I have a newer production mini 14 (2013). It is stainless with a flash hider. I bought a wooden stock and put on it and I love it. I like my AR as well, but they are different. The mini is lighter, handles well, and super reliable. I have three ARs set up a little differently, and only 1 mini. I don’t have a reason to get another one, but I won’t be parting ways with mine. I shoot it with the factory sights and it shoots plenty accurate as far as my eyes can focus. When I’m shooting with friends everyone likes it when I pull it out. It is something different and most of them end up buying one after shooting it. I don’t know about the accuracy of the old ones because I’ve never had one but the newer style barrels are good to go. When my daughter shoots with me she much prefers the mini to the AR. I like them both equally. You can get some ARs cheaper, but but the time you set it up the way you want it the price difference isn’t that much. Life is short, get them both.
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MachIVshooter
Member
It's not my interpretation.
A DI system, such as that used in the MAS 49, does not have an expansion chamber/cylinder; the gas pressure acts directly on the bolt carrier. There are a few other notable production arms which employ it. The Desert Eagle is really a DI design. Guns like the AK with a rod & piston rigidly attached to the bolt carrier are actually more closely related to true DI than the Stoner design.
The Stoner gas system is an expanding gas system with a cylinder and piston. Look up U.S. Patent 2,951,424
Only people who can't be bothered to understand the difference, and those who pander to that crowd, refer to the Stoner system as DI. Many dont even know who Gene Stoner is.
And that's all the more I'll get into it in this thread, as it's really not even tangential to the topic.
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Riomouse911
Member
I live in Ca, so it is a bastardized AR or a standard Mini/M1A type rifle for the masses. (It really is all about the looks!) As a result I have seven bastardized AR’s, 6 in 5.56 and 1 in 7.62x39.
I also have three Minis, an older SS ranch in a Ram-Line camo stock (remember those?) a blued older mini 30 with a wood stock and a new SS ranch in a synthetic stock.
For the past 15-odd years I was head rangemaster and armorer for the office where we had 70 mini’s issued in the field or assigned as stand by guns in 5 different office safes. I can honestly say I’ve had a wider exposure to a variety of different era minis than 99% of the people I have met (we had one wooden hand guard model, a very early polished stainless/wood stock mini, several shark-fin 180 models, dozens of 16” and 18” 580’s and 5 or 6 unissued, brand new 583-series in our inventory) I have fired several AC-556 13” and 18” full auto guns along with the mini-14 target model and a couple of customized mini’s as well. I have trained and qualified on minis dozens of times myself, and trained new and experienced mini shooters of various skill levels for years. In all the years only one mini had issues, and this was after it got tweaked in the gun rack after a pretty nasty vehicle collision. (Ruger fixed it.)
That being said, mini 14’s have some big pluses and big minuses just like every rifle out there.
Pluses: Simple manual of arms; the safety and mag release are ambidextrous, the action is easy to operate, it is easy to check for a loaded chamber, it is easy to clear in case of a jam. They are rugged, reliable (with OEM magazines!), weather resistant from -20 wind chill to 150 degree interior Crown Vic trunks, minimal lube, sand and grit don’t phase them much, they keep going. They are deputy-proof and will shoot minute of 9-ring on a B-27 to 200 yards if you do your part. (In my week-long patrol rifle instructor course I had to shoot my mini 14 out to 300 with open sights.) Plus, they look and handle like a “regular rifle” for folks who do not want the AR look or feel.
Minuses: They got very pricy to buy new, the factory 30-round mags are, IMHO, expensive and a bit less reliable than the very reliable 20’s (which are often 22 bucks or more each!). The action/barrels are not as accurate as average AR’s are and mini open sights are not as precise as AR sights. The mini ergonomics are “take it or leave it” as real customization is not easy. Magazine insertion is like the AK with a “rock and lock” motion; if you miss the pin the mag will fall out. Tough to insert a full mag on a closed bolt. Red dot or scope optic mounts are pretty much limited to factory scope rings, cheesy add-on picatinny mounts for red dots using the scope ring slots, side-action mounts or an aftermarket mount built into the hand guard. If you reload they can dent and fling brass all over like a field goal kicker. Mounting a gun light is not simple and the single point sling option is a PITA and usually involves drilling the stock to insert a mount.
