap, skeet, etc. I would recommend practice and see what happens. Good luck and have fun (this is a perfect excuse to go out and shoot more!)

 

[Dorian]

And now for a different response....

I have the amazing ability to raise my left eyebrow and lower my right eyebrow at the same time(ala The Rock).

So I do this and at the same time lower my head down enough that my right eyebrow is blocking my pistol sights out.

I do this because I can't close my right eye without scrunching my whole face up, and I can't shoot with both eyes open.

It got me into a little trouble in police academy where they preached "Bring the gun to your head and not your head to the gun!". I had to explain over and over again what I was doing.... Some of them understood, some of them remained belligerent. Needless to say when we started shooting and the lowest I ever shot was a 96%, I didn't have anymore problems.

 

[Sleuth]

Dorian, sounds like you are the poster child for :

'IF IT WORKS, DON'T FIX IT!"

aka, only results matter.

 

[C.R.Sam]

Target one thing.

Defensive whole nuther thing.

Defence pactice:

One can neither schedule nor script their next defensive encounter.

If you have a decent and repeatable sight picture; stance and which eye makes not a whit of difference.

I am for practicing with both hands, either hand, either eye and all practicable positions.

If you are comfortable shooting with both eyes open, do so. If not, then close the one not in use at the moment.

Do what it takes FOR YOU to put the bullet in the place of your choice.

Sam

 

[Dorian]

heh... just reread my own post and it kinda sounded like I was tootin my own horn.... So to put things in perspective, out of a class of 21 students, I came in 6th for firearms.

I'm glad my class of police cadets could shoot!

 

[mercop]

Any of my guys who had this problem did much better when we switched to Center Axis Relock.

 

[NickEllis]

Trying stuff out...

Thanks y'all for all the advice. We are trying some of y'alls options out, and after I hope that we will see a difference soon. You guys are great, thanks for the help.

Gaiudo

 

[JeanC]

When hubby first started to teach me to shoot, we discovered I was left-eye dominant while I am right handed. If I made a consious effort I could keep my right eye open. If I used my rifle first then I had no problems using my right eye.

Eventually we figured out I shot better lefthanded, so I've switched to shooting lefthanded (which makes using a bolt action rifle REAL fun).