(Full disclosure; I also oversaw the transition from the mini 14 to Colt AR 15 Enhanced patrol rifles in 2021. We swapped partially because our guns were aging, but primarily because most of our new hires were all trained previously on AR-15’s so the transition to our office became easier.)
I like the mini 14/30/6.8/.300BO for what it is; a very rugged, dependable rifle that can do duty as a home/ranch defense rifle, a truck-floor varmint getter, a deer/pig hunting gun, a trainer for newer shooters or a plinker for lazy afternoons of fun. I know it has several limitations, but I’m not a Camp Perry bullseye shooter anyway so I can live with what they can do.
If you want a mini 14, I say go for it. If you do, I’ll never say you made a bad purchase.
Stay safe.
I also have three Minis, an older SS ranch in a Ram-Line camo stock (remember those?) a blued older mini 30 with a wood stock and a new SS ranch in a synthetic stock.
For the past 15-odd years I was head rangemaster and armorer for the office where we had 70 mini’s issued in the field or assigned as stand by guns in 5 different office safes. I can honestly say I’ve had a wider exposure to a variety of different era minis than 99% of the people I have met (we had one wooden hand guard model, a very early polished stainless/wood stock mini, several shark-fin 180 models, dozens of 16” and 18” 580’s and 5 or 6 unissued, brand new 583-series in our inventory) I have fired several AC-556 13” and 18” full auto guns along with the mini-14 target model and a couple of customized mini’s as well. I have trained and qualified on minis dozens of times myself, and trained new and experienced mini shooters of various skill levels for years. In all the years only one mini had issues, and this was after it got tweaked in the gun rack after a pretty nasty vehicle collision. (Ruger fixed it.)
That being said, mini 14’s have some big pluses and big minuses just like every rifle out there.
Pluses: Simple manual of arms; the safety and mag release are ambidextrous, the action is easy to operate, it is easy to check for a loaded chamber, it is easy to clear in case of a jam. They are rugged, reliable (with OEM magazines!), weather resistant from -20 wind chill to 150 degree interior Crown Vic trunks, minimal lube, sand and grit don’t phase them much, they keep going. They are deputy-proof and will shoot minute of 9-ring on a B-27 to 200 yards if you do your part. (In my week-long patrol rifle instructor course I had to shoot my mini 14 out to 300 with open sights.) Plus, they look and handle like a “regular rifle” for folks who do not want the AR look or feel.
Minuses: They got very pricy to buy new, the factory 30-round mags are, IMHO, expensive and a bit less reliable than the very reliable 20’s (which are often 22 bucks or more each!). The action/barrels are not as accurate as average AR’s are and mini open sights are not as precise as AR sights. The mini ergonomics are “take it or leave it” as real customization is not easy. Magazine insertion is like the AK with a “rock and lock” motion; if you miss the pin the mag will fall out. Tough to insert a full mag on a closed bolt. Red dot or scope optic mounts are pretty much limited to factory scope rings, cheesy add-on picatinny mounts for red dots using the scope ring slots, side-action mounts or an aftermarket mount built into the hand guard. If you reload they can dent and fling brass all over like a field goal kicker. Mounting a gun light is not simple and the single point sling option is a PITA and usually involves drilling the stock to insert a mount.
(Full disclosure; I also oversaw the transition from the mini 14 to Colt AR 15 Enhanced patrol rifles in 2021. We swapped partially because our guns were aging, but primarily because most of our new hires were all trained previously on AR-15’s so the transition to our office became easier.)
I like the mini 14/30/6.8/.300BO for what it is; a very rugged, dependable rifle that can do duty as a home/ranch defense rifle, a truck-floor varmint getter, a deer/pig hunting gun, a trainer for newer shooters or a plinker for lazy afternoons of fun. I know it has several limitations, but I’m not a Camp Perry bullseye shooter anyway so I can live with what they can do.
If you want a mini 14, I say go for it. If you do, I’ll never say you made a bad purchase.
Stay safe.
In spite of that, the Supreme Superpower™ of owning a Mini is that it prevents you from being mistaken for one of the numerous insufferable twits repeating that, ad nauseum, in every thread regardless of the actual topic of the discussion at hand, even in rare and mostly irrelevant circumstances (benchrest) where it makes any difference.
A grand well spent. A virtual street cred equivalent of graduating to shopping Barbasol instead of Clearasil.
Throwbackguy
Member
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2022
- Messages
- 65
Gotta agree with hq above: Got one about a year ago, and have loved it. A grand well spent, for me. As to modifications, I got a reduced gas block bushing (short money, and well spent!), and I replaced the plastic cover with an Ultimak so I could forward-mount a low-power scope. Winner, all around.
MachIVshooter
Member
Evidently a feeling of superiority and an assumed right to become indignant and lash out with personal insults at anyone who demonstrates that the rifle is objectively inferior to another.
I've had them. They can be fun to plink with and do have a cool form factor. But when you cannot reliably hit soda cans or praire rats from a rest at 100 yards without doubling your investment, it's worth considering other options. When the prices of the mini vs. that other option did an about-face, it became a no-brainer for most. Benchrest shooting is certainly not the only place the difference between a 1 MOA gun and a 3 MOA gun matters. I'm betting I can find posts of yours that that state exactly this in so many words, as long as they're not in threads where you're extolling the virtues of a mini while simultaneously denigrating former mini owners who moved to the AR.
Wilfully paying more to get less just for the sake of having something different is not something I can ever understand. Guess that's why I don't put big, flashy wheels with rubber band tires on my cars or wear a gawdy, expensive watch when a $40 Timex is more comfortable, more durable and requires fewer battery changes. The curse of pragmatism...
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You're missing the whole point. As it's commonly known, Ruger Mini owners specifically are NOT known for manurebombing all imaginable threads concerning, say, for the sake of example, AR15, by exclaiming how much better their rifles happen to be in some aspect rather irrelevant to the topic in question.
That's something to keep in mind while not holding one's breath to wait for better days when this principle finally starts working both ways.
MachIVshooter
Member
OP asked for opinions. He did NOT say "only current mini owners", nor that he did not want them compared to other rifles (what other tool/criteria is there for objective evaluation?).
The arguments in favor of the mini are but one from a practical standpoint, that being that other rifles such as the AR are prohibited or must be neutered/bastardized in a way that compromises their virtues. Any other rationale is purely subjective and usually emotional, as is clearly evident in this thread.
If the OP had said "I don't care about the inflated prices and don't want to hear about other weapons", my initial post would have simply been that they're fun plinkers and neat looking but a little clunky and typically disappointing in the accuracy department.
I don't care how he spends his money, nor anyone else who is looking on in this thread. But the whole point of discussion boards like this is to discuss things and offer information and experiences that others may not have, thus enabling them to make a more informed decision. Ask for it, and ye shall receive. If one already has their mind made up and is only looking for reinforcement to make them feel better and more confident in their decision, THR ain't the place to post a query. There are dedicated fanboy message boards for that. And I don't post about the AR in the various mini-14 subforums and groups.
I don't let my personal beliefs to get in the way of stating the obvious, questioning beliefs or, particularly, taking a step back for a broader picture of the matter at hand. I can't even find him asking anything about any other rifle for that matter, so staying on topic might be well advised. Depending on whether we'd like to nitpick about the whole subject of discussion or cherry pick details in order to distort it to one's liking.
Minute of a couple of hundred lbs of venison seems to work a treat in real world, where being theoretically able to hit a standard sized matchbox at a mile in optimal conditions gives a fuzzy warm feeling on forums in the dead of the night. And yes, there's a distinct difference between the two.
which rifle is it objectively inferior to? and what criteria is being used to objectively make this assertion?
.455_Hunter
Member
I'm keeping mine. Had it for quite a few years now.
It carries (muzzle forward over the shoulder) much better for blackjacks than the brand/type you never asked about in the first place.
And remember that Col. Jeff kept his Mini (one of only a few guns) until his passing and
he was not a fan of inaccurate guns.
View attachment 1132495
Same here. Mine shoots best with 50 gr. bullets and has been utterly reliable. Brass ejects at 4 o'clock about 6 ft. away.
JT
Very nice!
I have one of those extremely early production Series 180's too, with the 10/22 front sight and full M-14 style adjustable rear. They were essentially hand-built custom rifles that got "simplified" once sales took-off. Zero complaints about accuracy as long no mag dumps are occuring, which is fine by me. Zero functional failures.
I want a new one so I don't keep putting wear and tear on this spare parts challenged original.
Speedo66
Member
Nice M-14 style to your Mini.
A straight mag from CDNN, when they have them, would complete the look.
maxxhavoc
Member
I own one and enjoy it. Accuracy is not great, but I am slowly improving that. For me, it is much more fun to shoot, and works well for practicing prone/sitting standing in preparation for shooting a Garand/M14/whatever.
My ARs are more accurate, without a doubt.
My Ruger American Ranch .223 is more accurate, and lighter, than my ARs with similar optics.
As a result, I shoot 5.56/.223 in an AR very little. If I want to have fun, I'll bring the Mini. It will keep most of the shots in the black with irons, so it is OK for practice. If I want to shoot small groups, I'll bring a Remington 700 or RAR.
The only time I generally bring a .223 AR to the field is when I am shooting in a match of some type that restricts me to that combination. If I am shooting an AR I greatly prefer 9mm or 7.62x39.
My Mini has a higher round count than any of my ARs, I just enjoy it more. But if you want to accessorize, rebarrel, throw it in water, easily gunsmith, fight off an enemy invasion, shoot things smaller than 6 inches, look cool to younger shooters, equip a bayonet, or many other things it is not the best choice. I am in the lucky position of shooting for fun so I shoot the gun that is the most fun to shoot most of the time.
My ARs are more accurate, without a doubt.
My Ruger American Ranch .223 is more accurate, and lighter, than my ARs with similar optics.
As a result, I shoot 5.56/.223 in an AR very little. If I want to have fun, I'll bring the Mini. It will keep most of the shots in the black with irons, so it is OK for practice. If I want to shoot small groups, I'll bring a Remington 700 or RAR.
The only time I generally bring a .223 AR to the field is when I am shooting in a match of some type that restricts me to that combination. If I am shooting an AR I greatly prefer 9mm or 7.62x39.
My Mini has a higher round count than any of my ARs, I just enjoy it more. But if you want to accessorize, rebarrel, throw it in water, easily gunsmith, fight off an enemy invasion, shoot things smaller than 6 inches, look cool to younger shooters, equip a bayonet, or many other things it is not the best choice. I am in the lucky position of shooting for fun so I shoot the gun that is the most fun to shoot most of the time.
MachIVshooter
Member
What "broader picture" is there here?
Last I checked, opinions of the mini that were requested can only objective or subjective ones, and that's generally going to include some kind of baseline or curve for comparison. Again, I ask what other metric do we have besides different firearms that function in a similar way and/or role?
Hyperbole much?
One, I don't know the hunting regs in Finland, but many states here do not allow big game hunting with .223. The mini 30 is an acceptable woods carbine within the range limitations of the 7.62x39, but since you're bent on keeping the focus to ONLY mini 14s, I guess that's out, too.
Two, the unmodified mini 14 or ranch rifle is hard pressed to hit your matchbox consistently at 50 yards, much less the small vital zone of a varmint or predator at a few hundred. That's practical accuracy, not a theoretical extreme use case. The mini 14 is a notoriously inaccurate firearm; (Somewhat) accurate examples are the exception, not the rule.
Quit being sanctimonious and casting aspersions. Unless you have something substantive, I'm through debating you.
CoalTrain49
Member
Hard to say. Probably inferior in some way to many rifles.
As I read it the OP was asking owners about one rife with no indication of comparing it to any other rifle.I hope that I never have to ask any owners about a BAR MK 3 because someone will inevitably and immediately compare it to an AR-10.
Oh well. As I've went as far as specifically not even mentioning "14" anywhere throughout this thread, the threshold of utterly fruitless has been surpassed quite some time ago and, frankly, I'm somewhat relieved that you're through attempting to debate me.
As I'm currently killing time this very minute in a blind over a feeder with my Mini *30* in hand, waiting for a reasonably big buck to show up. This time I might include the rifle in the hopefully forthcoming trophy pic in "2023 hunting pictures" -thread in hunting section, just to see if that "14" you mentioned still applies...
.455_Hunter
Member
The standard Mini-14 definitely has advantage over the standard AR platform when it comes to minimizing protrusions and maximizing compactness.
MachIVshooter
Member
If that's the primary criteria for rifle selection, the Kel Tec RDB-C has it in spades over everything else on the market.
If you add good/classic looks to the equation, then the mini gains points. The RDB-C is decidedly ugly.
irishlad
Contributing Member
MachIVshooter,
I believe(my opinion) it's the comments I highlighted that cause certain replies. Folks probably consider them condescending or belittling of something we like and a put down. I find them amusing and entertaining ( that's why I like dry vs wet tumbling and Lee FCD threads). I don't know what some folks intent is, but I believe that's the impact of their posts. Like I said before, having a choice is great.
I believe(my opinion) it's the comments I highlighted that cause certain replies. Folks probably consider them condescending or belittling of something we like and a put down. I find them amusing and entertaining ( that's why I like dry vs wet tumbling and Lee FCD threads). I don't know what some folks intent is, but I believe that's the impact of their posts. Like I said before, having a choice is great.
.455_Hunter
Member
I like and own both the Mini-14 and the AR-platform. I like the Mini for when it's more appropriate to not look like a fugitive from Tactical Ted's Training Ranch. They both have their place, and their different characteristics appeal to different folks at different times. I personally am not a fan of the "AR-ized" Mini-14, with my preference solidly towards the classical styled examples. Stainless and composite solid stocks are fine.
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MachIVshooter
Member
No doubt.
I have my own preferences on certain things that aren't always 100% practical. Difference is, I'm not so emotionally invested in material things that I become indignant & defensive when someone points that out. As the example I already gave regarding my personal preference for the Marlin 1893 versus the modern 336; I'm not going to be offended if someone states a new 336 is stronger and more accurate, or mentions another levergun that is actually superior as being such. I can acknowledge the truth of those statements, but I still like the look, feel and nostalgia of the oldies, and I don't feel the need to defend my preference, nor will I insult the people who made statements of fact.
ECVMatt
Member
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2004
- Messages
- 2,870
I live in Ca, so it is a bastardized AR or a standard Mini/M1A type rifle for the masses. (It really is all about the looks!) As a result I have seven bastardized AR’s, 6 in 5.56 and 1 in 7.62x39.
I also have three Minis, an older SS ranch in a Ram-Line camo stock (remember those?) a blued older mini 30 with a wood stock and a new SS ranch in a synthetic stock.
For the past 15-odd years I was head rangemaster and armorer for the office where we had 70 mini’s issued in the field or assigned as stand by guns in 5 different office safes. I can honestly say I’ve had a wider exposure to a variety of different era minis than 99% of the people I have met (we had one wooden hand guard model, a very early polished stainless/wood stock mini, several shark-fin 180 models, dozens of 16” and 18” 580’s and 5 or 6 unissued, brand new 583-series in our inventory) I have fired several AC-556 13” and 18” full auto guns along with the mini-14 target model and a couple of customized mini’s as well. I have trained and qualified on minis dozens of times myself, and trained new and experienced mini shooters of various skill levels for years. In all the years only one mini had issues, and this was after it got tweaked in the gun rack after a pretty nasty vehicle collision. (Ruger fixed it.)
That being said, mini 14’s have some big pluses and big minuses just like every rifle out there.
Pluses: Simple manual of arms; the safety and mag release are ambidextrous, the action is easy to operate, it is easy to check for a loaded chamber, it is easy to clear in case of a jam. They are rugged, reliable (with OEM magazines!), weather resistant from -20 wind chill to 150 degree interior Crown Vic trunks, minimal lube, sand and grit don’t phase them much, they keep going. They are deputy-proof and will shoot minute of 9-ring on a B-27 to 200 yards if you do your part. (In my week-long patrol rifle instructor course I had to shoot my mini 14 out to 300 with open sights.) Plus, they look and handle like a “regular rifle” for folks who do not want the AR look or feel.
Minuses: They got very pricy to buy new, the factory 30-round mags are, IMHO, expensive and a bit less reliable than the very reliable 20’s (which are often 22 bucks or more each!). The action/barrels are not as accurate as average AR’s are and mini open sights are not as precise as AR sights. The mini ergonomics are “take it or leave it” as real customization is not easy. Magazine insertion is like the AK with a “rock and lock” motion; if you miss the pin the mag will fall out. Tough to insert a full mag on a closed bolt. Red dot or scope optic mounts are pretty much limited to factory scope rings, cheesy add-on picatinny mounts for red dots using the scope ring slots, side-action mounts or an aftermarket mount built into the hand guard. If you reload they can dent and fling brass all over like a field goal kicker. Mounting a gun light is not simple and the single point sling option is a PITA and usually involves drilling the stock to insert a mount.
(Full disclosure; I also oversaw the transition from the mini 14 to Colt AR 15 Enhanced patrol rifles in 2021. We swapped partially because our guns were aging, but primarily because most of our new hires were all trained previously on AR-15’s so the transition to our office became easier.)
I like the mini 14/30/6.8/.300BO for what it is; a very rugged, dependable rifle that can do duty as a home/ranch defense rifle, a truck-floor varmint getter, a deer/pig hunting gun, a trainer for newer shooters or a plinker for lazy afternoons of fun. I know it has several limitations, but I’m not a Camp Perry bullseye shooter anyway so I can live with what they can do.
If you want a mini 14, I say go for it. If you do, I’ll never say you made a bad purchase.
Stay safe.
This post pretty much sums up the whole discussion and is based on real-life experience with a very large sample of rifles. I think everyone here knows that RM is very honest in his reviews. He has no problem pointing out the bad, even when expecting the good (See Smith 14 Saga if you need an example). Even a gunsmith is not going to see the sheer volume of rifles or the rifles in actual use as RM has seen. He rationally points out both the good and the bad from real experience.
I think if someone who does not have a lot of experience with the Mini is considering one, this would be the response with the best information.
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oh, one note on the Mini-14 that I wasn't that thrilled about. I relaod a bit, but the ejected cases seem to get womped good by the charge handle, just the way the action works, and the handle catches the ejecting rounds as they come out and they get a nice ding in them. I guess there are solutions, but I haven't spent any time actually looking at them long enough to consider doing anything about it.
SundownRider
Member
I always wanted a Mini-14, so I bought one. Shot it, love it. 584 series rifle in 5.56
I like having it in stainless steel, which you can’t really get in an AR platform. At least not cheaply.
I like having it in stainless steel, which you can’t really get in an AR platform. At least not cheaply.
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